Time to move Stevie Franchise to the 2 and trade for a point gaurd

The prolbem is, on most of the nights Steve didn't get 9 assists or he wouldn't just average 6.5 assists.

The reasoning of "If ppl hit more shots than SF would have more assists" is actually quite redundant, don't you think that applies for every pg? Well, if those Cavs can hit more shots, maybe A.Miller could average 20 apg, maybe the Cavs would win the title last year? Maybe, maybe.

 

Point taken, but most of the assist leaders are on good shooting teams. The Rockets are one of the worst in the league. And look at it from his perspective, if no one is hitting well, and he's on fire, why shouldnt he try to score? He's got a better chance then anyone else. Right now, I dont think anyone in the league is playing better then Steve. And he is being bashed for not passing the ball when he generally doesnt have a solid good shooting center/PF to pass the ball to, its not like the Rocks have Shaq, Tim Duncan, or Karl Malone on the team.

 

You keep saying "move him to the 2, move him to the 2," yet you completely fail to aknowledge the consequences. If Steve is guarding bigger players, that's going increase the holes in our less than stellar defense. If Steve is guarded by 2's, he's obviously going to risk the possibility of getting hurt by stronger players. There's a reason Iverson is going to look like a mummy for the rest of his career. Now, if we trade our 2nd leading scorer, Mobley, for a "true" point guard, we risk the possibility of weakening our offense. My next point is the obvious, "If not Steve, then who" question. Don't just bring the "move him to the 2" bull crap without giving an idea of who we shoud trade for. It makes your argument sound more like whining than actual reasoning. If you'd take the time to think it out, you'd see that there isn't anybody available that would be affordable and could make an actual difference. Unless we bring in an elite PG like Kidd or Payton, things aren't gonna change. So, are you gonna keep whining, or are you gonna give us a feasible trade idea?

I have thought about it, and since I live in the real world, I can tell you that our best option at the PG is Steve Francis. It's no coincidence that Steve's assists went up when Griffin started hitting his shots. Just wait and see what Kenny, Rice, and Taylor will do when they are back at full speed. Also, imagine what will happen when Ming learns the offense and starts getting more minutes.

 

Oski2005:

Maybe I'm not so basketball savvy, can any basketball experts tell me why can't we bring in another tall point guard and put Steve against a pg offensively and defensively?

How about the three guard lineup the Rockets been running? Imagine Moochie being 4 inches taller and Francis playing the 2? I'd like to see Francis get some easy shots from a point guard, rather than him driving into the teeth of defense to score every time, talking about avoiding injuries.

You ask me to offer some trade proposals to justify my "whining", I don't have any right now, but in a realistic world a GM has more options than trades to upgrade a roster, there's also the draft and NBDL for that sake.

We also don't need a star to man the point, just someone who's tall, can set up his teammates and play solid defense. Ron Harper is tall enough but too old, I guess we'll need to wait and find.

The Rockets should keep an eye on tall point guards so Francis can play the 2 in the future. Is that a coincidence a taller Maddox was kept over TB?

 

leave Stevie alone...he is the Franchise and he will not be changing his GAME for anyone...until the time comes...he know it.

the bottom line is until he realizes the importance of teamwork, the team maturing into a cohesive, unselfish unit and a dedicated to defense mentality is honed...this team will continue to tease and frustrate all Rocket fans.

what Stevie is doing is normal for a budding superstar...do everything yourself..remember when MJ was averaging 37 ppg...i wonder how involved his teammates were...

hakeem was the same...

 

Dude, have you ever watched basketball before this season? Seriously. Steve Francis has been performing at an MVP level this year. What planet are you living on? And, really, don't you think that a "tall point guard" with skills *and* defense might be spoken for by now? What was that "realistic world" you were talking about? I am sure you can find a cross between Magic Johnson and Michael Cooper on any street corner, right? Carroll Dawson is supposed to find this in- what?- the NBDL? Give me a break.

 

I just think Francis can play better if his role is to concentrate on scoring. Francis is playing phenominally, and he'll bring more impact to the team if he's used at SG. How is saying that detracting to him? no need to get defensive.

If you watched basketball in recent years, you would know that a tall PG with skills and defense doesn't require a cross between Magic and Cooper to find. Does the name Ron Harper ring a bell? That type of player is what the Rockets need, and it's not unrealistic to find one in the future. So before it happens I think Francis will remain at the PG. Still, that's not very ideal for the Rockets. Francis is servicable at PG, he's just more suited at SG.

 

Ron Harper was a shooting guard in his 30's with powder for Knees. He was supposed to be the next Jordan, before injuries slowed him down. The only reason he became a PG was because Phil doesn't like the idea of small guards, tall guards work well with the triangle. Also, he was giving up the ball to Jordan/Pippen and Shaq/Kobe. Even then, he still never averaged more assists in a season than Francis.

There are only 2 tall PG in the league right now. Joe Johnson and Jamal Crawford. Johnson is a 2nd year player who has yet to prove anything. Crawford, hasn't played a full season and he's proving he's not a team player as he wants out of Chicago because Jay Williams is there. Instead of trying to win his job back, he's just causing trouble in practice and trying to get traded.

No tall PG's, so it won't work. There aren't any guys worth trying to get anywhere. Francis will come around, just wait for the team to get healthy.

 

The Rockets obviously are not going to trade for another point guard in the near future. Instead, what do you think about starting Moochie at point guard, and Steve at the 2? Then Mobley can be brought off the bench as instant offense (a la Vinny Johnson, the microwave), and Steve moved to the 1 when Mobley is in the game?

 

Alright, the biggest problem I have with moving Steve to shooting guard is that it would mean Mobley is gone or receiving significantly less minutes. I simply don't think we have the scoring power on this team to make up for Mobley not being in there. We were one of the three worst teams in the league last season as far as shooting. Mobley was our best outside shooter. Doesn't seem like a great idea to "get rid" of your best shooter and best scorer when you don't have anyone else to fill in for him and carry that load.

The other reason I don't like this redundant topic, is because we actually have to ACQUIRE a point guard first before we can even think about this. If you are saying, "yeah, we just need a PG like Payton, Kidd, or Miller and we'll be alright." Well, that's all well and good, but do you think players like that fall from the sky or something? Good luck finding that point guard. There's not a whole lot of them out there. In the meantime maybe you can find us a player like Tim Duncan down low, and come to think of it, we could use a Paul Pierce at the 3 spot.

I count three point guards that we could get that would even begin to justify us getting rid of our 20ppg scorer and moving Steve to the 2 spot. Those three are Kidd, Miller, and Nash. The others are either too old (Stockton, Payton), too much like Steve (Davis, Marbury, Terry), or just not good enough (Snow, Ward, Tinsley). As far as I know, none of those players are on the Block anyway. So, someone please tell me how we are going to get this All-World Point Guard on our already overstuffed roster? Until someone can tell me that, I think this whole "move Steve to 2-guard" business is just a waste of time.

 

Start Moochie Norris of course!

 

This is getting so old.

If any other player on this team, heck, this league puts up a 33/11/9 line, we'd be all over them. The guy is averaging 29/9/5. I'll take that from a player at any position. I will say that Steve was one of the reasons we lost. If he hadn't of missed the 3rd with foul trouble, we may not have been in such a big hole.

Payton is a badass, but he plays with guys that can shoot and that move without the ball. Francis plays with one-on-one players who thrive in the iso offense.

 

Eh..just be thankful that it ain't Matt "Baloney" Maloney out there playing the 1.

 

If Steve had players hitting 77% in the third quarter we'd all be saying how great a PG he is too...

 

You beat me to that point, but thank you for making it.

Folks Steve's ball distribution or even our offense period was not the reason we lost last night. As stated in other threads, our defense and the combination of the Sonics having an awsome outside shooting touch in the 3rd (a large part of which Steve was on the bench in foul trouble) caused the loss. Those who question Steve willingness to pass must not have seen the game or at least not the first half... the offense started out getting Griffin and others open looks, it wasn't until the second half that the Rox offense (primarily the 3rd) went south. An offense that is designed, by the way to get Steve and Cat more open looks from mid-range or to get to the basket. Why, because they are hands down the two best players and shooters on this team period, so they are going to take more shots people. It's not that hard to understand, a Jason Kidd or Andre Miller type of player would not work in our back court because the largest part of the offense is designed around getting them shots.

It is not a matter of the player fitting the position, it is a matter of whether or not the player fits the offensive scheme. Give the offense a chance to be run more consistantly and effeciently.

 

I'm just wondering but how is there any validity to the Steve couldn't go to the 2 for defensive purposes? Is Steve a midget and Cuttino Mobley is a 7 footer? Cat has maybe an inch on Steve and they're about the same as far as build, so I don't see how moving Steve to the 2 is a defensive downgrade. Cat is no better than Steve at the 2, so we lose nothing there. However, if we get a 1 who is a distributor/defender then we actually improve our defense by moving Steve to the 2.

I'm personally not in favor of moving Steve to the 2, because I would prefer to get a SG that just doesn't need to shoot as frequently has Cat and adds more in the way of defense and passing. However, that doesn't mean that I have any fear that our team would actually get worse by moving an equally bad defender to the 2 spot.

There could be a few good pure PG's coming out in the next 2 years that aren't score first type PG's. Duhon comes to mind, he is very much an Andre Miller type with an outside shot. However, there is absolutely nothing we can do right now. We might as well wait around and hope that this team gels. We have several guys that need to learn their teammates and we are still in the process of learning a new offense.

 

Steve Francis could learn to play the way Payton played and we would be a much better team.

Forget arguing, hating etc. The truth is Payton played a dominating game, he was the center of the offense, he made great decisions executing their offense, he involved his team in the flow getting them wide open looks, he passed well and scored in the flow and at the center of the offense.

Everything ran through Payton and he won the game for the Sonics.

Steve is just as good a talent.

Time will tell if he will become the player Payton is.

I hope he improves because I am not interested in him becoming a MVP if we never win another championship while he is a Rocket.

John Lucas should have never written MVP on the paper he showed Francis.

It should of said "Ring"

 

Payton didn't average over 7 assists a game until he was 26. He didn't average over 8 a game until he was 29. I think Payton is a prime example of how Steve could develop. The difference is, however, that Seattle has never had a shootfirst SG. Payton didn't have to compete with another gaurd for shots and he knew he was the man. Steve has to compete with Cat for shots and Cat is also a subpar passer, even for a SG. This is what the issue is. I have no doubt that Steve could be as good as Payton in his prime (obviously they have different strengths, but as far as value to a team), but the Cat situation is causing problems. Seattle's team was well suited for the way Payton played. Our team is not well suited for Steve. I think EG and Ming will fit in with Steve because they are big men who can shoot and add some defensive/rebounding help, but Cat is defnitely looking like the redundant scorer with no defense or team oriented intangibles.

 

How come after every game, those Steve & Cuttino bashers start filling up the forum?

Last night, Steve outplayed GP in almost every statistical category except assists.

Stats for last night :

GP:
he shot 33% for the game, had 7 rebounds, a turnover, a steal, the 18 assists, and scored 20 points.

SF:
shot over 54% for the game, had 11 rebounds, 5 to's, 9 assists, and scored 33 points.

and if you compare the stats with role players on each team, the rockets were clearly outplayed.

besides Steve, Cuttino and Eddie, no one else scored in double figures,
on the Sonics side: GPayton, RLewis, DMason, RADMANOVIC, JJames, and BRENT BARRY all scored in double figures...

that was your game right there, those guys stepped up and our role players didn't ... that's why we lost the game.