I am of the opinion if (right now I am for trading neither) we trade Steve or Cat to unlease the Yao show it should be Steve traded because 1) Steve would command among the highest price in the league (get someone like Brand, J Oneal, plus more), and 2) if the whole purpose is to bring a traditional PG it is not a sure thing Steve will be that much better of a 2 guard than Cat. For one Cat's career shooting is virtually identical to Steve's--suggesting in a secondary shooting role there is not a great difference in their effectiveness. Further, Cat is taller, longer and can match up defensively much better than Steve if the latter is forced in the 2 spot, cancelling out the net gain of much of Steve's potential offensive advantages even if the previous point doesn't hold true (if Steve in fact is a substantively better offensive two guard than Cat).
This might be true if it ever happened. The best, most effective history according to who? When have you seen us run a three guard offense or even just Moochie with Steve and see Steve tear someone up? Never.
Thats what I was getting at. Bibby allows the motion offense to run smoothly by not trying to run the offense. Thats all I want to see Francis do. Give the ball up early and let his teammates create their own opportunities to pass and score. you know during the begininng of the game there is possessions where there is some motion and the ball is pass around multiple times, and Im like whoa this is fun to watch, but mixed in there is possessions where we go away from that and Francis holds on to the ball and dribbles and takes control of the possessions, and that style catches on and the offense gets in a funk again, and by the fourth were back to that bad brand of basketball where its one on one or one pass and out. So there is signs this team is making progress but there is still too many times when old habits seem to creep back in and take over. Whoa DoD, man its kinda hard to believe that the Rockets equal the Spurs in offensive efficiency. The offense talent on the two teams is not even comparable. The Spurs have some brutal looking offensive players. With the talent we have we should be smoking them in offensive output. thanks for pulling up those stats.
We need a true PG. Since boykins got to GS. Their team has changed for the better. Thats what we need. Trade mobley for jason williams
Two years ago this team won 45 with nothing, yet the three guard line-up was jake. This year's team has so much more talent but without the same killer line-up match up that helped that team over achieve, and still go home in April.
One thing I don't get. If people are saying that Mobley is such a ballhog, what would moving Francis to SG do? A bigger ballhog? The only difference seems to me is that Francis is maybe a more talented scorer than Mobley. That's it. You are not going to change anything much. If Francis is dominating the ball too much, and losing the ball too much into turnovers now, he would do the same even if you moved him to the 2. Look at Kobe, if you want to see a ballhog. Look at Iverson. They are shooting guards. What does it matter? Also, many suggested if we can't have a true point guard, get Odom as a "point forward." But if the "point" doesn't have to come from a guard, why do we need a point forward when we already have a point center? I think heypartner has a good point that you don't need a point (good pun!) for a motion offense.
Mo was out due to long term injury all last season. While the "wasted one" was gone, our tallest or "highest" five, Eddie Griffen, has now become the starter. This was just to make the point that sometimes promotion happens from within, without a trade. Cryptic, Doc, but could you lay down some ideas as to how that could happen at the one? Moochie is another street-baller. You were really high on Maddox this summer- are you still?
Damn, this is just beautiful. This is just getting down to the root, to what it's all about. Thanks HP. I agree that Steve is not an will probably never be a 'pure' pg. But I'm not convinced that a Jason Kidd or Stockton is what this team will need to win long-term. I think we're going to start running the offense a lot through our amazing new big man. I'm not saying we're going to mimic the Kings, but I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up with a system like theirs in which no true pure pg is necessary but several good passers, as HP already explained above. I think we can and will be very, very successful with the present cast. A more heady guy dominating the ball will give us fewer turnovers right now in the short term, but I don't think it's the final answer. I just have faith that Steve will continue to learn- not necessarily learn to be a great floor general with amazing court vision, but learn to stop doing the stupid s*** and start doing more of the things that puts your team in a position to win. I think he and Cat can both do it, although they might be 28 or 30 when it happens (the time it often happened for many others.)
So, Nolen, why didn't you quote the Lauren Anderson/Ballet bit. Are you an opera snob or sumpin?? just to show my love for homegrown talent... <blockquote><hr>Hailed by The New York Times as one of “the spellbinding young stars of Houston Ballet,” native Houstonian Lauren Anderson trained exclusively at Houston Ballet Academy from the age of seven. She joined Houston Ballet in 1983 and in 1990 became the first African-American to be promoted to principal dancer.<hr></blockquote> Lauren sucks!!! How can Odette/Odile be black, strong and athletic??? (True comments.) What is Coach Stevenson thinking??!!! We need a new Principal!!!
I'm trying to figure this out, for the last 2 years people talk about how we have a great backcourt, one of the best in the NBA, but we just need big men to balance things out. That's why everybody was ticked off at Cato, because a motivated Cato anchors the center position. That's why people wanted Mo to do well, because he anchors the PF spot. That's why everybody was excited about last year's team, Hakeem's great at the end of the year in route to 45 wins showed this team just needed a good big man to balance out the guard play. So we finally get hte big men, Griffin is considered a very good young PF who is still growing but gives us what we need, rebounding and shot-blocking. We get the next great center, we get everything we need, and now people want to dismantle the same backcourt that needed the frontcourt help and start over again and rebuild the team around Yao. We have one of the Top 2 or 3 backcourts in the NBA and people want to dismantle it and start all over because Yao Ming is showing signs of dominating. What am I missing here? We have a great backcourt that needs frontcourt help. We have a great big man who needs a strong backcourt, that was shown in International games when the Chinese backcourt suck. Instead people want to break up the backcourt after a 21-15 start to the season!?
Nice one Doc Rocket. He's talking about Rice being out for the year, and Posey (No 55) getting big time minutes.
People are starting to believe, as am I, that if we keep our current backcourt, we'll keep seeing stupidity. Stupid drives to the basket through heavy traffic, stupid drives into traffic, with a desperation pass to a teammate's ankles with the clock ticking down. Folks are tired of seeing professional streetball. We're getting tired of hoping that our backcourt will develop brains. We see the others on our team playing ball the right way . . . passing, defending, rebounding as a team. It is obvious that the Rockets are capable of competing at a high level if they just pass the ball to Yao and Griffin (who has come a long way in the last 3 weeks). However, we continue to struggle against bad teams, in large part because our backcourt thinks that weak teams can be beaten easily, so they can hoist up horrible shots. Our frontcourt never gets involved in those games.
I agree with some of what you said here. I would like to see Stevie getting the outlet pass from Yao's rebound and breaking rather than Stevie rebounding and running up the floor. I'd like to see his assists climb, his TO's drop, and maybe his rebounds be shaved in favor of Yao, Eddie and Cato picking up some more boards. It might even make the defensive interior less cluttered so that those 3 can be even more effective defensively. All that said, I simply do not believe Stevie is a 2 guard. Is he a true 1? Well, maybe not. But he is still improving. He had 2 or 3 sensational pass plays tonight which resulted in dunks for Kelvin, Yao, and somebody else. There are 2 things that Stevie needs to do to be the #1 most intimidating, most threatening, top point guard in this league and probable MVP. 1- Stevie needs to do what MJ finally learned to do in about his 5 season. Stevie needs to trust his teammates and work to keep their head in the game. He needs to start the game trying to get all of his teammates off. Because Stevie is going to get his, period. He's just too good. If he gets his teammates off, he is still going to get the ball in crunch time. The difference will be that his teammates will be working their butts off to either get open for a good shot or to set a pick so that Stevie can get off a great look or make a good pass for a great shot for someone else instead of recklessly driving the lane against those 4 defenders who are going to collapse on him because they know he doesn't trust his teammates enough to distribute properly. 2- Stevie has to lead defensively. If you noticed tonight's game was a prime example. J.R. Bremer lit us up all night. Finally, with about 5 minutes left, Stevie starts bodying up on him. Bremer can't hang with Francis but he almost killed us tonight because Stevie was doing I don't now what defensively for 3 1/2 quarters. If Stevie would have started bodying up on him after J.R. hit those 3 first half treys, this game would have been a blowout. Bremer would have broken down, gotten tired, and then his jumper would be gone. MJ always took it upon himself to shut down the hot shooter. If someone got on a roll, you could count on MJ and God forbid I say his name to start getting in their JOCK. Does anybody remember The Glove? Payton controls games with his D, turning his D into O. Consider this Doc. There is no point guard in the league that can defend Steve, including Payton who is the best defender of all the PG's. And Steve can physically dominate 95% of the pg's in this league, save maybe Payton, Davis, and Kidd. What I mean by physically dominate is he is bigger, stronger, and has more stamina. He can wear them out, run them out of gas, post them up, dunk on them, etc. Defensively, if he wanted to he can dominate because he has the physical tools (i.e. strength and stamina) and the basketball gifts (quickness, leaping ability) to run them all down. I say, in another year or two, it may be happening right now, Stevie will learn these two things, with the help of Yao, and the Rockets are going to dominate. All Steve has to do is start dogging players like Gary Payton and he will wear down their effectiveness and their stats. We've got the aces in the hole at the bucket now. Yao, Eddie, and Cato are great defensively in the paint. Let them do their thing and Steve, Cat, Posey, and Hawkins concentrate on pressure, pressure, pressure. I think Friday's game will be very interesting to see how we match up with Kobe and Fox. Will Rudy put Posey on Kobe and Cat on Fox????????? (I hope so because Cat can't guard a paper sack with lead in it) Will Hawkins get some serious minutes with Posey guarding those two? Will Rudy let Yao play high post on Shaq and maybe get some 17 foot jumpers going in Shaq's grill forcing Shaq out further away from the basket? Will Rudy turn Eddie loose on Horry, Madsen, or Samake or whatever other no name 4 the Lakers throw out there? Will Stevie D up on Fisher and drive him crazy? Will Rudy let Yao front Shaq with Eddie helping from behind forcing the Lakers to throw over the top of Yao to get the ball into Shaq? Can Yao handle the elbows from Shaq to the kidneys? Can Yao handle the famous SHaq go to move, that is to say the Mike Alstott bull rush from the bottom of the circle? Shaq Fu. Sounds Chinese doesn't it?
Blah Just because Doc has some inside info doesn't mean he's an expert. Maybe if Rudy would actually coach Steve, Steve would become the great POINT guard he can be instead of the best GUARD he can be. Look at the improvement Stephon is making this year. I don't see why Steve can't be even better. How were those 9 assists tonight? It's a trust issue. "Steve actually can’t dribble that well, shoot that well, post up a player (BOYKINS!!!), run a break that well, or finish that well when you actually think about it. Granted, he is an above average finisher. " Can't dribble that well? Are you crazy? Shooting? What? Finish well...oh he is an "above average finisher"...yeah and Miller is such a GREAT finisher. People need to stop posting stupid crap after we play ****ty games. I don't care how talented players are if they continue to make the same stupid mistakes repeatedly. However, if Rudy is susch a great coach why can't he not only point out what Steve has been doing wrong and make sure he does it right. Steve wants to win and maybe he thinks he has to do it all. Maybe he really is concerned with how many points he gets, but time and time again it has been documented Steve really cares about winning. It's hard for him to realize the offense needs to run through Yao, and that he is supposed to pass first and look for his shot later. Rudy needs to stop being so gentle and just be honest and blunt.
Geez. Mr. Know-it-all over here. There is no possible way you could be familiar enough with Nachbar's game to comment on it so matter-of-factly. The main reason Rudy like Nachbar was because of his ability to run the floor, not because he was a sharpshooter. As for the Steve thing, I think everybody and their Grandmother knows he's not a true point guard, so I don't really see the point in bringing it up again. Nor do I understand why this thread got so many responses to such an overdone topic. I think a more constructive post would be legitimate trade ideas (not dreamcasting) to how you would resolve the situation. Getting Brent Barry or Lamar Odom is not going to all the sudden make the Rockets into <i>Showtime</i>. Odom probably has has the worst assist/turnover ratio in the league over the past four years....I thought we wanted to cutdown turnovers. Also, sometimes watching a Seattle game, I forget Brent Barry is even playing. He disappears all the time. While he's a solid player, he's not a huge difference maker by any stretch of the imagination. He just isn't aggresive enough. Now, as for trading Steve for a so-called "true point guard", throw out some names! If you look, there's just not that many good true point guards in the league. Andre Miller is probably just about the best example of one, and yet the guy never seems to make his team improve one iota. I just think this whole notion that a "true point guard" will automatically bring wins isn't exactly true, as Mr. Miller has proven. I mean you can complain all you want, but until someone can propose a legitimate trade idea as a better option, I don't really see the point.
Just because you don't think they're legitimate, doesn't mean they aren't. Just wanted to point out the difference between opinion and fact.
