This team could very well rebound next year in a weak division with a few additions to the lineup. No sense in trading away your best assets; you build around them.
I posted this in the other thread, but it makes some sense here. This year is starting to remind me a lot of 2000... except that we may not be that as far off. The 2000 team featured a hurt Alou, an MVP Bagwell, a hurt Biggio, a hurt Wagner, a sorry-ass Lima, and a bunch of young guys who got a full chance only after we fell out of contention (Berkman, Lugo, Truby). 2001 featured Berkman coming into his own (as Pence may do), featured a pitching callup named Roy Oswalt (Patton could serve as that), had a return to form from one of their best hitters in Alou (Lance could serve as that), and simply jelled at the right time. There are positives... hell, this season is far from done. If Lance can pick it up, while Pence keeps it rolling, they do have a very good shot at looking solid over a prolonged stretch.
there is no fireSALE if the astros are not willing to give oswalt lee, or berkman....nobody wants the rest of the trash. pence too
What are you talking about? The board loves Adam Everett even though he can't hit because his stellar defense saves us more games than any closer in history! He's got MVP written all over him. Yet no golden glove. I never understood the affection people have towards him here. Even if he gave up 10 extra errors a year, the odds are less than 1/2 would score a run. Therefore, i would rather have a SS that could at least hit for average even if he's only an average defender.
I'd say the No. 1 sign that a post lacks credibility is when it mentions the Gold Glove in any context that implies it has even the slightest shred of relevance to the quality of defense a player plays. It's completely, utterly meaningless.
No, I'm not. In most years, Derek Jeter is one of the bottom five or so shortstops in the game (defensively, of course), and he consistently wins the award. It's not that he's not excellent. He's not even good. In most years, he's not even average. He's flat-out bad. It's an award based completely on name recognition and highlight plays, without any relevance to how effective a player is defensively on a day-to-day basis.
Am c'mon. He only made 1 error in those 28 games he played at first base that year. He will be the only player in history to win a gold glove and be named outstanding DH in the same year.
It's not meaningless because people like you insist Adam Everrett deserves a spot in the lineup because his defense helps us win and that makes up for his bat. Funny, i don't see us winning. Maybe you haven't been a fan long, but some of the best teams we've had since the 90's that we're actually favored to go to the WS had some holes in the defense. We could call up any SS from the minors to fill Adam's role and produce the same numbers. We need hitting and he should be benched if not sent down to the minors to work on it. If we can't replace him via call up or acquisition, then put Loretta there everyday. Tell me that wouldn't help the lineup and would be utterly meaningless.
Why do they have to be unproven commodities? It is just as likely for a super spect like Alex Gordon to flop than for Oswalt to tear his arm up and be damaged goods. Someone mentioned we can make a few minor moves, fill some pieces and MAY compete in a weak NL Central. I will agree with this, but that is MAYBE, and the window of that maybe is only 3 or 4 years. Another person mentioned that the Marlins are a good example of blowing it up and now they have some great young talent, and if it was anyone but the Marlins Ownershp they have something to look forward to for a decade. The better example I think though, is that of the Cleveland Indians, they were a middle of the road team, if they got a few lucky bounces, or got hot they could have made a post-season run, but ownership backed with management and they told the city it was rebuild time and we will be a winner in a few years. Now their design took a little longer than what they wanted, but look at all that young talent; Martinez, Hafner, Sizemore, Peralta, Sabathia. That is an amazing young core, and I REALLY think that is the direction Stros need to go in. We as fans should suck it up, realize our team now has peaked a few years back, and restock, and we should support the youngsters. Just for giggles, would the Yankees trade Robinson Cano, Phillip Hughes, and a few spects for Oswalt and Loretta? Maybe or Maybe not, but they would be tempted, and those 2 ARE proven commodities. The time is NOW to rebuild the young core.
Funny, I don't see the Cardinals winning either. Maybe they should bench Albert Pujols, because clearly, there's a direct correlation between one hitter and how much a team wins.
And the team that actually went to the WS was the team with solid pitching and defense and JUST enough offense. Everett was on that team...Everett was on the team that recorded the franchise's first postseason series win, Everett was on the team that went to the franchise's first NLCS and Everett was on the team that went to the club's first WS. And those 90's teams with solid offense...one and done.
I hate to rehash the whole Everett's defensive value arguement, but it goes way beyond the number of errors he commits. It's about his range and the extra plays that he makes. Here's a brief quote from the study by Baseball THink Factory http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org...2006_national_league_gold_gloves_as_i_see_it/ If Ozzie Smith was as good as Adam Everett, he was incredible. Everett is on the verge of saving hte most runs on defense over the last 20 years. He’s truly incredible at outpacing his peers. First LastName TEAM GP INN RSpt RS/150 Adam Everett Hou 149 1292.3 27 28 Omar Vizquel SF 152 1281.3 11 12 Jose Reyes NYM 149 1320.3 10 10 He's saved more than twice as many runs than his nearest competitor.
First, I don't think the Marlins are a good example...if I recall they blew up the team not once, but twice, due to financial reasons. They also blew up their team AFTER winning the championship. They did it twice and just happened to strike gold twice. I don't know if the Indians are a good example either...how many times have they made it to the postseason this decade? Now let's look at the Astros... they've been to the playoffs 6 times in the last 10 years...been to the NLCS 2 times in the past 3...and have a WS appearance. And they didn't need to rebuild... they built around their core players, whether it was Biggio and Bagwell or Oswalt and Berkman. Really is this team that far off...just a little more production from the corners and we'd probably be much better.
I too don't like the Marlins example. Also, the argument about how many post-seasons have they made I don't think is a good one. I think a good example is taking at the 5 years PREVIOUS to their rebuild which they did following the 2001 season. In 2001 they actually MADE the playoffs then lost in the 1st round In 2000 they missed the playoffs In 1999 they made the playoffs and lost to the Red Sox in the 1st round after being up 2-0 In 1998 they lost to the Yankees in the ALCS In 1997 they lost to the Marlins in the World Series (5 yrs before Indians Rebuild) 01 Lost DCS 00 2nd in Reg Season 99 Lost DCS 98 Lost ALCS 97 Lost WS (5 yrs before Astros Rebuild not counting 07) 06 2nd in Reg Season 05 Lost in WS 04 Lost in NLCS 03 2nd in Reg Season 02 2nd in Reg season Frankly it is quite obvious the Indians had better results leading up to their 5 seasons before the rebuilding. Also the key trade in the rebuilding was dealing their THEN ace Bartolo Colon for Grady Sizemore, Brandon Phillips, and Cliff Lee. One of the best CFs in the game in Sizemore, A good young Pitcher, and a good young 2B who is now with the Reds. The thing is the Astros have THREE assests that would yield you at least 1.5 good players in the future. So at that rate we are looking at a decade of AT LEAST 3-4 good players. I don't see why this isn't a viable option and is replied to with such flame. 5
