I am not saying I am better than you. I am merely saying that society and you as well need to keep struggling against being bigoted against gay people.
JERRY: I think he's gonna need, mouth-to-mouth resuscitation. NEWMAN: Mouth-to-mouth? JERRY: Yeah. NEWMAN: Huh. JERRY: Well? Go ahead. NEWMAN: You go. JERRY: You knocked him out. NEWMAN: Yeah, but you pulled him in. JERRY: Come on Newman. Do it. NEWMAN: Nah. JERRY: He might die. NEWMAN: Yeah. Maybe.
Agreed, the real victims are all the closet haters and well mannered homophobes. Thanks a lot Hardaway!!
My problem is that people are trying to act as if they're better than me because I don't like gays while they accept them, like it's cool to accept gays. Now people around here want to blast me for not joining the crowd. Either way I'm a sinner. Had I lied and said I accept gays, I won't be any better off in the eyes of the only one who matters. I'm not trying to justify my bigotry. It's all wrong. But I do realize that not one of you here is better than me and I'm not better than anyone else here.
I'm coming way late to this thread.. Tim Hardaway is entitled to his opinions even if that means hating homosexuals. The only thing that really bothers me about his statements is the part about distancing himself from a gay teammate and demanding the guy get traded. Look you're getting paid millions of dollars, or were, to play basketball. Be a professional about it. Is someone being gay going to change how they play on the basketball court? Did anyone suspect that John Ameachi was gay based on how he played? What you do in your private life or who you associate with is your business but its totally unprofessional to be dragging your own bigotries into your job.
Interesting and I see what you are saying. However, it has gotten to the point where every time you pick up a newspaper or turn on the TV, you hear something about gays. I would not be surprised at all that a gay channel will be available on TV soon. I think some people are just tired of hearing about this. They probably feel there's no use in talking about it because people like you are going to hammer them for their opinion. I mean I am never going to change my view that homosexual behavior is not normal and I know I will never change your view that it is okay. It's like smoking, giff. I don't want to be around it because it makes me physically sick. My sister and brother-in-law smoke and they know not to smoke around me. They chose to do something (in smoking) - it is part of their lifestyle. I don't approve of this and they know that. As I stated earlier, I could care less what someone does in their private life, but I don't want to hear about their lifestyle. Better yet - it is like being around someone that is loud or obnoxious. You probably aren't going to stick around someone like that for long, are you? Well, someone who doesn't really care to know about the "in"s and "out"s of the gay lifestyle would feel the same way. And why would I discuss my heterosexual lifestyle in public? That lifestyle is normal and the majority lifestyle that is lived. There's nothing special about it, so I don't get your argument there. And what the hell does that mean?? Are you implying that age-old assumption that someone who doesn't think that homosexual behavior is right does so because they are afraid they are going to be homosexual someday. Last time I checked, I don't get an erection when I see another man. And last time I checked, I still enjoy having vaginal intercourse with my wife. Sorry to strike a nerve with you dude, but I expected a reactionary post like this. And I still fail to see how 10 to 20% (estimating here) of the world living the gay lifestyle would be considered "normal". That means 80 to 90% of the heterosexual world would not be "normal". So, in your world, less is actually more...you must live in a bizarro world then.
It's not motivation, it's doing the right thing. I have a choice of whether to save a life or not, so I'll do it.
I'm still reading through this thread but I had to address this: I'm a straight male and I do a sport called Judo. For those who aren't familiar Judo involves grappling, very close contact. Some of the moves if taken out of contact could be perceived as highly sexual, watch two fighters get in the guard on UFC. I've competed against and worked out with other men who are openly gay and I along with everyone I have done Judo with have never shown discomfort regarding being in close contact with a homosexual male. If you can't stop thinking about things in a sexual manner then you have far bigger problems than just homophobia.
Just like you said...It's about doing the right thing. Why do you get to choose when the situation is appropriate to do the right thing? No one here has said "you should like gays because it's the coolest thing to do!" I think we're all basically saying that since you've admitted that this is your sin, why can't you DO THE RIGHT THING which would be to accept everyone as equal regardless of, well, anything, unless they harmed you in some way? Why not try to fix your faults? Isn't that what Jesus would want you to do?
No, I'm stating that your eager discussions of your sh_t and your sex life with your wife (including extremely intimate details), are a little less than normal.
I see where you are coming from; however, I am hardly the only person on this board who does this. One poster in particular (a Feb '99 guy) seems to always be talking about that subject. The posts about **** were merely jokes - nothing to take serious, especially on a message board where many people seem to enjoy talking about that stuff. I have realized that I probably delved too much into my personal life from time to time, but I guess I do it because most people here don't know what I look like. There's a thread in the Hangout called "What Have You Learned From Clutchfans" and one person said that he learned that people can talk about all kinds of things personal to complete strangers. Well, it is because people here for the most part are faceless and for some (including myself) that gives them more comfort to talk about things that they wouldn't normally talk about in a face to face conversation. But I like to think that I have cooled it for the most part about the bedroom details between me and the mrs.
Manny, I don't think you do see where I'm coming from. My point is that many people would not consider your behavior normal. But you know what, it doesn't hurt anyone. You don't deserve to be ostracized for it, just because most people wouldn't do it. Homosexual behavior is not "normal" in the sense that most people are heterosexual. However, two consenting adults of the same sex having sex also hurts no one. In fact, it benefits two people who receive sexual gratification and companionship. They don't deserve to be ostracized because their sexual orientation is out of the norm.
OK I've gotten through reading this thread, of course when I should be doing something more productive. Frankly a lot of the posts I've read here really piss me off and I'm doing my best to maintain an even keel. What bothers me about this debate is how people who are normally very tolerent still cannot get over their bigotry regarding homosexuality. I don't deny that it makes a lot of people uneasy, heck I feel uneasy seeing two guys kissing, but a lot of things make people feel uneasy. What we need to get over is differentiating between uneasiness and harm. There is nothing harmful about homosexuals anymore than there is a harm from heterosexuals. Just because homosexuality isn't what is practiced by the majority doesn't qualify it as a harmful practice or one that is exploitive or degrading. Too many people though lump homosexuality with things like pedophilia, bestiality or harbor the belief that homosexuals cannot control their sexual urges. What people fail to grasp is that pedophilia and bestiality are behaviors where in consent isn't granted, or one party is incapable of granting, and is by nature exploitive. Adult homosexuals though are as capable of granting consent as adult heterosexuals. While there might be homosexuals who are pedophiles there are also plenty of heterosexuals who are too. To equate homosexuality with those behaviors is flat out ignorant. The only reason why people lump homosexuality with those behaviors is because it isn't what is normal and practiced by the [/i]majority[/i]. WTF is normal and WTF is the majority so sacrosanct? According to the ratings a majority of Americans like American Idol and American males like to drink Miller Lite. Well I can't stand American Idol I think it is shallow, callous and a sign of a degenerate society that is too enamored with an extremely limited view of stardom. I don't drink Miller Lite. I think it is a tepid least common denominator product that in a sane world would never be considered beer. If that liking American Idol and drinking Miller Lite is normal then I am a social deviant who practices out of choice to not engage in what is considered normal behavior for our society. Does that make me a threat to society not at all and thankfully for me that sort of deviancy isn't discriminated against. Yet in regards to preference in sexual partners though apparently the majority preference is the correct and those who don't agree are sick. Why should loving someone of the same gender both emotionally and physically be any different than choosing to drink something other than Miller Lite? If two individuals are adults, respectful and consenting such behavior is no more threatening than ones choice of beverage.
i find the whole thing hilarious...... 50 years ago ppl were saying the same thing about black ppl, about interacial marriages etc.... stereotyping homosexuals is the same thing as stereotyping race and ethnicity "blacks are lazy, stupid, and always looking for a handout... " i can't wait to hear what barkley et al has to say about it tonight on TNT, isn't his wife white?
To quote Willie Nelson: "I may not be normal, but nobody is." I also find it interesting that people focus on the sex angle, rather than the love angle. For me,. that fuzzy "love" feeling for women was actually pretty well developed even when I was really small. I remember falling asleeep at night as a four year old, in that lovely little twilight time in between day and night, wake and sleep, thinking about my nursery school crush. This was way before sexual urges were at all mature, or even crossed my mind in any sort of notable way. I just can not imagine hating someone because, in that little twilight time, they dream about Greg instead of Donna. It's just so mean and seems to reflect such a cold and cynical view of human beings, and how wonderful love is - that you would tell someone to get treatment or condemn them to hell because of who they love. It just, to me, seems cruel and hateful.
