This is more fun than watching a bunch of mindless 3 pointers

maga!

 

Context isn’t needed. You said look at the shot charts to see we shoot more midrange now than the MDA years. I provided the number of mid range shots per game now and while MDA was here. Almost no difference.

 

There NEVER was a strict mandate against mid range shots. There was a mandate against low efficiency shots. Different players have different abilities. For some a midrange shot is very low efficiency and for others they are not.

It’s why even when there was a “mandate against midrange” we shot them MORE(CP3 the midrange master) than we do this year when we supposedly have the mandate to shoot any shot your heart desires.

 

Context is always needed because some sites will count paint shots as non-mid range while counting all non-paint shots as mid range. this is a mistake as it would count a floater as a non-mid range shot when of course it is.

Also, just the idea that Rockets don't have a different philosophy is just wrong. When your commentator says after every mid range shot "They are going to talk about that..."

https://www.si.com/nba/2018/05/01/houston-rockets-nba-playoffs-james-harden-chris-paul-mike-dantoni

A great article on MDA philosophy. He didn't believe you even set up anything for mid-range shots while Silas is explicitly working on it.

So this is just contrary to the notion that MDA didn't mind mid range shots when players have to make up excuses as to why they took one.

 

I used NBA.com where they count shots by actual physical distance, not area.

Mandate, philosophy.....whatever. Your claim that I responded to directly was that we shoot more mid range NOW then we did then. This is not an accurate claim. Whether in the past if there was literal mandate that your pay would be docked if you shot a midrange shot and now you get a pay increase from taking mid range shots the bottom line fact is we took MORE midrange in a couple MDA years than we do currently.

If you have the data to make me see things a different way I’m more than happy to look at it. I love the facts. If you have them, I want them.

And I can guarantee you that during film sessions when a CP3 midrange jumper was put up, they weren’t marking them with red Xs and asking for explanations. They smiled as he knocked down another one.

 

3s, scoring in the paint, and free throws are a great base offense that has been replicated across the league. But the results are the results with MDA, Morey, and Harden, close but no cigar. I believe we could have beaten GSW when we were up.

 

Actually if you take the average from 4 years you'll see it's the same, not more or less, but we are going on 4 years vs 18 games. I think they'll continue to shoot more mid range because the offense is simply different and the philosophy is no doubt different.

Also from NBA.com and for mid-range I get...

16/17 - 7.1
17/18 - 6.9
18/19 - 4.8
19/20 - 5.5
---
20/21 - 6.7

This is not counting paint no RA shots. (Which I'd argue are mid range shots...but it's arguable)
https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/shooting/?sort=5-9 ft. FGA&dir=1&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular Season&DistanceRange=By Zone

So ummm...these numbers would make my statement accurate...

Right, MDA explicitly said CP3 was the EXCEPTION...but that still means that other players could not take them. Do you think it's a coincidence our offense thrived with CP3? That it was just because how good of a player he was or that maybe the variety of his game helped his offense and helped the offense in general?

 

It was, but you can't just wave away everything else that led to it.

Harden and Morey also share the blame.

 

Man that is some special mental gymnastics and goal post shifting.

In the post that I replied to did it say “we are taking more mid range jumpers than over the 4 year average with MDA”?

No.

It said take a look at the shot chart and you will see we take more mid ranges jumpers now than MDA years. Years 1 and 2 of MDA years we took more mid range jumpers than we do right now.

Did you say, we may not be shooting as much midrange currently, but I believe we will in the future? Which I’m not sure how that would be any more than a guess, but whatever.

No.

Groundbreaking. Awesome offensive players, doing what they are good at, help your team be awesome. Players doing what they aren’t good at, does the opposite. Chris Paul is one of the best offensive players of all time. Him being himself helped us be awesome. It just so happens he like a small handful of other players are really good at mid range jumpers. Diversity helps when you are good at being diverse, diversity for diversity sake does nothing.

 

It's just weird that Harden has shot 86% on 7500 career free throws and refuses to use half the floor for mid range.

 

Yes it does. Bro read what he wrote. He said exactly what Im saying. You want to stay away from the mid range except in the clutch. That is what I have been saying and it is what Silas said. I also said I want players who are good at mid range to be able to take those shots. Cmon, this is ridiculous.

We took mid range shots here??? Chris Paul took them, Westbrook took them(to the detriment of our own team). What are you talking about? It doesnt directly contradict my argument at all. It supports my argument. He said we generally like to stay away from the mid range except in the 4th(generally clutch time) when you need a bucket. That is what I have been saying.

We still have a lot of iso though? What. We isolated also because it was efficient offense with us with James Harden one of the best Iso player ever(and possibly the best).

We have Christian Woods and Demarcus cousins on the roster. Of course we are going to have more off screen plays.

No, these stats show Dantoni's first year in 2016-2017. They are almost identical lolol.

And we changed to more iso as things went a long and it was for a reason. I will explain in 2017-2018, teams started switching the pick and roll alot, so we couldnt use it. Thats where our iso revolution with Chris and James came in. That's where our spike first started.Then in 2018-2019 teams just started trapping and Capela as much as I love him could not handle it.(Morey said as much) Then we traded for Westbrook and then Capela just because having him with Westbrook just killed spacing. We did what we did because teams adjusted. We didnt have Woods on the roster. Man if we had just had prime Nene on this roster, so many things could have been different. He was so good for us.

So arent "different" we just went back to being the 2016-2017 Rockets. And btw...we still lead the league in Iso attempts.

 

Huh?

I'm legit confused.

The fact is your numbers were flat out wrong and we are taking more mid range shots.

Here is what I said...
"Look, we can go back and forth on this all day. I think it's a misconception that MDA and Silas are the same and if you look at shot charts from MDA vs shot charts from today you'll see we do take more mid range shots."

How was that disproven by your incorrect numbers? First, you didn't look at a shot chart you looked at numbers and then you posted inaccurate numbers at that.

The numbers back my statement unless you can prove the numbers are wrong somehow...so the only one doing special mental gymnastics is you.

 

We're taking more mid-range shots here, numbers back that, what are you talking about???

No, you said that the midrange is useless and you don't even think players should work on the mid range, something that even MDA said. That he wouldn't even draw up a play for it lol. But hey, maybe he didn't say any of that and you know his offense and philosophy better than him.

It's funny how when I post numbers all you 'numbers' guy ignore them flat out lol

Last year...22.6 possessions in Isolations...this year...10.8

Last year 11.3 for pnr ball handler, this year...18.4 and this kind of difference is similar for possessions with the roll man.

These were from last year...yes we lead the league in ISO attempts...barely. Vs...marginally, the ISO attemps took a HUGE dip. From 22.6 to 10.8 and this is with around half games with harden and half of them without.

You saying "Well of course we Wood and Cousins so we have more X type of plays" Yes. We have a different offense that isn't ISO heavy.

Everyone watching can see that.

 

Watching mindless 3 pointers was fun when we were going to the second round and WCF finals. Wasn’t fun after Harden wanted out.

 

Team just needs time to play together at full health. Question will be whether we run out of time before that happens.

 

In general, I agree with the title .

I do think we became more pigeonholed into taking only efficient shots with MDA . That’s not an awful thing , but the question is “how do you get your distribution“ and “is it maximizing the players’ strength?”

I think we got locked into the mindset during the first Cp3 year . We thought “we aren't as talented” , look at these numbers , this is the only reason we are able to stay with them. The talent portion is due to Ryan and Luc already being done by the time the playoffs rollled around . We might have had an better offense if those 2 were at a high level .

the next year neither team was as good . MDA still in charge . He is the king of if it ain’t broke don’t fix it .

next year we get WB , he’s not good enough to make 3’s an efficient shot .. MDA says how can we get him more at the rim ?

The sample size is still small with Silas . Every coach loves efficiency. Depends on personnel and each coach has something he’s willing to give up for “efficient” offensive shots . If giving a guy 1-2 of his preferred shots(when they are not layups ft’s or 3’s) a game gets him to play a higher level defensively ... then most coaches make that decision.*

I like Silas’ train of thought so far . Seems guys are being unselfish , we are getting enough high-quality looks , and the offense seems somewhat unpredictable. With MDA you had the opposite of that for the most part.

Mchale had some “unpredictability” too . Parsons , Lin, harden , smith , dmo , Beverley... these guys could all iniate and do whatever they wanted from time to time . Younger players , different league , but a decent offense .

If you’re a step faster on the chemistry and movement aspect as well as guys feeling confident and comfortable in their spots ... no matter what defense is being played or shots you are getting , you’re offense will be pretty good

 

The numbers amount to us essentially taking 1 more mid range per game from last year. That's not significant.

I have been saying all over this time, that mid range for clutch situations were fine. What Silas has been saying. You can check my post history. Ive also said I want players who are good at mid range to take them. Well MDA contradicts himself because Harden, Cp3 and Westbrook all took mid range here or had the option too.

Im not ignoring them. Im just giving you context bro. Dont you think there was a reason Mike and Daryl went away from this? Darly actually went on record and said the reason. We've never had a big like Woods here in Houston. Never. Im not ignoring them. Mike loves pick and roll. So its only okay when YOU can give context you believe is correct?

We dont have James Harden anymore, but even with that.....its still almost identical to Dantoni's first year here.

We have different players. Iso this and Iso that, we had one of the best Iso players of all time on our team. Mike and Daryl knew that and we adjusted and changed over the years to make the offense more efficient. That's what you aarent understanding.

And even after all of that....its identical TO MIKE's FIRST YEAR HERE. So yes, Dantoni and Silas are similar. Im sorry that you want Silas to be so different from him but the fact is, they share some similar philosophies.

 

This is a new, refreshing brand of Rocket ball. It sucks not having Harden anymore, of course, but often times when a superstar departs there is nothing but ugly left behind. But this team is fun to watch and is entertaining. Win or lose, this team is full of motivated guys, the ball movement and defense is fresh and exciting. What we have right now is the best case scenario for after Harden's departure. We're still winning some games and having some fun. I really like what Silas and Stone have been doing.