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The Truth, courtesy of Molly Ivins

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by RocketMan Tex, Oct 10, 2003.

  1. RocketMan Tex

    RocketMan Tex Contributing Member

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    http://www.sacbee.com/content/opinion/national/ivins/story/7566678p-8507831c.html.

    Molly Ivins: Republicans on a rampage
    By Molly Ivins
    Published 2:15 a.m. PDT Thursday, October 9, 2003


    AUSTIN, Texas -- Not that any of us is in a position to criticize the Great Scriptwriter in the Sky, but don't you think She's been going a little heavy on the irony lately?
    All those folks who had conniption fits over Bill Clinton's affair are now pooh-poohing Arnold Schwarzenegger's sexual misconduct -- and vice versa. The right-wingers who are always griping about Hollywood stars who express political opinions -- "Shut Up and Sing" -- suddenly find an actor perfectly fit for high political office based on his experience as The Terminator.

    Professional patriots who would have been screaming with horror had the Clinton White House ever leaked the name of an undercover CIA agent now struggle to justify or minimize such a thing.

    President Bush has spent $300 million trying to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and come up with zip, so now he wants to spend $600 million more. And let's mention the president's interesting theory that NOT finding any weapons of mass destruction means the Iraq war was fully justified. (Hello?)

    Connoisseurs of political folly who have been enjoying the antics in California should not overlook the doings in the Great State, where Texas Republicans have achieved such a pluperfect snafu that the state's primary will be delayed next year.

    The Iraqi Governing Council is complaining because the United States is wasting so much money in Iraq.

    Rush Limbaugh is apparently facing drug charges.

    Attorney General John Ashcroft demanded that federal prosecutors seek the maximum penalty in every case just before some perp(s) in the White House apparently broke the Intelligence Identities Protection Act, which carries a maximum of 10 years in prison. All in all, a fine fall Irony Fest.

    Less ironic and more in the sickening vein is the naked profiteering by various Bushies on the Iraq War. Bob Dole used to wander around the country demanding, "Where is the outrage?" Where's Dole when we need him?

    Joe Allbaugh, who was one of Bush's "Iron Triangle" when he was governor and later as his presidential campaign manager and head of the Federal Emergency Management Agency, is now in the Baghdad biz. Already the head of one consulting firm, Allbaugh and two partners, both lobbyists and former aides to Poppy Bush, have formed a new firm.

    "The opportunities evolving in Iraq are of such an unprecedented nature and scope that no other existing firm has the necessary skills and experience to be effective both in the United States and on the ground." Salivating over unprecedented booty and swag while American soldiers are getting killed every day is considered kind of tacky, in some circles.

    A former partner of Douglas Feith, undersecretary of defense and a major player in pushing the war, has joined a nephew of Ahmed Chalabi, head of the Iraqi National Congress and apparently the source of much misinformation before the war. The nephew has opened a law office in Baghdad, and Feith's erstwhile law partner is marketing the firm in the United States.

    Hundreds of millions of dollars in contracts have already been awarded -- without competitive bidding -- to American businesses, including Halliburton and Bechtel. Hey, no favoritism there. Appearance of impropriety? Don't be a churlish nitpicker.

    Sen. Tom Daschle's office has documented the "gold-plating" of cost estimates in dozens of contracts. These include such gems as $6,000 each for handheld radios and satellite phones, as well as $200 million to protect 100 Iraqi families, at an average cost of $200,000 per family member. The federal witness protection program costs $10,000 per person per year.

    While the main cell-phone contract has yet to be announced, MCI has the preliminary contract. MCI has no experience in building cell networks -- and it also perpetrated the largest accounting fraud in history.

    We're footing the $87 billion-and-counting tab (not including the $79 billion we already spent) for this venture, and the Senate Finance Committee has the chutzpah to consider granting a $100 billion tax break to corporations that make profits overseas. This dandy notion would permit American firms to "repatriate" overseas profits at a reduced tax rate of 5.25 percent, rather than the current 35 percent. Now, does anyone think that doing so might, just might, encourage more corporations to move their operations overseas?

    El stinko to high heaven-o.
     
  2. wouldabeen23

    wouldabeen23 Contributing Member

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    Great article--Molly Ivins is a TRUE Texas treasure along with Dan Rather and Walter Cronkite(even though Walter was born in Missouri ;) ) On that note, let the sniping begin!!
     
  3. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking
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    Molly and others of the left-wing lunatic fringe still don't understand the issue that led to Slick Willy's impeachment. It has been how many years now? It still hasn't sunk in? Sad, really. I love it how the liberals try to make the impeachment and Starr report into a sexual misconduct issue. What a joke. The issue was lying under oath. A President was not honoring the laws of the land. Impeachment naturally followed. For Molly to compare lying under oath to the problems that Arnold faced is simply absurd. Arnold's bad press stemmed from *allegations* which have yet to be proven true from women's recollections of 15 years ago. Hardly enough evidence on which to base a decision. Apples and oranges. This type of ignorance which Molly has put on display is why no one takes her seriously. She is on tv because of her outlandishness -- and nothing more. Molly has zero credibility because she is just not capable of understanding the issue. Sorry Molly, but you have to be better than that for people to listen.
     
  4. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost be kind. be brave.

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    Sure.

    and the sole reason World War I was fought is because Archduke Ferdinand was assasinated.

    :rolleyes:
     
  5. GreenVegan76

    GreenVegan76 Contributing Member

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    LOL

    I'm still laughing.
     
  6. Mulder

    Mulder Contributing Member

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    One can only hope... In addition to the now infamous 16 words in the state of the union address Bush stated the following.

    ON THE ECONOMY:
    GEORGE BUSH: “[W]e will not pass along our problems to...other generations.”
    THE TRUTH: $1.9 trillion in new debt over 5 years, with deficits continuing thereafter.

    ON TAX CUTS:
    GEORGE BUSH: “The tax relief is for everyone who pays income taxes...Americans will keep, this year, an average of almost $1,000 more of their own money.”
    THE TRUTH: Nearly half of all taxpayers get less than $100. And 31% of all taxpayers get nothing at all.

    ON SOCIAL SECURITY:
    GEORGE BUSH: “[W]e continue to work together to keep Social Security sound and reliable.”
    THE TRUTH: The costs of the Bush tax cuts exceed by 3 times the entire projected shortfall in Social Security.

    ON JOBS:
    GEORGE BUSH: “Our first goal is...an economy that grows fast enough to employ every man and woman who seeks a job.”
    THE TRUTH: Bush is the first President since Hoover to preside over an economy that has lost jobs, not created them – more than 2.9 million since 2001.

    ON THE ENVIRONMENT:
    GEORGE BUSH: “[My] Clear Skies legislation...mandates a 70% cut in air pollution from
    power plants over the next 15 years.”
    THE TRUTH: The Bush plan will allow more than 100,000 additional premature deaths by
    2020 than alternative legislation developed by the Environmental Protection Agency. The
    plan does not regulate carbon emissions and allows far more sulfur and mercury emissions.

    ON EDUCATION:
    GEORGE BUSH: “[W]e achieved historic education reform – which must now be carried
    out in every school and in every classroom.”
    THE TRUTH: Bush cut $8 billion from the promised funds for education.

    Lying to Congress is perjury folks, an impeachable offense.
     
  7. RocketMan Tex

    RocketMan Tex Contributing Member

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    I guess the truth really does hurt.
     
  8. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Why do you say that?
     
  9. MacBeth

    MacBeth Member

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    I don't know whether or not the reason Clinton was impeached was lying under oath...but I do know that it is the reason he should have been impeached.

    That was the crime...but I do agree that Republicans got caught up in the initial glee of catching a politician with his pants down which, prior to Clinton, was more politically damaging in the US than commiting a crime. In their excitement, IMO, at getting what they thought was the blade to apply to Clinton, they missed what should have been the point; the head of our nation breaking the law and undermining the entire basis of our judicial system; testimony accountability.

    Clinton's strength as a politician is and always was the ability to scramble out of trouble, and this was his high water mark in this regard...Instead of ducking the sexual angle, he essentially challenged the American people with the following question: With the economy going well, things in general being on the up...exactly how much do you really care about my sex life? Is it enough to take a chance at making things worse for you?

    And in so doing he read the political/moral climate in America better than the Republicans. The point most were missing during all this talk about sex was that none of it mattered, but what did, the perjury, mattered a lot.

    By the time the Republicans realized that they had lost the battle regarding the sex angle, they also realized that were they then to pursue the perjury angle...which they should have been stressing from the beginning...would look like sour grapes, and that the voters would blame them for prolonging the unpleasantness, just as they sort of already blamed them for thier intial glee about the whole thing.

    In my mind everybody here let us down; Clinton let us down the most, by breaking the law for his own interests, and the Republicans let us down by focusing on the more tawdry angle merely because they thought it was the best way of bringing Clinton down, rather than focusing on the only angle which really mattered. And we, in general, let ourselves down by watching the titilating side show and missing the real thing.
     
    #9 MacBeth, Oct 10, 2003
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2003
  10. RocketMan Tex

    RocketMan Tex Contributing Member

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    Because it's true.
     
  11. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Right on target again, Molly. An Austin treasure.

    Golly, MacBeth... can there be a time when Clinton won't be brought up whenever a Republican politician, at any level, has a hint of scandal or just screws up royally?

    It really gets tiresome. He's out of office. Let it go.
     
  12. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    El stinko to high heaven-o.
     
  13. MacBeth

    MacBeth Member

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    Huh?


    Man, I get it both ways...Republicans take shots at me for being a Democrat, Democrats for being a Republican.

    And I didn't bring it up...at all...was just responding.
     
  14. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Responding to who?


    edit: I never said you were a Republican! ;)
     
  15. MacBeth

    MacBeth Member

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    T_J and Donny Most...
     
  16. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    I don't know who this T_J person is, but I thought Donny's was pretty funny. I don't know if you saw the edit I added to my post, but I did not call you a Republican! ;)
     
  17. MacBeth

    MacBeth Member

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    It does happen, though. I get called one-sided and partisan...by both sides. It's an interesting phenomenen.

    Donny was funny, but counter-factual in his implications, just like you were in yours...:D

    Seriously, though, you were off the mark with the bringing up Clinton every time a Republican gets in trouble thing, in that A) I don't habitually defend Republicans, and B) Like with Dubya, I made my decision about Clinton's impeachment despite having supported him in the previous election ( not the 1st one) just as I supported Bush in the last one and now want him out of office. Despite this, whichever side I take on an issue, I am continually called biased, partisan, and an extremist _________.
     
  18. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost be kind. be brave.

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    Yeah.

    When you put things in retrospect.. it kind of makes us all look like a bunch of flaming jackasses for how we handled and reacted to the entire episode. Especially when compared to the gravity of today's issues and worldly situation.
     
  19. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost be kind. be brave.

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    Lots of Republicans openly concede now that the entire thing was unconstitutional and just a gigantic piece of partisan warfare.

    To me, saying that they impeached him for lying about getting his whistle waxed is like saying..

     
  20. MacBeth

    MacBeth Member

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    I see what you're saying...and, underneath it all, it's quite possible that the emotional fuel for the impeachment was the whole sexual angle...

    ...but factually and legally the only apsect of the process was the perjury angle, which was generally undisputed, and got lost in the political shuffle about sex going both ways.

    Put it this way; I thought Clinton was doing a very good job. I thought he was very bright, and very able...I didn't trust him as far as I could throw him in a personel sense, but I trusted his leadership of the country. But he should have been booted. I didn't rejoice in this...I was deeply saddened by it. But it was the right thing to do. To allow the leader of a law based nation to openly break that law...and to ignore the basis of our judicial system...was detrminental to the politicl and judicial system, but moreover, I think it also confirmed an attitude that we are now seeing deomnstrated by many with regards to Bush: We don't care whether we are lied to...we don't care about accountability, we care about how much money we have, and whether we win the bang bang.

    The problem with allowing Clintin to sidestep responsibility for his actions wasn't that he was going to go out on an adultery spree following that; don't think he would, don't care if he does. The problem was the message that sent...and we are now seeing more serious repercussions of our government knowing that we won't hold them accountable because we don't have the moral stamina; we want sound bite answers, and the soundbite answer to Clinton was " Who cares about a BJ?" The soundbite answer to Iraq was " 9-11"...then " WMD"...then " We won."...and now it's " Mass graves." But it's all an excuse to avoid going through another Watergate, and the cost to our national sense of superiority that that involves, coupled with the fact that we have ever diminishing attention spans.

    And in terms of the legal system, whgat message does that send to people testifying from here on out; the truth doesn't matter. That has often been true to individuals on the stand, but we now send the message that it's not important to the system either, and that's vastly different. And how exactly do you explain that to someone rotting in jail for perjury, when we all know the President did it...he is caught red handed...and we all say " Big deal."?
     

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