I think that is how Honda like it and ahs become known for over the years: making good, reliable, safe, affordable cars that are made for the average person, nothing fancy and nothing radical. I don't think Honda will change a formula that has worked so well for it over the years. Honda simply doesn't like to/afraid to alienate anyone. With that said though, I totally agree that the old formula of tweaking out the most power from a smaller engine, and the lack of a competitive rear-wheel drive platform hurts its cars in making it always a second fiddle to Lexus, Cadillac, Infiniti, BMW, and Benzes. But if they get into that game, there is no reason to think they can't be competitive with those brands.
Have you driven the V6 Accord Coupe(I'm assuming the sedan as well)? Unmatched speed in the price range and very fun to drive. The TL or the TSX? They are practical cars, but they're not as plain-Jane as people make them out to be. The 300 is a nice car, but US automakers still have some catching up to do. The Mustang? Nice improvements, but I'd still take the Accord Coupe, Solara over the lower-end and the TL, G35, 3-series, C-Class, etc... over the higher-end.
That GTO looks like a Cavalier on steroids. 400 HP, puhleaze..... What a wussy mobile. The new Mustang may not be faster, but it sure does look like a fast car versus the 90's dull GTO. And I'd be willing to wager it wouldn't take much to turn that Mustang into something really special. The GTO does not have as good a platform as the 'Stang, which is built on the rock solid platform of the Lincoln LS, which is a fine handling machine.
Actually, next to Nissan, I am a Pontiac and GMC guy. I have owned 4 different Grand Ams, a Grand Prix and 2 Bonnevilles. I love Pontiacs and thats why Im so disappointed in the GTO. Like bamaslammer said, looks like a Cavalier on steriods. Actually, it looks like a Grand Am on steriods. Pontiac makes a good car, inside and outside and performance wise. But they have no originality in their designs. They all look alike. That GTO looks like a cross between a Grand Am/Sunfire/Grand Prix. They could have done so much more with this. The GTO was one of the first true muscle cars and for Pontiac to bring it back and make it look so similar to their existing line is just stupid. They should have made it look similar to the new Mustangs. The boxed front end look is classic GTO.
Sunfire: Grand Am: GTO: Grand Prix: G6: Bonneville: 6 "different" models that all look the same that dual grille with the emblem in between look is on EVERY single one of their vehicles and has been since the 80s they need some new designers
Yah, I understand your point. BTW, I hear Pontiac will actually do an all-new GTO due out for 2007 model, it should be radically different from this Aussie-built Pontiac. I don't understand why Bob Lutz rushed to get a car and slap the "GTO" badge on it, so I do understand the disappointment with the design. But apprently, Motor Trend was so impressed with it, they decided t put it up against the Mercedes E class (It was on the cover of that edition that said something like "2 as good as one?" or something like that. Interesting read by the way) So basically, while Car and Driver was not enthused by it, Motor Trend loved it and praised it like crazy. So it seems to have the "love it or leave it" effect on critics and fans alike.
I don't think it will, it is simply the company's trademark look, and I simply fail to see how else a Pontiac grill can look. The Grand AM and the Sunfire are dead after this model year (I think Sunfire is 2006 model year will be last). So the minimum will be the G6, which is a nice car by the way, although I will wait to test-drive the 240 HP V6 GTP before I make a judgement on it, because its current 200HP engine is a bit on the week side. The Gran Prix is nice, man, it might be weird but I actually like its interior design, but may be the center console should be less "plasticy". Still, it is a solid looking car from the outside and drives very nicely. I have only driven the 200 HP one though, and it accelerates fine, but am yet to drive the new one that will come out soon I believe, which has less body cladding, bigger wheels, and finally a Nav system. In my opinion, there are no two cars in the market right now that are more competitive and closer in function than the Grand Prix and the Maxima. I think they are both two very nice sporty family sedans, and if one considers both for purchase, it will probably come down to brand-loyalty or Japanese v. American favorability.
BTW, the biggest knock on Pontiac? That they killed the SWEEEEEEEEEEEET Firebird, it was by far my favorite pony car, but I cannot fathom why the hell GM would kill it and let the Mustang enjoy all the spotlight, I thought the Firebird was a better car than the Mustang, although more pricey. A friend of mine a while back in college had it and I used to absolutely love it. It was reasonably priced, attractive, durable, and pretty darn fun. But ahhh well, you never know what the General is thinking...
Actually, in a head to head of the 2004 models, the Mustang Mach I took out the GTO by a hair. The Cobra did not have to be troubled to prove herself. No word yet on the 2005's in a head to head.
err, I'm a stang fan, but the only place the Mach I wins is at the drag strip, where the solid rear axle gets the power down better than the GTO's independent rear in the real world, the GTO's torque beats the Mach I's top end
Good Point! Then let's compare the top of the line GTO to the top of the line Cobra. Cobra is even faster, and runs the IRS. I was just pointing out that the top of the line Mustang did not have to be disturbed in the 1/4.
Their signature look is old and overused though. Lot of lines have signature looks, but you don't see them copied from model to model. I have no qualms about the GTO's performance, as I've heard it is outstanding. The body style looks like a Sunfire/Grand Am though. They could have done so much mroe with it to bring back the muscle car look. Thats what a GTO always has been. I like the Grand Prix too. In fact, overall, I think Pontiac interiors kick the **** out of Nissan interior's. This is a sharp looking interior. You put that interior into a Maxima or a Armada and I would own that instead of a GMC Yukon.
The problem with both the Mustand and Firebird is, in the 90s especially, the quality of both were crap. Ford and GM relied on the name of the car to sell it. The Mustang hung on until they got it right with the current body style. The quality of the 90s Firebird was so bad, no wonder it was discontinued. That, and they never changed the body style in about 10 years, at least not drastically. Like the Mustang, and the way I feel about the GTO, Pontiac would have done well to bring back the muscle look to the Firebird/Trans Am. Like this:
Like mine! I had to look all over for that accursed Firechicken decal. As for the 1990's edition of the car, they were huge on the outside, tiny on the inside. Their handling was tricky, the vision out of them was perilous and their reliability was questionable (they were built by French Canadians in a now-closed plant). And as far as that Pontiac interior, it looks like crap. Utter crap. Too much plastic that looks more at home on Fisher Price toys than in a car. At least Chryslers have different colors and textures than that awful charcoal. It's like taking a ride inside a barbeque grill. Yeeech. And Codell, great montage on the Pontiacs. Who the hell could tell a G6 from a GTO from a Gran Prix? I'd be hard pressed to do so.
Bama, If you own a Nissan, don't talk about Pontiac interior's being all plastic. actually, that pic I posted was of a Bonneville interior (which I owned at one time) and , steering wheel and most of the dash were not plastic. Also, although its all in the charcoal scheme, there were several different tones of it and you can see it in that picture
