yeah, I didn't mean it to be insulting or any kind of reflection on Saudi. it was just a reference to the beginning of the iraq war when opponents of the war would point out that the 9-11 hijackers weren't from iraq. sorry for derailment
I have studied it a bit, and my conclusions on Islam are no different than my conclusions on any other religion. I think they are all created by man to explain the unexplainable, and they all regurgitate a lot of the same mythos that came before them. Millions of religions have been started, for some reasons, Islam, Christianity, Judiasm got popular and stayed. Just because they are popular, does not make them true. IMO, more harm has been done to mankind in the name of religion than anything else....just look at the middle east, essentially they have spent thousands of years arguing about whom is more right about God. And right now, Islam is the root of most of the worlds terrorism. Sure it is a bastardization of it, but that is because the message is not consistent, it starts out one way, then as Muhammed's status changes gets more aggressive..... It is rooted in the politics of the 600s...... I mean honestly.... DD
I'm not going to judge you on your opinions on this religion or the subject of religion altogether; to each his own. I think highly of you DD, I knew you wouldn't disappoint me and truly prove yourself ignorant. I am glad that you actually tried to read up a little. Just don't try and say some of the biased and hateful things you said in this thread. No hard feelings.
Everyone has a bias Shasta, everyone. I am biased against religion. I don't hide it, never will. I respect people's right to believe what they like, even if I don't respect the actual religion itself. I wouldn't even give Islam two looks if it wasn't being used right now all over the world to create terrorism and attempt to move mankind back 1000 years. And it is not hateful to think that the Saudi Kings are corrupt and bad for the world overall, and that it would actually be better for the entire planet if they took over Saudi Arabia. DD
The fact that you would liken the religious beliefs of millions to something as trivial as a cartoon goes to prove your ignorance on this topic. We can all rest a little better that you aren't calling the shots. Were you not loved as a child? I'm just wondering what could cause somebody to be this calloused and damaged. No...I believe that you want it to happen. That is what I posted, and that is what you said...twice. Because it comports with YOUR value system. I guess we should just throw theirs out the window. After all, they believe in a religion, so they couldn't possibly know what is best for them, right? Geez...such arrogance.
Whew, much better to let it rest in the hands of Mullahs or Kings who think it is ok to lash a 75 year old woman. And just because Millions believe doesn't make it true, millions believed in Zues, and Apollo too, you know. LOL - this is funny....maybe I just deal in reality....calloused and damaged....that is just funny. Why would someone have to be calloused and damaged to believe that most religion is mythos? Why are modern religions more right than the Greeks, Summarians, Babylonians, Egyptians, Pagans....were? To me, it is all mythos.....it is just that Islam is one of the popular ones today. Of course I think the world would be better off without governments based upon religion....that is what I believe....so? They can believe what they want, I respect anyone's ability to think for themselves and make up their own mind.....of course to have true ability to think for yourself it would require the goverment, mullahs, and everyone else to allow access to everyone to contradictory views, now wouldn't it. If people can view the facts and come to their own conclusions and have faith..I have no issue with that, as long as they aren't crowding into my freedom to think it is all silly. Arrogance....Come on...it is not arrogance, it is just my beliefs...feel free to believe what you want.....just don't kill people or step on anyone elses toes and I won't give two craps. But don't get mad if I criticize a backwards arsed government for being...well backwards arsed like Saudi Arabia is..... DD
Just let it go...his entire life has influenced him to become the person he is today. A few posts on a basketball BBS will not do anything. I'm just glad there is at least another voice of reason out there.
I agree. They don't believe in individual rights. There is no freedom of speech, press, religion, etc. The brainwash their children with lies and propaganda that promotes violence. They finance radical Islam around the globe that produces terrorists. They are a danger to the entire world, and they get a pass because of their oil. Their culture is shyte, and should be reformed immediately. ALL CULTURES ARE NOT EQUAL. SOME CULTURES DESERVE TO DIE AND BE PLACE IN THE DUSTBIN OF HISTORY.
I think that, no matter who you are, you can not make a judgement about religion unless you know it. You take someone like MadMax, and a Muslim can accept his criticism. It is constructive and founded on good research from good sources. Then you have people like DD who are searching for things to overreact to and (let's be honest here) receive their information from the media. DD, is it not fair that if you are going to attribute the worst things in the world to Islam that you attain a basic understanding of the religion? You have been doing this for months now, and it sounds to me like you've been doing it since you've been on this board. If you are going to publicly bash something, then give it a fair trial (one of the tenants of the secular world you dream of). If you believe that I should stop believing in religion, you can't use the leader of Saudi Arabia and Iran to justify this. By the same token, I wouldn't use George Bush or Obama or McCain or any leader to judge all American people's faith. You are the reason why the term "freedom of speech" is frowned upon in the Middle East. Because you abuse the freedom. You ruin the image of such an awesome thing. You start becoming loose with your values (is it fair to make an assumption without a good background?) but stronger in your insistence to speak freely. It's a formula for disaster. It creates hatred rather than respect. You know how it ends up? You give freedom of speech a bad name, then people won't want the freedom, because they'll see it negatively. Is this how you market freedom of speech? Shouldn't you be an ambassador for what your country stands for? If it's blood you're after, you should be happy because mankind will always spill blood. If you truly want what's best for everyone, then you have to understand everyone and not just through the media. Because the more you speak out and show your lack of understanding, the more distance you create. The more distance you create between people, the more detached they get from human emotion. Once that's gone, it's easy to behead, because we cease to be human at that point. Jesus said love your enemy. Pray for and bless your enemies. Great advice. Works in miraculous ways. If everyone did this, the world would be a much better place than if you beheaded the Saudi government, raped and pillaged their oil fields, and gave the people a portion of what, in fact, they own 100%.
The reason some sects dont perceive you to be muslims has nothing to do with the fact that 'most of our people have higher education and a high income level' .. That is a nonsense argument. The reasons are because most people construe your changing of basic islamic tenets to be blasphemous and in every way wrong. You cant just change things to make them more convenient. And dont even get me started on AK (who actually is a very good human being for someone that got hooked up with such a PHAT life).
Mathloom, In freedom of speech societies you are free to speak your mind, and people are free to listen or ignore. I do not for one second believe that all countries are equal, or treat their people with the proper amount of respect. Iran's goverment...SUCKS North Korea's government SUCKS Saudi Arabia - government SUCKS Libya - government SUCKS Tons of African nations - government SUCKS And many many others.....the USA is hardly perfect either, but we have a seperation of church and state, and you know what that does? It allows for a difference of opinion and a healthy debate. I do think religion is mythos, there is no basis in fact for any of it, sure you can prove some of the people that wrote it actually lived...etc....but you can't believe they are any more truthful than L. Ron Hubbard and his Scientology religion. And the fact that people have been fighting and killing each other for CENTURIES over which religion is more right, or more god like than the other is ludicrous. There are many good things about religion, and in the end, how religion is treated relies heavily on the people that are practicing or in some cases manipulating it. However, government and religion should be seperate to protect the rights of everyone, that is something I firmly believe in...... DD
Why can't you change something to make it more convinient? Mohammed changed his message as his status changed, and he got more of a PHAT life...your words. And for the record, I do not hate religion, I just hate the bastardization of it, and the arguments about which religion is closer to the truth.....and most importantly the killing done as part of that argument. DD
Hear, hear. But I would replace "religion" with "organized religion". When religion is an individual's personal search for the Higher Truth, it's fine and good. But when religion becomes an organized power structure, it usually becomes a front to mask bigotry, hatred, and all the baser human instincts.
Religion, or at least Islam, is supposed to be timeless. There cant be such things as progressives in Islam because it is a timeless religion. Also, Im curious as to how Mohammad changed his message as his status changed. Please let me know where you found this info. Thanks
"Islam: What the world needs to know"....youtube this, and you'll know everything DD knows. His points against Islam seem to always stem from the video.............
This kind of stuff SICKENS me. Who the hell are you to tell people what they can and can not say? The freedom to speak one's mind is the absolute cornerstone of our culture. The problem with Islam is that Islam demands respect, yet respects no one. Sure, as long as the West bends over backwards to accommodate Islam, everything is ok. Once somebody questions the veracity of Islam though, all hell breaks loose. If somebody make fun of the Prophet, be ready for 10,000 Muslims to act like a bunch of babies who just had their candy taken away (except in this metaphor these babies want to kill you). I don't care about the ideology of Islam, because that is irrelevant. All I care about is how is Islam practiced by humans in 2009? I say the record for Muslims world wide is piss poor. Mohammad and Joseph Smith are two con men of the same ilk. They both took 12 year olds to bed, pretended to have visions, and somehow convinced a bunch of morons to give them their money. I sure both of them would be mortified to see how their lies blossomed. One day human beings will move beyond this religion crap, but until then, we will have to deal with people like Muslims who think our inalienable rights are theirs for the taking.
Wait a minute, so let me understand your argument: One of the main reasons religion is bad is because people have been fighting and killing each other over which is more right? You have to look deeper than your basic BS analysis of history and the human psyche. Man fights for what he believes in, whether that is religion, govt, freedom, money, love, etc. Let me repeat that for you, Man fights for what he believes in, no matter what it is! It is up to the individual to decide what he feels strongly about. Religion is so maligned, in this respect because it has to the power to capture and move people to such an extent that they will fight for it. What you, and others, fail to remember is that Man can be enraptured by almost anything worthy in his eyes! If this fact wasn't true, no one would ever decide to go to War over something like "taxation w/o representation" or the assassination of a leader. I am sick and tired of tunnel-visioned individuals like you who believe that the world would be a friggen utopia w/o religion. What? Do you think Man will magically stop playing according to his nature and become a pacifist? Nice way to trivialize the situation, sir. We have had a violent history even before any of our current religions were even thought of. Some of the most bloody conflicts have been attributed to things other than religion. Power, money, whatever. Whats next, you want to eliminate government, a free-market economy, etc??? All in the name of peace, right? Stick to the youtube videos.
