I know you'll think whatever you want, but I think you are taking a huge leap there. In his 9-minute interview, Richard never mentions once that those two defied the family's wishes. His complaint is simply that Pat was not religious. I don't think it is accurate to extrapolate from there in unsubstantiated directions. I've tried, in vain, to find a copy online of a handout from the service to see what else was done that day.
He doesn't have to mention it. The fact that they did it and it upset him proves it was contrary to his wishes. If he wished they would mention God when talking about Pat, it wouldn't have bothered him. That shouldn't be hard for you to understand.
So McCain and Maria have to be mind-readers?! Preferences are not wishes. By wishes, I'm talking about expressed wishes.
That's what I said they may not have been expressed wishes. But they were certainly wishes. Who cares if they were mind readers or not. The fact is they did no research, and just assumed the person they were talking about was like them. That's not the right thing to do when trying to honor a deceased hero.
If the Tillman family felt that particular about it, they should have said "no" to all the outsiders. I think that Richard could have made his point a LOT more effectively without the beer and the foul mouth.
I think you are way out of line to tell a grieving family how they should hold a funeral for their lost loved one. If they want to do it with beer, then so be it. I also don't think the blame is on the family that the speakers didn't know enough about the deceased. It was disrespectful of them. The family has enough to worry about without pre-approving everyone's speeches.
The grieving family had "something" to do with the nationally-televised funeral. They had politically-oriented speakers on the roster. They had planned ahead enough to have cold beer! Was there a big fuss about this before now-- 6 years later? You do realize that you are criticizing two people who were making comforting remarks to those who came there to honor and to remember Pat Tillman? Seemingly few more than Richard Tillman were so "offended." The memorial service is for all who attend not just the family. I helped host memorial services for both my father and mother. The service is for everyone not just the family in my experience. That's why people outside of the family come.
You don't comfort atheist relatives of an atheist by referencing God. If you want to honor Pat Tillman then talk about who he was and what he sacrificed and how our government screwed his family and leave God out of it. You're being an ass.
That's a nifty little rant there; you are very good at name-calling. The memorial service is for all who attend. A little God and Country was helpful for some of them. At the point of the MS, not much was known about the true circumstances of his death so it would be hard to deliver that to the public.
You don't understand what a funeral service is for, or you are being intentionally ignorant. The memorial service is not for all who attend, it is to remember the deceased and for the family of the deceased. All who attend should do so to honor the deceased and be there to support the family. Those who attend are the ones who should be there for the family, not the family puts on a service for those that want to attend. You are way off.
so what? both sides of my family drink beer at funerals. even the priest came out and had one w/ us at my dads. and we always go to the gravesite after the ceremony and drink more.
Nice post, FB. I'm surprised anyone would decide to argue with Giddy and expect a different result (I gave up!), but kudos for giving it a shot. Yes, a funeral is for the family and is done the way the family wishes. Even if the President of the United States dies in office, his family has influence on how the services are held.
This was a freaking nationally televised memorial service for Pat Tillman, was it not? This was not a graveside service was it-- which is more of a private affair? Whatever and whoever was scheduled to be part of it all must have been approved by the family or their representatives. If they wanted a tighter control on the views expressed, they should have planned better. Don't invite or accept politicians. Say no to the TV people. To disparage McCain and Shriver because of the very normal sentiments they expressed is not necessary. Some in that audience were comforted by their words-- regardless of what Pat Tillman personally believed. I love the way this place works. Because you can't change my mind, it is my failing. That gives you a pretty secure spot, doesn't it? LOL. At my mother's memorial service, one of her friends came up to me and complained about my dad (then dead for 5 years) and some of the ways he "treated" my mom. They were married for some 53 years when he died. She was an alcoholic and he stood by her through thick and thin. While, according to most of you, I should have cussed her out or thrown a beer in her face I simply told her this was not the time and place for that discussion about my father... and I thanked her for coming to my mother's memorial service. She was actually part of the couple that had introduced my parents many years ago. It didn't ruin my day. It didn't even particularly offend me. I just wouldn't give it a head of steam. For some reason she needed to get that off her chest. I accepted that but chose not to discuss it further and I didn't need to bless her out. It was her grief, too.
i think they were touchy because pat tillman had told people privately that he was afraid that if he died, the government might try to use his death to stir up patriotism to promote the war that tillman felt was being fought for the wrong reasons. one of the higher ups in the military said something along the lines of "well, they're atheists, i guess they just believe pat is worm dirt." i don't think there's anything wrong with driving home the point that pat wasn't religious and wouldn't appreciate any hint of these politicians (who he was wary of in the first place) bringing up god. from all i've read, he HATED the thought of being painted as some all-american war hero. he was noam freaking chomsky's friend, for goodness sake. i've also read this was one of pat's favorite carl sagan quotes: "It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." just my .02
Why did he enlist? Has much been written about that? Did he not think the war was illegal at that time or did he come to this conclusion while over there?
I read a book about Tillman by Jon Krakauer in August on my vacation. My understanding of the situations is..... 9/11 stirred Tilllman to the point where he felt he had to enlist to do his duty. I believe he was much more gung ho about American operations in Afghanistan and more jaded about the operations in Iraq.
Inferring God at the funeral of an atheist isn't NORMAL and it's in fact extremely RUDE. That's the WHOLE point. Your usual obtuse routine is just extra stupid and insulting this time.
It's very likely they didn't even know he was an atheist. Being consistent and having an opinion opposing yours does not make one obtuse. McCain and Shriver paid their respects the best way the knew how. Since they didn't storm the stage and intrude on the service, that should be appreciated not reviled in the luxury of hindsight.
What's reviled is the very fact that they might not have known he was an atheist. Not knowing that and just assuming otherwise is presumptuous, rude and discourteous. Learn some manners.
