Yeah, Google just answered my question. The original plan by Gibson was to release it without subtitles. Apparently, subtitles obscured with the message of the film. Sellout.
Deckard just posted something interesting in http://bbs.clutchcity.net/showthread.php?s=&postid=1247576#post1247576 WRT an Austin viewing. Possibility that Mel might be busy editing.
Something interesting I heard on the radio was the lack of discussion of the tremendous amount of violent content in the film. It very well may have been an accurate depiction of what happened, but some have called the violence beyond brutal and bordering on disturbing. Obviously, it is used to carry a specific message about the story and the era, but we hear so much from religious leaders about Hollywood's penchant for violence in film, I find it interesting that they are willing to accept the violence in this context because they approve of the overall message. I'm betting they wouldn't have condoned the violence of Gibson's other films as they have with the Passion.
I was hoping Gibson would use the more current historical version of Jesus, without the long hair etc. Same goes for Mary. I don't think his target audience would be happy with the taditionial European image changed however.
i know he has blue eyes, but he wears brown contacts...his appearance is more of the Jews of that era than any movie I have seen...but i think it was more important to Mel, from what I heard, to have someone playing that role who was a believer..someone who internalized the role more than that of just a mere actor. again...that's what i've read, anyway.
Obviously, it is used to carry a specific message about the story and the era, but we hear so much from religious leaders about Hollywood's penchant for violence in film, I find it interesting that they are willing to accept the violence in this context because they approve of the overall message. Isn't the complaint about Hollywood violence not the violence itself, but the glamourization of it? In other words, its portrayed in a way that would make kids think its OK or encourage them to do such things? If that's the core of the complaint, I don't think there would be a problem here. This movie won't be portraying the violence in a positive way or a "crucifixtion is cool" sort of way!
I don't know how else to tell the story, if you want to be accurate about it. By all accounts, crucifixion is among the most brutal, gory ways to kill a person...it was designed to not just kill but to humiliate...and to send a message to everyone else about what happens when you disobey Roman authority. it's not exactly gratuitous violence...accounts of death by crucifixion are not pretty...this isn't Arnold blowing up things and people...this is about a man sent to suffer...that's really the essence of the story, and the suffering itself is significant, from a theological perspective.
I think the Gospel's descriptions of Jesus’ beating and crucifixion are purposely minimal. Early Christians understood the Cross to be the way that Jesus broke into the realm of Death. Suffering itself is not the point.
no..early Christian writings put a ton of emphasis on his suffering...they pointed to Old Testament verses they felt were prophetic, particularly the psalm of the suffering servant...Paul described it as "death, even death on a cross," noting that there is a difference: Philippians 2:8 And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death– even death on a cross! as a Christian, the suffering component of this gift makes me more grateful. we believe that Christ died for us...that is seemingly amplified when the death is horrific. we measure gifts sometimes by their cost and by the worthiness of the object of the gift...and that's why the crucifixion takes on such an important role in Christian tradition.
> February 20, 2004 > > Dear Friends: > > Unless you've been vacationing at the North Pole, you surely are aware > that Mel Gibson's movie, "The Passion of Christ," will open nation-wide > February 25. Quite honestly, I have hesitated for some time to > communicate with you about the movie as our partners at the > Anti-Defamation League and the American Jewish Committee have been doing > a great job keeping the community informed and updated on developments > with the movie. And, if your email box is like mine, I have been > inundated with emails offering all kinds of opinions about the movie. > Type in "The Passion" in your favorite internet search engine and you > will generate thousands of articles focused on the movie. > > In recent days, however, I attended a meeting of our rabbis and other > organizational leaders and significant concern was expressed about > reactions from the Jewish community when the movie finally opens. Based > on those concerns, I was encouraged by a few to communicate with you. > So, let me make a few brief observations. > > Last August, a few leaders from our community (along with leaders from > the Catholic and Protestant communities) had the opportunity to see a > rough cut of the movie and speak with Mel Gibson -- I was one of them. > I was stunned by the brutality and violence as well as the portrayal of > Jews in the movie. But, more significantly, I was overwhelmed by the > outpouring of emotion from the Christians who were part of the private > screening. And, from that moment, until today, I, along with many of > those present at that screening, have been engaged in the most > meaningful dialogue I have ever had with Christians. I have learned why > the movie is so meaningful to Christians; in turn, Christians have > learned why Jews are so upset by what the movie depicts. > > The lesson that I have learned in these last six months is that dialogue > is absolutely essential if something positive is to come from this > experience that all of us will have when the movie opens -- whether or > not you actually see the movie. I have faith that our Christian friends > and neighbors will not allow there to be an outbreak of anti-Semitism > related to the movie. But, I also understand why the ADL and the AJC > have been vigilant in educating both Jews and Christians about the > challenges the movie presents. And, I do have great concerns about the > movie being distributed through Europe and the Arab world -- where > anti-Semitism is at an all time high. > > So, what do we do? > > First, I would encourage you to visit the websites of the ADL, > http://www.adl.org/Interfaith/gibson_qa.asp, and the AJC, > http://www.ajc.org/upload/pdf/AJC_The_Passion_A_Resource_Manual.pdf. > Each site has excellent resource materials on the movie. > > Second, I would encourage you to attend a myriad of programs that will > occur throughout our community. I know that many of our local rabbis > plan to speak about the movie and offer educational programs at their > synagogues. As of the date of this email, two synagogues have programs > on the calendar. > > Congregation Beth Israel has planned several programs which can be > viewed at > http://www.beth-israel.org/bulletin/The_Passion.asp. > > Congregation Beth Yeshurun will be sponsoring a program at 7:30 pm on > Wednesday, February 25. Rabbi Rosen has already spoken about the movie; > his sermon can be viewed at http://bethyeshurun.org/passion.htm. > > Congregation Emanu El, as part of Shabbat Limmud, recently hosted > Professor Michael Cook who spoke about the movie. Some of Professor > Cook's materials are available for distribution. If you have interest, > email Myra Lipper at Emanu El with your request: > mailto:myral@emanuelhouston.org. > > Other synagogues may be planning programs, as well. You are welcome to > contact them, if interested. A list is available at: > http://www.houstonjewish.org/synagogues.asp. > > Third, talk to your Christian friends and neighbors. This is a time for > dialogue -- for making sure that Jews and Christians share their deepest > beliefs and concerns in a way that fosters mutual respect. And, if you > have questions about what your friends are saying, then refer back to > the websites and your rabbis to better understand the implications of > this movie for Christians. > > Fourth, think about the first time you saw "Schindler's List." I was > beset with raw emotion at the retelling of the defining chapter in > modern Jewish history. When Christians see "The Passion," it is likely > that they will feel similar raw emotions, for they will be seeing the > retelling of the defining chapter in the establishment of their faith. > It is their faith and we should respect their faith as we expect > Christians to respect ours. > > I was told before and after I saw the movie that Jews and Christians who > view the movie would in fact see two different stories -- that, in fact, > is what has happened (at least in my experience of viewing the rough > cut). But, this provides us an opportunity to strengthen our greater > Houston community through an open and honest exchange of ideas. Each > and every Christian that I have talked to about the movie has been open > to that exchange and I have every confidence that you will experience > similar discussion. > > By listening to each other -- Jews and Christians -- together, we can > build a better, more peaceful world. > > > Sincerely, > > > Lee Wunsch > Chief Executive Officer > Jewish Federation of Greater Houston > http://houstonjewish.org
wow...i think that's fantastic! one of my business partners has been invited to a Jewish temple where they will be holding a talk with Jews and Christians alike about the movie and what the story means to each. that's my hope for this movie...that there will be a greater understanding of who Jesus was..and who I believe him to be. I've already learned a ton of the Jewish perspective, as well, which has been great.
It sounds like he saw the viewing in Austin that was attended by Gibson. (I mentioned it in the other thread) No one knew it would be shown (except for a couple of people, apparently) and it was a rough cut. I hope this is an example of good, open dialogue between the faiths. Certainly a good start.
Yes...Then why were the bloody, violent details that Gibson is focusing on (jesus with a bloddy eye, etc) left out of the Gospels? They did not want people to focus on the suffering. They wanted people to focus on the bigger meaning. It was intentional.
That's one of my problems with this movie. Gibson is claiming it is true to the Gospels when he is actually rewriting them. I don't think that is right. I wish he would of just claimed this to be a purely artistic endevour, like Last Temptation, even if his intentions are good. I don't know if anyone could stay completely true to the gospels, maybe they should be left to speak for themselves.
