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The Parsons "Mistake"

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by justtxyank, Jul 17, 2014.

  1. napalm06

    napalm06 Huge Flopping Fan

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    Nice posts. Nice. All around. Nice.
     
  2. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

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    I don't think that is analogous at all.

    That's fair. Give me some time and I'll replace some of the posts in the OP with ones from other threads.

    I still don't agree with your position that I am misconstruing your position but I don't want to use your posts if you feel that I am using them disingenuously.
     
  3. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    It's Tweets like this that make me like us not matching that much more. While I hated it the first day, I've come off the ledge pretty quickly and seeing how delusional they are about this guy is fun.
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. TheRealAllpro

    TheRealAllpro Morey only fan

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    Let's not forget that if Dirk doesn't take a huge PAYCUT they don't have the money to sign Parsons. I believe Cuban was thinking hell with Dirk and Parsons at a combined 23-24 million that is a bargain.
     
  5. REEKO_HTOWN

    REEKO_HTOWN I'm Rich Biiiiaaatch!

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    Value? You mean owner stupidity? Charlotte and Dallas were so desperate to land someone that Parsons got a Max from Dallas. Even The Hornets got a better deal with Lance Stevenson.
     
  6. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"

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    I see two conversations.

    OP wanted to point out there were valid reasons to consider the RFA route, but unfortunately used Clutch's posts, removed from some important context.

    Clutch is saying that RFA route could have worked with a certain amount of diligence that was not duly carried out.

    Both points, to me, are correct and have merit. One is a big picture, and one is more in the details.

    My own guess is that Morey made two huge miscalculations: (1) the idea that Bosh started leaning toward us -- good head fake from Bosh and Morey bit it, hard; (2) the open market for Chandler, including possible "nuclear" offers like Cuban's, including the timing of those offers. Mainly, my opinion is that he didn't see Parsons offers, of that magnitude and with that timing.

    He usually has a lot of contingency plans, but maybe had too many balls in the air this time.

    Finally, where I disagree with Clutch (and McHale) is only the magnitude of this disaster. I personally think Parsons was offended earlier than free-agency by the comments about a 3rd star, so we would have had a one-year additional disgruntled rental of CP25, with no Ariza. (I don't think Ariza signs if we have Parsons, truly.)

    Aside: McHale is saying logical and understandable things, but it ticks me off as a fan. You really want to start out with your new 3 by bemoaning that your old 3 (statistically identical last year) is gone. That's a terrible way to start to a new and very important relationship. I hope the fans can be more welcoming of Ariza, who seems to want to be here.
     
  7. Remii

    Remii Member

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    Probably so...
     
  8. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    Actually I typically love using RFA but I guess its just because I'm a heartless b*stard.

    Misjudging the market might not be the greatest phrase to use. Maybe misread the situation.

    To expand on a couple things -

    -Arrogance of Morey - you might be right. However they typically line up literally 100's of contingencies going into every trade deadline, draft day, and free agency. Why this off season they were so much more all in this free agency is beyond me. Never has Morey "pushed his chips to the table" more than with this free agency. Morey is usually all about calculated risks. So I don't know about arrogance, but its a thought I'll at least wonder about. However its uncharacteristic in considering the calculated risks he's taken on previous moves.

    -Everything changed in the market after Lebron opted out & the new CBA projections came out. Morey had to see that crazy GM's around the league were going to go into dream mode, shed salary & plan on the SF of their dreams potentially agreeing to come to their city, and then ultimately convince themselves that Gordon Hayward, Parsons, and Ariza can be "their Lebron".

    -Morey should have known that Parsons ultimately wanted out to become a superstar, and should have known whether or not Parsons/Fegen were working with him or working against him to come back to Hou before June 30th. This is a communication issue, and something that should be noted.
     
  9. Clutch

    Clutch Administrator
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    I don't know how you can say that. Here's your "gotcha" post from 6+ months ago that was six weeks before the trade deadline:

    Here's what you're reading:

    Here's what you're ignoring:

     
  10. LabMouse

    LabMouse Member

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    Since Morey is looking a 3rd star, and Parsons is not one he is looking for, so there is no a mistake in the Parsons case. If you have a theory in your mind, then you take an action based on this theory. Likely Morey's mistake would be the 3rd star theory for a NBA title. Just because you get Howard because of a help from Kobe, does mean that you can have another star. A star would likely stay in the same team for more money, Howard case is an exception.
     
  11. vator

    vator Contributing Member

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    If you believe at all in cyberex's information, he had a few interesting comments about this situation.

     
  12. danoman

    danoman Contributing Member

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    What ever... look at it like this Parsons is the new Boozer (chasing money) he aint recruting anybody anymore, I'd be shocked if anybody takes him seriuosly.
     
  13. Aleron

    Aleron Contributing Member

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    Clutch, I'm not exactly sure, even in hindsight, not making him a RFA was a mistake, sure you could trade him, but he would have been basically forced to trade him.

    These are the dynamics in play for Morey

    Get Bosh, Parsons 1m - Now Parsons becomes what? 4th option, but due to Beverley's importance to the defensive structure, even less important than him so the least important starter. Any guarantees to keep him? nope, and the "they don't treat you like the star you are" becomes even more formidable.

    Get Bosh, match Parsons - costs more, but i now control him for at least 1 more year

    Option 2 wins

    No Bosh, 1m Parsons - Annoyed, wants his money, still wooable because still looking for 3rd option

    Parsons personality doesn't seem surprising to people who weren't eyes wide shut (that Portland series.....that foot in mouth....)

    If you lose him, 2015 SF market sucks

    Stupid offer Parsons - Large market for similar players in 2014, if Fegan is Morey's enemy, then Ariza's agent, Pelinka is the anti Fegan, Washington even said it themselves, they just couldn't win a bidding war because of the tax advantages, that's what's good about Pelinka, it's always about the money.

    Decent offer - match

    The only way we win is keep and trade, but even then, you're not going to get much, even Kevin Love is getting offers somewhere between yawn and crap because of that whole UFA bubble, so I mean you can argue there was an ideal path he could have chosen but from a pure risk management position with obvious lack of foresight abilities, the decision was right, the outcome non ideal.
     
  14. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

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    I think the first issue is you think the post is meant as a "gotcha" post on you and it really isn't.



    That's right. I just sent you an email about this.

    I am focusing on the key part of your post where you said RFA makes it less likely you lose Parsons. How can anyone say they can't think of a reason why Parsons was allowed into RFA? That's the reason right there. Bima touched on it and you touched on it. Whether you think it was a smart move wasn't my point. I don't think it was a smart move! The point was that there was a reason to do it that had nothing to do with the agent. The reason to do it was that RFA is a very good tool at keeping a player you want to keep that you might otherwise lose, which you said and Bima said.

    The rest of the stuff about under what circumstances you would or would not do it isn't really relevant to me. We actually agree that he shouldn't have done it and your tweet about Morey making a mistake by not treating Parsons as an asset and how that flies in the face of what people say about him is exactly how I feel.

    Regardless, within seconds of this post I will have amended the OP.
     
  15. Rip Van Rocket

    Rip Van Rocket Contributing Member

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    Hey, that's how the game works. Unfortunately, Morey didn't anticipate this.
     
  16. jedicro

    jedicro Member

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    That's a crazy comparison.

    There was no trade scenario in which we could get a big FA (Love, Rondo) while still keeping Parsons. Those trades scenarios were frozen because those teams wanted Parsons. Morey didn't want to choose. He wanted both. He gambled that he could get a bigger FA (Melo, Lowry, Bosh) and then match on Parsons. And there is no such thing as having a FA in the bag. You can't talk to them before July 1st, and the Parsons decision has to be made by June 30th.

    Let's play a what if game. What if we picked up Parsons option and still failed to bring in a big FA. We'd role into next year minus Asik and Lin (like now) and with Parsons pissed that we declined his contract. Then we go into FA next year with no guarantee from any other FA and a pissed off Parsons. The only other option would be to trade him, except Parsons would essentially have a no trade clause in that he could inform the other team that he won't extend. What if we strike out again? We could potentially lose Parsons in UFA next year and not have anything of value from any of it.

    In our current scenario, we at the very least have a Parsons replacement, and a couple very moveable assets with which to improve the team. Honestly, I think the number of quality replacement small forwards on the market this year played into Morey's decision.

    Morey gambled. He wanted to have his cake and eat it too, and it almost worked.
     
  17. Spacemoth

    Spacemoth Contributing Member

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    This is basically our version of Carlos Boozer on the Cavs. Huge mistake undoubtedly involving some parties lying through their teeth. No one will say how they feel as there is still future business to be conducted. Both the Mavericks and the Rockets are worse off for it. Mavs fans can sugarcoat it all they want, but their owner just acquired, out of sheer spite, the most overpaid athlete in the NBA. We'll get over it. They will too, but likely this is the endgame to their Dirk Nowitzki Era. They'll have to go full-on rebuild to recover.
     
  18. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    Not sure I agree with that at all. The Rockets offer the same amount of $ in alot of cases, and the whole 5 year contract extension being a factor is a thing of the past. Lebron just signed for 2 years.... Howard signed with an opt out after 3, Parsons signed with an opt out after 2.

    What do most stars want now.... to get paid A. have contract flexibility B. and to Win C. Had Bosh's priorities been to win a championship, and have contract flexibility, the choice would have been an easy one. The Rockets could have given him player contract flexibility at the max much like Lebron got & given him the best possible winning situation. If Bosh ends up having a bad situation on the court it doesn't matter.... he can't go anywhere. Him and the Heat are married to each other one way or another.


    Morey's mistake is operating under the notion that stars do want to win over everything & that they aren't operating under the notion that they want to be a X player (Heat or Mav in Bosh/Dirk's case) for life & that they value their home life more than their on the court/financial life. In Bosh's case, he mis-evaluated where his priorities lie. The second mistake was that he didn't get a strong enough commitment to make the Lin trade prematurely. If he did get that commitment than shame on Chris Bosh.

    Had the situation been different.. maybe a star along the lines of Kevin Love or Rondo, at a different place in their career where they just wanted to win above all, get a max contract, and have contract flexibility Houston is a great destination.
     
  19. clos4life

    clos4life Member

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    Excellent post OP.
     
  20. vator

    vator Contributing Member

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    Slightly off topic, but they also lost Vince Carter, Djuan Blair, and probably Shawn Marion in the process. All important rotation players and the jury is out on whether the Calderon/Dalembert for Tyson Chandler/Felton was a good deal.
     

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