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The Other Way to Beat Fronting

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by RocketsPimp, Apr 22, 2009.

  1. ferrarif1286

    ferrarif1286 Member

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    blazer made it no secret they are gonna change their yao ming game plan and that includes double, fronting, and ppl mentioned oden and pryzbella playing together. With 3 days to prepare, how the **** did yao still end up having 6 field goals
     
  2. alexcapone

    alexcapone Member

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    Read what the OP wrote. Yao's jumpshot is just one option as part of the counter. The others include Brooks and Lowry penetration that will be less contested at the rim because Portland bigs will have to come out. Also, Scola and Artest will have more free space inside to post up.
     
  3. baller4life315

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    I don't know if i'd go that far. We did okay with the ball reversal and swinging it to Wafer on the weakside for essentially open lanes to the basket. That's a good counterstrike to the fronting but at the same time the fact remains that Portland was able to keep the ball out of Yao's hands thus making their gameplan effective.

    Given how effective the fronting defense is at containing Yao, I would love to understand the argument against bringing Yao out 15+ feet away from the basket. Our entire offense is predicated upon getting Yao touches, is it not? If Yao is getting smothered by fronting defenders, picking up careless offensive fouls trying to get around these guys and getting taken out of the game offensively -- how can you argue it's a bad idea to bring Yao out to a wide open spot (15-20 feet) where nobody can deny him the ball? He has the range to make those type of shots. Plus, it creates a variety of options with all the PnR'ing and PnPopping you can do with that open space. Why is this idea scoffed at by some? Would you rather leave Yao in trenches fighting for positioning he's never going to get (and picking up offensive fouls) or would you rather see him in a spot where he can easily get the ball in his hands?
     
  4. guangzu

    guangzu Member

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    I don't think the problem is lacking of patient (yeah, coach said that also), it's the problem of court vision, I saw this many many times, when Yao's briefly open, not many Rox can see or react that quick, they already accepted that Yao can not be opened, can not be reached. it's just too damned 'brief' for them, hence goes point guard issue
     
  5. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I like the suggestion and noted in another thread that Adelman had success with doing this with an even slower Sabonis. I don't think this is something that is done constantly but something that is thrown into the mix to keep Portland guessing.
     
  6. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Member

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    I'm with you. Clearly, it is okay to discuss stretches within the games or games within the season, where offense has been the issue. But it wasn't the issue last night. Defense was.

    That said, if discussing fronting....I've still never figured out why they don't use Yao in more pick and rolls...NOT with the intent of getting the guard open, getting Yao open for a 15 footer, or even having Yao rolling. But use a pick and roll early in the shot clock, with Yao, and Aaron, as an example, where the only goal is to create some minimal confusion defensively that allows Yao to post-up on either block.

    I also think - and have thought all season - that they need to run more options on some of their basic Yao post up plays, the most obvious being the pick across the lane play. In 50% of those plays, the team would be better off just not running the play at all and having Yao post up on the side of the lane he's on, because the defense has already anticipated the play in question. They need to take advantage of that. Instead of Yao running all the way across the lane, trying to utilize a pick that rarely works, one option would be for Yao to just go half-way across the lane and try and post up in the middle there, where he is highly effective, or do a complete reversal, and come back to the original side.

    just some thoughts.
     
  7. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    We were fortunate enough to have some players step up. That's awesome.

    But when you can't get your first offensive option the ball...and when he ends up with 6 FGA...that's a problem. And just because you scored 100 doesn't mean you couldn't have scored more if he had the ball...efficiency numbers suggest he will. It's up to him to get position...it's up to the team to make a priority of getting him the ball.
     
  8. HeWhoIsLunchbox

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    Those bigs won't have to come out to guard Yao if he isn't hitting those shots. So, once again, it's relying on Yao's ability to consistently hit those shots. I'm not saying this isn't a good option for the Rockets to go to; I'm simply playing the devil's advocate. This is one of many options that the coaching staff should try when confronted with fronting defenses.
     
  9. roxwin

    roxwin Member

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    Beats those kind of fronting ( grabbing,shaving,pushing,etc and without foul called)we need DH not Yao.Because DH is untouchable,at this point,DH>>>>Yao,untouchable>>>>>>>>unstoppable
     
  10. Chronz

    Chronz Member

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    Was that a joke or were you serious
     
  11. mrc

    mrc Member

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    1. Run more tacs for Scola if Yao's getting front or double. Look how he played with Argentina. His jump shot is good, he can dribble better than many SF in the league, his layup = magic. 30 pts is not hard for him if he get enough shots.

    2. Yao use his body to block the fronting guy, he got strong legs, shouldn't be too hard for him. Then Lowry or Vafer attack from weak side, dunk or pass to Yao.

    Might not be the best choice, but better than someone who dribble 15 seconds & throw the ball to teammates when time's up.

    3. Yao! use ur fking elbow! t-foul? who cares.
     
  12. Bustnani

    Bustnani Member

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    Yao will make a great Brad Miller in RA's offense lol
     
  13. nodstonothing

    nodstonothing Member

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    Someone else probably has already mentioned this but if the Blazers are gonna go super big and put Oden and Pryz on Yao, we should try playing Brian Cook. The guy is 6'10'' and is a 40% three point shooter in his playoff career. Either Oden or Pryz is going to have to go out to the three point line and guard him or he is going to be wide open. With Mutumbo gone, I think this strategy is worth trying for a few minutes when the Blazers go with their "twin towers" thing.
     
  14. tiger0330

    tiger0330 Member

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    I agree, look at the number of games that we lose when Yao is effectively fronted. If he doesn't get the ball down low, you pretty much have a Xmas ornament for a center. At least when he is in the high post he can take a wide open J, set a pick for a shooter or pass to a cutter.
     
  15. mugrakers

    mugrakers Member

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    Just hit your damn free throws and we will be fine.
     
  16. SeeingRocketRed

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    Man, did you guys see the open lanes to the basket when Yao was fronted? It was like 5th avenue in there. I hope they keep fronting him and Wafer, Lowry, and Scola get 40 each. It's a r****ded gimmicky defense that leaves the lane open and Yao right there to clean up any misses on layups (which don't come off the rim too far).

    I just don't want to see Yao hurt with Pryzbilla's attempts at wrestling moves. Yao is so much bigger, stronger, and better, but he's not allowed to respond to the cheap shots they are attempting to give him. One day he's going to snap and just rip them apart with his bare hands, and the league will wonder what happened. You have to protect your players. You can't allow dirty play, cheap shots, and flopping.
     
  17. ibm

    ibm Member

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    good post.

    layups. that's the key word right there. that means we need to DRIVE more. shooting jumpers is good, but scolandry or ron isn't exactly reggie miller. a drive is more reliable, and yao has a much better chance to get the rebound with a layup or shot jumper rather anything outside of 20 feet.
     
  18. RocketsBearFan

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    It's pretty obvious that Adelman didn't really prepare to beat fronting. Well, he prepared in the sense that he just didn't factor Yao into the offense at all. It was the easiest option and the option that required the coach to discipline his players the least. The player friendly option, you could say. Per Adelman's coaching style, he let the players work it out for themselves, which in this case means RonRon going chuckchuck and Brooks going dribbledribble.
     
  19. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    But if the other team is looking to lock down the primary offensive option does it make sense to keep on trying to force feed that option? The playoffs are all about adjustments and I believe the Adelman knew fronting Yao was coming which is why you saw the team run more and Wafer, Brooks, and Lowry drive more aggressively.

    Yao is our best option but if you look back on some of the previous playoff series forcefeeding Yao didn't always result in wins and as showed in that terrible Utah game where only 4 Rockets scored results in both ugly and ineffective basketball.

    I would rather continue to see offensive balance than just completely focussing on Yao. The Blazers know how to shut down Yao, everybody does, but that is where we adjust to force them from just collapsing on Yao.
     
  20. michecon

    michecon Member

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    Let's face it. As pathetic as 6 shots is, the game is lost in the last 3 minutes. When you don't have good decision maker in a close game, all the strategy is mute. Has Rockets won many close games in the last 3 minutes the whole regular season? I don't remember many.
     

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