If Steve could be half of what Iverson is, we would have made the playoffs sometime in the past four years. The comparisons between these two guards will be a short list. I am in no way discrediting Steve's athletic ability but Francis does not have the tangibles or intangibles to do what Iverson does on the court.
It may be a tired point, but it's true -- put Philly in the West and some of those AI-led squads wouldn't make the playoffs either.
I am absolutely agree. I have been saying for sometime that a playmaker, pass-first point guard is the key to JVG's system, it is the key to Ming's development, it is the key to utilizing a power forward, it is the key to the Rocket's progress. Jackson's few minutes prove the point. When you get the pass is everything. A true point guard is the engine that can drive this team to the playoffs and beyond. We need a young one, and Mark Jackson can coach him. I am convinced that M.J. can probably improve Francis' game in this regard, but much of this is instinctual. Francis is not geared like Jackson. As I have said many times, Francis needs another role or to be moved. In your heart, you know I am right.
The Rockets need a point guard who was taught in high school and college how to pass. The Rockets don't need a scoring point guard because the guys on the court for the Rockets can all score. Steve is learning on the job how to pass. That's like telling someone to go learn how to ride a bike a few months before being in the Tour de France. Rockets management will realize how important a legit passer is to this team soon enough.
It's true that Steve one in the same caliber of Iverson? As an amateur scout who has devoted time and effort into judging players and their abilities on the courts, I can tell you that this assessment is not as "true" as you think it is. And speaking of tired points, it is awfully preposterous to keep saying put so and so in the west or put so and so in the east.
Our team doesn't lose much when Mark Jackson enters the game. Yeah, he's a little slow so he could get burned by lots of todays starting PGs, but in limited minutes he's definitely an asset. I really enjoyed watching him last night. Lots more entertaining than watching Moochie dribble the ball for 23 seconds
He is also going to show Steve how to do things the EASY way and to get teamates good looks. Getting Mark Jackson was a season saving move. DD
what the hell? The old picture in his NBA profile was him smiling. Now his new picture has him grunting? Are they secretly sending a message or something?
Your original post stated: "If Steve could be half of what Iverson is, we would have made the playoffs sometime in the past four years." So I deduce that leading a team to the postseason is part of your criteria in comparing these players. Do you not agree that if Houston was in the East, they would have made the playoffs twice in the last four years? It's a hypothetical statement, but so is yours.
Both being hypothetical statements does not make them one in the same. The rational behind the two differs where in which my statement is commenting more on a comparison between players abilities and yours consists more of a comparison between the teams abilities within each others conference. Be it a slight difference in reasoning, but none the less, a difference.
Let's not go crazy. The Rockets have markedly improved over the last 10 games without him. I agree that he was a good pick up. I thought it was a positive move when it happened, but I wouldn't go that far. Francis will never have the court vision of Jackson. He just isn't built that way and that's fine. Ultimately, Francis doesn't need to be Jackson or Stockton to be a solid point guard or to lead the Rockets. Jackson's main lesson should be patience. I think of it like a running back in the NFL. Young running backs try with all their might when they don't see a giant hole in front of them immediately to run to the corner and beat the defenders there. Mostly, they can't because defenses are so much faster than in college. Backs who have experience and real talent know that they must wait for the play to develop, allow their blockers to get into position and THEN hit the hole. Francis is a guy who just doesn't know how to slow down and be patient which is why Jackson is probably the ideal teacher because Jackson doesn't have the ability to speed up. This doesn't mean Francis will suddenly turn into Jason Kidd. He still prefers to be the finisher on the break as opposed to the guy running down the middle of the floor leading it and that is just something built into his playing psyche. But, he can learn to minimize turnovers, make the smart pass and slow the game down. If he does that, it will be enough. The big problem with Francis at point is that he cannot run the break. When he is in the half court, he seems to posses pretty decent court vision. He can spot men going to the basket and hit them with fairly good results. He can also drive and dish to the open shooter. It's just that, for Francis to get assists, either he or the guy he's passing to needs to be standing still. When he stands there at the top of the key and hits cutters through the lane or alley-oops to Mobley, he is either at a standstill or barely moving. When he dishes out to shooters on a drive, they are standing still. It is when he AND his teammate are on the move that he REALLY struggles, which is why the fast break is so non-existant with him on the floor. I would LOVE if the Rockets had a 2 guard or small forward who could handle the ball for running the break and/or occassionally giving Steve a break from point guard duties in the half court. But, it will have to be someone big enough to defend the 2 or the 3 because none of us wants Steve guarding the off guard.
Watching MJ control the flow of the offense was very refreshing for a change. It didn't hurt that Yao and Mo were on fire, but watching MJ and Yao in the two-man game was poetic at times. This is going to burn oppossing defenses throughout the season and hopefully into the playoffs. MJ is quite a pickup for us, especially if he can continue to contribute in this manner. I did, however, get a bit squimish every time MJ was having to guard Marbury...he just looked like he was gonna buckle on a crossover.
He was doing that last year for the first 20 games or so and you guys complained that he shot it too much.
Two things that impressed me about MJ are: 1. Court vision and passing ability are much superior to any of our current players. 2. He still has his post up game
Excellent analogy, and I really hope you are right on the second point. What is obvious to you and I is obviously not obvious to some posters on this board. Team First! No individual part is greater that the whole, no matter how much potential, how entertaining, or how long they have been here.
I don't think we need a true PG. I think we need Steve to: 1. Run the break slightly less terribly (agreed, Jeff) 2. Throw the entry pass more correctly and often. 3. Take less time on offense. With the make-up of the team, I don't think a classic PG is necessary, because we have enough players who can make their own shots. Doesn't matter who's giving the ball to players like Yao, Mo T, or Mobley... they can make things happen.
A true point guard, as you witnessed last night, doesn't just feed the ball like you feed a parking meter; timing, position, speed, accuracy are all critical. When these factors don't come together you get a misdirected pass, a lazy pass, an ill-timed pass, an inaccurate pass, an out-of-position pass. All of these factors affect the accuracy of the subsequent shot and can and usually do result in a turnover. Last night we witnessed Ming and Taylor (though he did create some of this shots) getting the ball at the right time in the right position. It makes all the difference
Amen to that. And in the NBA, a split second makes a difference. getting the ball in the right position at the right time is the difference between an uncontested shot in rhythm and a contested shot that is forced. What's the point in beating the defense and forcing it to rotate and double when your final pass is delayed and inaccurate and allows the defender to catch up and contest the shot.
I didn't see this posted anywhere, but if it is, my bad. I thought this article fit well in this thread. ------------------------------------------------ Jackson's first action shows he can lend a helping hand By FRAN BLINEBURY Copyright 2004 Houston Chronicle FISH swim. Birds fly. Mark Jackson passes. The oldest and newest Rocket checked into the game with just over seven minutes left in the first half Wednesday night, and less than 60 seconds later everyone inside Toyota Center knew why. There was Jackson, an itinerant point guard playing for his seventh NBA franchise, coming down the middle of the floor and spotting the reason the Rockets' future is so big running at his side. Wham! Bam! A no-look pass to Yao Ming nearly produced a slam dunk and did draw a two-shot foul. This is how Jed Clampett felt when that bubbling crude came up through the ground in the backyard. "Oh, it's so nice," said Jackson. "To have someone so big to pass to. Someone with that skill level. Someone who can do all of the things Yao can do." Someone who, even at 7-6, can look that much taller and more imposing when he's getting the ball in all of the right places from someone who knows how to put it there. This is what happens when the great ones play the game -- they make it look easy for everybody else. And in his own way, Jackson is one of the great ones, for the way he has driven and persisted and thrived to climb into the No. 2 spot all-time on the NBA assist list. Dogs bark. Cats meow. In a predominantly me-first league, Jackson is an entirely different kind of animal. "I mean, it's how a guy who is probably as slow laterally as any human who's ever played in the NBA is arguably a Hall of Fame player," Rockets coach Jeff Van Gundy said. Jackson moves up and down the floor like a crab with a bad case of arthritis, yet he always manages to put himself or the ball into the right spot. A bounce pass here. A chest pass there. A no-look shovel pass. A little drop-off over his shoulder the way he used to do it in the old days in New York with Patrick Ewing. Jackson signed a 10-day contract, and there he was in his Rockets debut leading the team as its quarterback in the final eight minutes, taking what had become a close game and blowing it open. Give Yao credit for a season-high 29 points, a career-high dozen field goals and an impressive 10 rebounds as he continues to build and string solid games together. Yet on the occasion of the Lunar New Year, when the Chinese traditionally exchange gifts, the big man was often on the receiving end from Jackson. "I think I need to get some more eyes to see where he is going to pass the ball," Yao said. "There's a phrase from China that's similar to `manna from heaven.' It is, `Something good to eat falls from the sky.' When he passes, it's like that." It is also like watching a conductor lead the orchestra, seeing a grandmaster make all the right moves around the chess board. Give the 38-year-old veteran in his 17th pro season credit for showing the Rockets how it can be done. Steve Francis leaped up off the bench several times in delight and amazement at what he'd just seen Jackson do. Van Gundy, in between fretting about whatever it is that makes him constantly fret, even allowed a smile or two. "That's why I brought Mark in here," he said. "I know who he is. I know what he can do." Just don't ask Van Gundy about Jackson's attempt at a cute little wraparound pass to Yao late in the fourth quarter. Jackson bounced the ball off the floor with a little extra side spin and almost got it all the way down to the post to Yao. Francis again leaped off the bench. Yao barely knew what was coming his way. "Please, don't let him fool you on that one," Van Gundy pleaded. "Don't let him suck you in. That wasn't a good pass." Yet there are probably so many of the good kind left in Jackson, even at his age, even with his old bones. Jackson isn't getting any slower, simply because that's probably not possible. "I'm not sure anything that he does can be taught," Van Gundy said. "Most of the things he does as a player are about his vision on the court, and you either have that or you don't." Jackson developed that vision, that ability to see the openings, anticipate the plays that could happen, out of utter necessity. "Since I was a kid, I knew I was slower than everybody else on the floor," he said. "I was never going to outrun or outjump anybody. I had to learn to outthink them. I had to learn the game completely. "Truth is, if I wasn't this slow, I probably wouldn't be the player that I am. It forced me to learn, to understand." That has allowed him to outlast, to outwit, to survive, even coming off last season when there were rumors circulating out of Utah that he was a bad influence in the Jazz locker room. "I don't think three different organizations would have taken me back a second time if those things were true," Jackson said. "I always knew I was coming back into the league, because I believe in God, and I didn't think He would let it end the way that it did in Utah." With three more against the Knicks, that career assist total is now up to 10,218. Mark Jackson had to learn. Now it's who he is. ------------------------------------------------
Unless that person is Yao, right? The truth in the NBA is that the best teams are usually those with the best players. The individual parts, no matter how we'd like to think, are often more important than the whole. VERY RARELY does the team with the best player not end up, at the very least, in the finals if not winning the championship. Jordan, Olajuwon, Duncan, Shaq, etc. We'd all love for the whole team to matter more, but this isn't football. This is a team sport with a strong emphasis on the great individual no matter which way you slice it. This isn't to say Steve is that guy. He's not and I don't think he'll ever be MVP-calliber despite being one of the top guards and in the top 20 or 25 players overall. It is just the reality that if you want to win championships or even get there, you have to have one of the top 3 or 4 players in the league on your team.
