You know, since jgreen91 brought up the word "pwned," let's take a stroll back through time. (Yes, I know that I've made wrong plenty of wrong predictions here myself, as have all of us. We all make mistakes. The reason this merits a flashback is because jgreen is somehow still talking smack, two years after the fact, as if Bush's performance has proven his arguments to be correct.) I'll let the BBS judge. http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=116915&page=4&pp=20&highlight=Bush http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=118907&page=2&highlight=Bush (This one is particularly funny because jgreen comes into this thread talking team smack about the Saints in 2006 and calling me out for not thinking they'd do well... when he thought the SAME THING!) http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=116915&highlight=Bush http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=117915&page=2 http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=117556&page=2 http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=117556&page=2&pp=20&highlight=Bush http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=115747&page=2&pp=20&highlight=Bush (LOL!) http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=116613&page=7&pp=20&highlight=Bush But the biggest "pwn" of all... on August 13, 2006, before Bush and Mario had even played a single down of real NFL football: http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=116613&page=5&pp=20&highlight=Bush (Funny thing -- I immediately called you on that post, with, by saying You can't make a mistake before a single real game has been played. Sorry. You can predict it, but talking about it as if it's some matter of fact statement based on one run in a completely and utterly meaningless game that nobody cared about is a joke.) Almost two years to the day later, on August 14, 2008: And with that, the defense rests and will let the BBS decide who was "pwned" when it comes to the subject of Reggie Bush.
I'll agree the first few games were tough, but he looked good once he played end exclusively until he got banged up. Still love Young and think he'll become a good (hope great) player, but Mario is much safer as he is already the man.
To get back on topic, I agree with Joe Joe that Williams had a more productive first season than people realize. The problem is that a lot of folks struggle evaluating defensive ends and only do so through sacks, and that's a mistake. A good example is in the Colts' Super Bowl year... anyone who watched them regularly that year knew that Dwight Freeney was an absolute force from a pass rushing standpoint. Yet, he only had 5.5 sacks on the season (only 2.5 before Week 14) and no sacks in the divisional round, AFC Championship or the Super Bowl. Why? Sacks, quite simply, are random. If you're consistently drawing double- and triple-teams, you probably won't get the sack yourself, but you deserve "credit" for a sack or pressure every bit as much as the guy who actually gets it. Good example of the reverse is the Denver game. Mario's a great player, but of those 3.5 sacks -- 2 were literally handed to him on a silver platter based on circumstances. Early in the season, when Mario wasn't piling up the sacks in big numbers, I remember Kubiak talking about how on film Mario did an outstanding job -- and a lot of fans laughed at him for saying that. In all honesty, I agreed with him. Sacks are kinda like TD/INT ratio -- over the course of a few years, the cream will rise to the top. But when you're talking about one individual season or specifically one or two games in a given season, the numbers don't necessarily tell you a whole lot about how dominant the player was (or wasn't). As such, I think people tend to undervalue his rookie season a bit. Before the foot injury, I thought he made plays on a regular basis. There was one statistic in particular I remember -- in the Oakland game, the Raiders rushed 22 times... three were to Mario's side of the line. That says a lot.
This is one of the reasons I am happy with Mario...he positively impacts both the running and the passing game of the opposing team. The way the NFL is going, it seems like having speedy linebackers will be a must to help out in the passing game. Speedy LBs need the DLine to make plays in the running game or at the very least keep the big boys off of them. Diles, Adibi, and Ryans aren't the biggest guys.
Yes! I win at the Internets. I managed to have the Cat waste 4-5 hours of his life digging through the old Bush/VY thread!!! Mission accomplished. I'll admit, I was wrong about the Texans decision, as were 90% of the other fans. However, I did freak out and had the same reaction when the Texans took Carr and not Peppers, so I'm 1-1 Texans #1 draft pick predictions. But I'm still sticking to my guns and I believe Reggie Bush will be a very good NFL running back. I also believe that no matter what he does on the field, the Cat will not acknowledge it so this argument, as it has always been from day 1, is worthless.
Or should I go dig up all of your incorrect predictions from that very thread??? Nah, there are too many. Ya know, around the same time Clutch changed your title to "village idiot" or something along those lines.... ?
The irony of a six-year member with 1,500 posts that's still a "rookie" talking smack over a title is delicious. Actually, you're more than welcome to look up those very threads -- I'd love to see what predictions I've made on Williams/Bush/Young that have ended up incorrect. But you still don't get it. I acknowledge that I've made plenty of wrong predictions here. (Hell, I was president of the Mo Taylor fan club at one point.) So have all of us. It's part of being a sports fan -- you get some right, you get some completely wrong. But if you're wrong on a subject, you don't come back after the fact, as you did in this thread, and gloat with terms like "pwned" when all the evidence makes you look foolish. When it comes to Williams/Bush, I stood by the Texans and said they made the right choice. Your very own words in this thread show that you agree with me. So I really am a little curious what "incorrect predictions" I've made on this issue. (Don't try and stray off-topic -- you're the one who said "that very thread," so go right ahead. The links are right there for you -- I've even saved you the trouble of having to search.)
I just woke up and saw this junk....again! Kitty Cat, you need a girlfriend. This is just ridiculous. Way too much time on your hands. Don't feel you need to prove us your greatness. We know you know everything. Go to: www.lavalife.com. I'll pay for any membership fees. I swear!!! Clutchfans.net are my witnessess.
I want a membership to a dating site too! But make it Catholic singles for me. Other than scouts bringing up mario's name as draft day got closer, I knew nothing about him. I even bought in to the bush propaganda and those cool youtube videos where reggie moonwalked his way into the end zone. At the time, I think Bill parcells was the only one to come out and defend the pick, by saying he would have made the same decision. And though casserly didn't make the pick as he likes to brag on cbs, the fact that he asked people to blame him and not the organization took a lot of courage. He did so even knowing that his days were numbered. Maybe one day, when we look back, the legacy of charlie will be..... liberator and not villain. I'm looking through my hard drive for big puma's upsetness over the texans not choosing reggie.
williams did not have a very productive first year and even kubiak made comments about his non effectiveness. he had a great second year, let's not rewrite history. he showed flashes his first year, but too many times he was handled by one offensive linemen and stood up. looking back it may have been more technique than anything else but he was not productive
wow, i didn't think people still had delusions of bush and how "good" he is. He is a good piece but does not carry an offense and like others have made it painfully clear, he was (at best) the 4th best player on offense. If you consider that a "major role" than ok. Point being, bush had a lot of "protection" around him. Last season he didn't have as much and we saw what happened when he was forced to be more than a pass catching/safety valve RB.
FYI. I got demoted a few months ago for posting while drunk. Clutch, I think this thread earns my "member" status back. Only a wiley veteran like myself could bring The Cat out of the woodworks and make him waste 4-5 hours of his life in that old classic VY/Bush novel of a thread.
I can't wait for the 2025 Hall of Fame induction thread, when Mario's Hall of Fame induction evokes arguments about the then long-forgotten (outside of Clutchfans and Austin) Reggie Bush and Vince Young. Perhaps the greatest hindsight is how good that USC line was. They made Reggie Bush, Lendale White, and Matt Leinart all look like 1st round draft picks.
I think perpetuating the ancient Mario/Reggie/Vince arguement that has been rehashed ad nauseum on this BBS is plenty reason enough to LEAVE you with rookie status.
Here's the hilarious thing... you posted the "pwned" at 9:00. I posted a different reply at 9:05. I then posted the links at 9:42. So, at most, it took 37 minutes... even though I was at work and splitting time between research and, you know, doing my actual job. Anyway, care to explain how it's even remotely possible to spend 4-5 hours, given the time stamps? Also, nice little sidestep -- you've said repeatedly that it would be EASY to find my quotes from those threads with incorrect predictions of mine -- in fact, you used the phrase "too many." Where are they? Bring it.
I agree with you by and large -- but if you'll notice, at the end I added "before the foot injury." I think that was a big factor as well and why I was a little more optimistic about him going into season two than some people were.
I will not take this bait. I will not stoop to your level of thread digging. If someone else wants to do it, fine. But all of us, and I mean all of us who have been around for a couple of years, KNOW that you have been wrong more often than you have been right. We'll talk after the season this year and see where we stand. I think Bush will have a BIG year. You think he's Kevin Faulk.
