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The Harden hate has to stop

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by swedish-olajuwon, Sep 11, 2020.

  1. dmoneybangbang

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    LOL.... Yes..... let the person with the higher TS% take the shot.... You are almost there but you can't open your mind.

    Harden TOV % playoffs 2020: 13.9%
    WB TOV % playoffs 2020: 16.3%

    They both turn it over with high frequency.....

    Not really. WB and Harden were the highest scoring duo post Capela trade and until he got injured.... WB sucked this playoffs and his buddy Harden didn't do anything to make it easier on him.

    However, lets not forget the amazing stretch the WB/Harden had just because it's inconvenient.
     
  2. dmoneybangbang

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    LOL. All you can do is keep posting the same graph that shows Harden can get his and still get bounced from the playoffs in an embarrassing fashion. It wasn't even competitive the last two games....

    Where's the graph for "heart" and "grit"?

    I have been, you're just too stubborn to accept that harden has any fault in this.
     
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  3. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    The problem is I CANNOT TRUST THE GUY to get Harden the ball. He's not going to get it to Harden because A. Harden demands more attention and B.And most importantly he's a bad decision maker.

    Ahhh yea but the differnce is

    Harden 36 Assist %
    Westbrook: 26 Assist %

    Do you know how massive of a gap that is looooooool. Harden can find his man. Westbrook will turn it over more with more tries while also still being garbage at finding people.

    That highest scoring duo doesnt mean crap. It really does not. He was still at league average efficiency wise even post trade. We had to trade Capela BECAUSE of him. Harden got doubled and he still coulndt go to work. Because he sucks. Giving him the ball to suck more wasnt change anythig.

    What amazing stretch, you mean the stretch where Harden was STILL carrying. But Westbrook only lineups were still garbage.
     
  4. bmelo

    bmelo Member

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    Harden didnt loose this series. He gave exactly what is expected nor less no more, if you compare him to MJ of course its a failure but if you are rational you knew what he is capable of and he gave his all
     
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  5. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    I'd like to see anyone drag Westbrook to a championship, you are truly a GOAT if you can do that.
     
  6. dmoneybangbang

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    Let's zoom out and look at the real capabilities:

    WB Career: 42.3% Playoff: 38.9%
    Harden Career: 32.2% Playoff: 32.2%

    Actually WB was plying some of the best basketball during that stretch, that really started in January. Harden is most certainly the better player, but the fact you have to be so dishonest about WB says a lot. I want the team to win, you seem to want Harden to win.
     
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  7. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    Replace Westbrook w Anthony Davis and then you can talk about Harden. Or replace Harden with Lebron and then instant championship I suppose. Geesh
     
  8. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    LOL, Westbrook got to play Durant and Paul George those numbers are inflated as hell. Those assist% for Westbrook have been getting worse since his MVP season. Harden is very clearly the better passer today. Which is why I posted the numbers from this year. Westbrook has been on a decline for a long time and its only going to get worse.

    And YET, our Westbrook only lineups were STILL NEGATIVE. They still sucked when Westbrook was by himself. It was Harden dragging him then and it was Harden dragging him now. Westbrook got to play with Paul George the last three years and Harden still led teams with better offensive efficiency. Harden ONLY lineups are still better without Westbrook. His defense is also terrible. Im not being dishonest about him, I've looked at all his impact metrics since his MVP season, they got worse EVERY YEAR. His TS% is waaaay below league average in the playoffs. His net rating was second worse on our team.

    So no, I dont think the incredibly stupid idea of giving the guy who cant do anything with a 4V3 the ball more while putting Harden off ball will do anything. He's a poor decision maker. And he's shown that his whole career.
     
    #148 HP3, Sep 14, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2020
  9. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    If Lebron's presence can get you Bertan Davis type of shooters for cheap.....not impossible.
     
  10. dmoneybangbang

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    Harden got to play with two elite PNR finishers in Howard and Capela plus CP3 who is a great shooter..... Never claimed WB was a better passer just that he's proven he can a great playmaker, which is pretty clear if you can't put aside your biases.

    The difference between Harden and WB shooting is vastly different than their passing ability.

    Again.... I'm not claiming WB is better than Harden. I'm wanting Harden to better compliment WB's strengths and weaknesses. We saw it be very effective for a stretch of a season and we saw them do at OKC.... you act like there isn't a blueprint and we have no choice but to rely on Harden ISO.

    I get it.... I am a Rocket's fan and you are a Harden fan.
     
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  11. dmoneybangbang

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    It's moot point since that won't ever happen with our current roster/cap situation....

    Harden has to work with he has.
     
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  12. wekko368

    wekko368 Member

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    And he's here because of Harden.
     
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  13. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Depends, Westbrook is one of the better lob passers. Houston does not have a true C.

    Westbrook is a decent passer to the corners and to 3 pt shooters....... used in the Rockets lineup.

    Russ doesn't do bounce passing very often, rarely does behind the back passing. That is what Harden does.

    Harden replaced Westbrook's identity as a passer IMO. Harden is the more versatile passer.

    I can see that WB's only advantage is rebounding and Harden is a capable rebounder too.
     
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  14. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Do you know we tried to trade Dwight because he wanted to post up more and wouldnt run Pick and Roll...also he just sucked in general? And are you really comparing Capela to Paul George or Durant??? Seriously dude. And Cp3 is not a score first guy, he never has been. Westbrook USED to be a great play maker, he's been on the decline since his MVP season. His scoring has also gotten worse every year in the playoffs.

    That wasnt the case this year was it? He's in decline. He's not gonna get better. And if he's that much of a scoring liablity he's never gonna win ever and the impact metrics bared that out. PG and Durant both left him because of that.

    No, Im a fan of both. But I will criticize Harden when he deserves it. Not when he has to drag a bad player. And Harden was far and way our best player. You just want to blame him for not giving up the ball to a guy who's our second worst player(and yea thats what the numbers say) in the playoffs. He's been bad now and he's been bad the last three years. We arent winning with him. And its Harden's fault for getting him here.

    I want to trade Westbrook and honestly...if Harden doesnt like it....than we are over, we have to trade both.
     
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  15. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    I think it is unfortunate that Capela got hurt and so Russ never was able to build chemistry with him.
     
  16. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Yes, that would suggest Harden is a bad GM off the court.

    Management would start to make their own free agent picks and trades without consulting Harden more and more.

    It's going downhill for sure.
     
    HP3 likes this.
  17. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    I think Capela wasn't going to stay though, because they gave him a pretty lucrative contract and I do not see Capela becoming a star.

    That's probably his ceiling, I could be wrong though.

    And they did need that money and spot for Roco.
     
  18. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    The problem I have, and maybe he wasn't because Tilman is cheap, is that we won't find another big as good as Capela was. Won't happen.

    Roco is a nice player to have but no doubt he's easier to replace than bigs like Capela.
     
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  19. dmoneybangbang

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    Did you know that Harden assist % went from 50% to 35% under MDA while WB increased his without Durant but with PG and Adams?

    WB isn't as bad as passer as you think he is despite whatever silly "but but but" you come up with. Russ and Harden are elite PNR, but we prefer ISO under MDA. It's great for Harden's scoring numbers but the results are the results.

    You mean the year he was traded and was injured throughout the playoffs?

    I blame Harden for doing what he did to CP3, not help him elevate his teammate. It's pretty simple, Harden should do more catch and shooting with a player like WB. To say WB can't run an offense without PG/Durant/whoever is easiness or at the very least run some action with harden is asinine and shows your bias.
     
  20. dmenacela

    dmenacela Contributing Member

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    It never stops until he gets a ring.

    Harden always gets destroyed in the play offs.

    So sad. Same story every year.

    Typical.
     

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