The Gas Tax

To be clear, you might consider me old, so watch it!

The problems this country has, so many "given" to us by the Bush administration and the former Republican Congress, if not all, are so huge that there can be no "simple" fix. No, you won't "fix" the debt problem just by raising taxes, just as cutting taxes, the mantra of the two entities I just mentioned, failed to lower the debt. Instead, they increased it, enormously, in part by cutting taxes during two wars, a first in the history of this country, to my knowledge, and as clear an example of their incompetence as one could imagine.

However, cutting "entitlement" programs alone won't fix the debt problem. Not only will doing that not fix it, it would be just as unacceptable as a large tax increase during a deep recession, that still has the potential to turn into something worse. Obama figured that out when he decided to postpone eliminating the Bush tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans for a couple of years. You don't cut "entitlement" programs when millions of Americans and their families are without health insurance, and millions more are suddenly looking for work due to layoffs brought about by the horrific economy we find ourselves in, even if you believe cutting them is a good idea (I don't).

 

if that is the case then screw the whole idea.

 

Additional gas taxes during this time of economic uncertainty are absolutely r****ded. There's no two ways about it. Obama would be a complete fool to try to claim he cares about the economy and at the same time enact a gas tax because he wants GM to sell more of their crappy vehicles. This is truly a stupid idea and one that I'm afraid Pelosi and Obama will impose on us.

 

1) Yes I know there is tax on every gallon of gas both Federal and State.

Okay, good.

2) the purpose of this gas tax hike is not to build new roads or highways but make people buy cars from the big 3 who we just nationalized last week.

The effect would not be to "make" or encourage consumers buy from the Big 3. The effect would be to encourage buying fuel-efficient vehicles, which foreign manufacturers can make just as easily as American ones. It would give the manufacturers an incentive to build for fuel efficiency because the market would demand it more strongly.

As for the funds for roads, etc., a side effect of a sin tax like this is that it would produce more revenue for the state that needs to be spent somewhere.

And, the Big 3 were not nationalized.

3) The idea is to make gas cost $4-$5 for all people regardless of the type of car they drive.

Right now, people pay $1.50-$2.00 for gas regardless of the type of car they drive. What's the problem?

4) Our government wants to tax gas in the name of import tarriffs. Fine but where is the domestic production they are trying to protect?

I just don't understand what you're driving at here.

They have bailed out a failed industry in the automakers and will now try to shove cars they wants us to drive down our throats in name of self-preservation.

Face it with current gas prices the hybrid and electric cars aren't very attractive so the only way to save GM and Ford is to FORCE people to buy their cars. No one is going to pay $40,000 for a Chevy Volt if gas only cost $1.50.

Not quite. The Big 3 could potentially be saved while continuing to manufacture gas-guzzlers. The point of this gas tax idea is to encourage the Big 3 to abandon gas-guzzlers. If no one will buy a Volt, I'm sure Chevy would still be happy to sell them a Tahoe.

 

This should not be the government's role. If I want to buy a car that is fuel efficient, then I will do so. I don't want or need the government to force my hand in this matter, especially with my own gd tax dollars

 

Why the hell wouldn't it be the government's role? Our government has been using taxes to shape behavior since it was founded. It seems especially appropriate here since there are many hidden costs (environmental damage, national security interest, supply management issues) to high consumption of fuel that we as a country are paying one way (in damage or risk) or another (in tax dollars). Those costs should be managed. As a finance guy, I like to have those costs quantified and appropriately applied to the consumers in the right proportions and as accrued. A gas tax seems like the most elegant way to do so.

So, you don't want the government to do it. Fortunately for you, we live in a democracy that is supposed to respond to the Will of the people. Unfortunately, that Will may lean a different direction than you do.

 

For the 543rd time, no one is forcing you to buy anything.

 

Strange. I've never seen you complain about tax subsidies to oil companies, or tax breaks for education or home ownership or anything of the like. In your little world, when exactly is it or isn't it appropriate to use government incentives?

 

Another article on this point..

http://money.cnn.com/2008/12/30/new...ning.fortune/index.htm?postversion=2008123015

 

The pro-business lobbyists have protecting the auto industry for years by classifying SUVs as trucks so that they could have lower fuel-efficiency standards. I'd like to see the effect on large vehicle sales by simply leveling the playing field and making manufacturers meet the same fuel-efficiency requirements as cars, which will presumably make them more expensive and less popular.

 

driving a bigass SUV to detriment of the enviroment ain't a right up their life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. the automobile is a utility. Transportation. for those who can afford nice ones, great, for those who can't, it ain't the end of the freakin world

 

That was a taxing read.

Thank you, thank you. I'll be here all night.

 

"Roller skates" is an euphemism for small cars/microcars, not a literal pair of roller skates

 

But surely you couldn't complain about a tax that is set equal to the cost of the externalities you produce?

If you're screwing something up for everyone else, you should have to compensate everyone else. How do we compensate the rest of the society? We pay taxes.

Anyone who doesn't understand this concept really just needs to read more about economics (specifically Pigouvian taxation). A lot of people have worked very hard to explain this stuff, the least y'all can do is read their work.

 

There's like 4 people at my office that have those things. At least two of them have For Sale signs in the window. They're no Ford Festiva, I'll say that.

 

when you have ghettocheeze

you flip big burbans on swangers, no matter the gas cost


I'll be here all night folks

 

You're describing the "Tragedy of the Commons." This is inherent in most environmental issues, since we share the air collectively.

Putting a price floor on gas (gas tax) would be a terrible move that would backfire since it affects everyone. The best move would be to continue to provide tax incentives to reward those who purchase low emissions vehicles, and a gas guzzler tax on non-commercial vehicles that do not meet certain environmental standards. So bascially you're encouraging folks to take advantage of the tax incentive and purchase more efficient vehicles. Those who want to purchase larger vehicles can do so, albeit for a penalty.