Who exactly do our role players not match up with? Let's look at the last five games. Swift: 17 pts, 6 rebs, 1 st, 1 ast. Over the past 5 games Gasol has averaged 20 and 7, Horry has 6.6 and 5, Rasheed has 17.6 and 6.4 Gasol and Rasheed make twice what Swift does. Who are we going to get for the same amount of money that can gives us the production Swift does? I'll tell you. No one. Swift has been a great pick up. Sure, he struggled out of the gate, but so did our players last year. Swift was never meant to be a superstar when we signed him for the freakin' MLE. He's rounding into a very nice complimentary player. Can you please tell me someone we can realistically get who would be an upgrade? Rafer is shooting 42% from the field and 41% from three in the last five games (coming off a long injury and without Yao and Tmac to take pressure off him). His statline still reads: Alston: 17.8 pts, 7.2 ast, 2.2 st, 3.6 reb. Mike James only averages 2 more points over the last five games and he's been playing all year long and with a team that has more offenesive weapons right now. Who could we have gotten that would be doing a better job? Granted, he's been injured a lot. But we are paying a pittance for DA, $1.6 million. To put that in perspective, Kris Humprhies makes $1.5 million, Boki is making $2.5 million for God's sakes. Who would we have gotten in the offseason at that price that would have given us significantly more production? What the hell is plan B going to be? And how is it somehow different from what we're in position to do right now? The only people under contract for next season are: McGrady Juwan Yao Swift Moochie Rafer Sura Mutombo Anderson Head Bowen I would argue that Swift, Howard, Rafer, Sura, Mutomboa, and Head are a lot more talented than the supporting casts you saw on the Lakers championship squads. Before we're ready to scrap the Van Gundy era let's at least have some idea of what we could replace it with and if that would be an improvement.
Statistics don't tell the story. Horry, for example, doesn't have the numbers but he has all the indefinables; he makes the big shot, the big stop, the big play. Conversely, critical mistakes at critical times are killing and negating the meager production of Swift. If you examine the "overall" play of our role players they don't match up with the "overall" contribution of the role players on the elite teams. Winning doesn't just happen, all the little less glitzy things make it happen. Two or three missed defensive assignments or a few offensive rebounds per game can make the difference. As far as plan B, how about new management, a new coach, and some fresh ideas. Something other than bringing in semi-retirees who are on their last leg. How about bringing a shooter or two? How about an aggressive rebounder?. How about adding speed, quickness, and overall athleticism? It's really not Rocket science. I can't even believe you brought up the championship Lakers. No comment.
I'd like to know what coach would be able to put up a better record in the same, injury-riddled circumstances Van Gundy finds himself in? Some of you clowns come in here and parrot other posters to Fire Van Gundy! Fire Van Gundy! Give me a break. The guy can coach. No one, I mean no one can win games in the NBA without talent. This isn't the NCAAs. This isn't Princeton running back door plays on a talented, but dim-witted UCLA team. Van Gundy and, to a lesser extent, CD deserves to see what they can do with both All-Stars healthy. If they can't get to the 2nd round with a healthy team, then change the dynamics of the team. Otherwise, play your hearts out, play Rafer and Luther and JLIII until they drop, to mature their game, draft some talent, jettison the old farts and start over in 2006. But don't sell Van Gundy down the river when he's trying to win with a starting lineup of Bowen, Howard, Mutombo, Wesley and Alston. There is no coach you can name that could win 60-to70% of their games with that group, so please go back to your "Malik Badiane is a Bad Man" and Stromile Swift slam dunk compilation video threads. ENOUGH ALREADY! End of rant.
Truth That is a lineup to get ANY coach in the league FIRED. (if the owner didn't know a thing about BB) Including Phil, Riley, Flip and Larry. I like the way the Knicks are destroying the league with great coaching.
True, JVG is a good coach. He is smart, basketballwise. True, he doesn't have much to work with. BUT, he is the one that made these personnel decisions. He assembled this supporting cast. Yes, the stars are injured. Yes, some of his pieces are missing. BUT if you want offense you have to have offensive minded schemes and offensive minded players including shooters and rebounders. It is really a talent issue, but he is largely responsible for personnel decisions, isn't he?
Barring a trade our roster should look something like this.... Gone: -David Wesley -Jon Barry -Moochie Norris - We hold a team option, ideally we wouldn't bring him back but as I will get to later on we would have serious backcourt depth issues. -Lonny Baxter - Just an extra body, nothing special here. -John Lucas III - Hasn't shown any reason to question why we're the only team that has given him a shot. Questionable: -Bob Sura - Under contract for two more seasons but retirement is a possibility. Returning: -Tracy McGrady -Yao Ming -Luther Head -Juwan Howard -Stromile Swift -Rafer Alston -Dikembe Mutombo -Derek Anderson - Holds a player option, no other team is going to trust him at this point so we're stuck with him for another season. -Ryan Bowen - Holds a player option and will be back...unless we wise up and cut ties. Projected 06-07 Depth Chart PG Alston Sura ?Norris? SG Head Anderson SF McGrady Bowen PF Howard Swift C Yao Mutombo This projected lineup would leave us with seriously depleted backcourt. Not only would we be down to a dismal four guard backcourt rotation but two of those players included would already have injury issues. The MLE and whoever we draft must be used to bolster our backcourt and provide overall depth to help solve this problem. Some Summer of '06 Free Agents I would look at: Bernard Robinson Fred Jones Speedy Claxton (Has always been underrated) Trevor Ariza Bonzi Wells Vladimir Radmanovic Matt Harpring Jared Jeffries Keith Bogans (Reminds me of Sura) Marcus Banks Jumaine Jones Jason Terry (Won't leave Dallas but obviously worth mentioning) Devean George Bobby Jackson (Another glassman, worth mentioning I suppose) Rasual Butler Flip Murray There are going to be VERY few decent PG's out on the market this summer, the best of those probably being Speedy Claxton. This might force us to draft PG in the coming draft and try to solve our other depth issues with the MLE and LLE. Bernard Robinson is a guy I really hope we take a good, hard look at. Usually I hate Michigan players but this guy has all the tools (minus a 3 pt shot) to become a quality starter. Pretty much the same goes for Keith Bogans, who I think plays a lot like Sura with similar strengths. Just throwing some ideas out there, tell me what you think.....
Solid, you want to get rid of a good coach that is "smart, basketballwise"? I thought that's why we hired him? Chastising him for the personnel decisions is misdirected. First off, CD is ultimately responsible for those decisions...yes, JVG has a say, but who's the GM? If you want to get rid of someone, get rid of someone who traded away Richard Jefferson or Przybilla! A lesser supporting cast took us to the brink of the second round last year, didn't it? Were you spewing your JVG hatred then? I'll bet not. Regarding your opinion on offensive-minded players and schemes....dude is capable of both. You said it yourself...he's "smart, basketballwise". He runs the pick and roll with T-Mac and Yao (when they're healthy, of course) because Yao is incapable of getting post position when being fronted so he rolls him off a pick and lets the best passer/decision-maker on the team choose to create a shot for a rolling Yao, penetrate and finish/dish to an outside shooter. You're putting the ball in the hands of TMac, who is arguably the most incredible and effortless scorer since MJ. You're putting your offensive-minded big man in a position where he's moving towards the basket or towards a low post position where an offensive-minded SF can create a shot himself of find his typically wide-open teammates for easy finishes/open treys. And now we've got to watch the high post game with Juwon Howard. Granted, it's our best offensive play with the players we have...and Howard is playing his arse off, but we just don't have the firepower with all these injuries. Imagine what a healthy John Barry would do for this team! The personnel decisions cannot be used as an excuse for a team that almost got into the second round with worse talent than what we have now! It's the injuries....that's the only problem we have right now. We can put together a healthy team. If we were 12-22 with a healthy TMac, Yao, Sura, Barry, Anderson, then you could say Van Gundy should be gone...but that's not the case is it? Don't be so short sighted! C'mon guys, pull your head out. This isn't the end of the world...it's more like when the Admiral went down for SA for the whole year and they drafted Duncan....then bounced back. We'll maybe to a lesser extent as there is no Duncan waiting to be drafted but you get my point. Take your lumps now, know that you have a coach who can get you through the playoffs, know you have a good young nucleus (please oh please let TMAC's back be okay longterm), gather more talent from the draft and offseason and take a shot next year.
You can't under estimate the effect injuries had on this team. JVG and CD couldn't have forseen the injury bug hitting as badly as it did, no coach or GM could have. If, I remember correctly going into this season the Rockets were very highly regarded because most agreed that the offseason move we made we the right ones. That's why the media was ranking us near the top of the league, as well as most of the poster on this board going into the season. Some of those moves haven't worked out as well as we expected and the injuries haven't really given us a true idea of what the complete team can do. The good news is that CD and JVG didn't overpay for any of the free agents they got, low risk high reward.
That's precisely it, Grendal. This team does have a few suck players on it, and I won't name names *cough* Moochie/Bowen/Howard/Baxter, and to a lesser extent, Swift *cough* luckily we didn't overpay for Swift - thank God! But the injury issue is the overriding issue. It's caused us to find primary and secondary scoring options to players that are 3rd, 4th options at BEST. That's a recipe for disaster, for ANY coach. Hell I don't mind keeping Swift for what we're paying him. If we could ever get these other guys gone it would really provide us an opportunity to use those roster spaces for some real supporting talent. Perhaps even a desparately needed 3rd option or a cheaper/better version of an enforcer/rebounder like Kenyon Martin. And I don't mind having Moochie on the team as it means we're not staring at Mo Taylor's burdensome contract any more.
"spewing your JVG hatred"???? You haven't read very many of my posts. I have been a JVG supporter, but the doom and gloom style is growing thin. Yes, I do question his personnel decisions from the time he starting bringing in the burned out old Knicks to his recent selections. My point is simple and correct, the supporting cast is not going to cut it so far as producing a contender. Several commentators in the national media agree with me. Perhaps we need a poll. Incidently, I strongly disagree that last year's supporting cast was inferior to the present group.
As much as I hate the Lakers, they are the most apt comparison for this Rocekts team. They both have two megastars, a center and a swingman, making max money who must be surrounded by cheaper role players. Looking at them is probably the best way to see how this team can win. Sure, if this is the playoffs and we need one shot to win you want Horry to take the wide open 3. But you haven't addressed any of the gist of my post. What role players of are ours not living up to the price we're paying for them? Who could we have besides Stromile Swift? How does a missed blown assignment or two (which if you've noticed Swift has a lost less of as he learns the defense) negate 17 points and 6 rebounds? It is Rocket science or else we would have done it. What semi-retirees did we bring in this offseason? Derek Anderson is just 31 and as I pointed out before, he's making Kris Humphries money, HE'S MAKING $900,000 LESS THAN BOSTJAN FREAKING NOCHBAR. If you're willing to ship out a proven coach who's taken us to the playoffs two years in a row and has taken another to the Finals then you damn well better have someone you can guarantee will get us a better shot. You still haven't answered any of my questions. Please point out the shooter or two we could have gotten this offseason. Please point out the aggressive rebounder we could have gotten this offseason. Please point out the speed, quickness, and overall athleticism we could have picked up this offseason (keeping in mind CD/JVG made an amazing pick up by drafting Luther Head). Please point out the new coach, new management, and fresh ideas that will turn this team around. Please point out why a season that's been devastated by injury should be an impetus to blow up a team that was one game away from the second round last year and was largely considered the second best team in the West when we started. Yao and TMac aren't that young. We've only got so many years before the downhill comes. Please justify the setback of getting rid of a coach they both love playing for and have won with by pointing to some theoretically obtainable better option. If you can't do that, then I don't think you can say calling for JVG's head is any more than obtuse frustration over a frustrating season.
I don't think that is a fair statement because we haven't seen this years complete team on the floor aside from opening nite. If and when we get everyone back on the floor and they play a long string of games together, then you can compare them to last years squad.
The excuses for Mr. "no excuses" grow longer and longer. Here's an article on free agents next year. http://probasketball.about.com/od/newsrumorsopinion/a/nbafreeagents06.htm There are some decent center/power forwards available next year, including our old friend Kelvin Cato. He could start at 4 again, over Howard and Swift.
And he is not worth it. As to your "please point out" questions, I will answer all of them IF the Rocket's agree to pay me what they are paying JVG and CD this year. Look, like you, I'm a fan, this board is a game. I don't know who will trade who, when, and for how much! Certainly as fans we have favorites, players we would like to have. But you have made my point, it is obvious what this team needs a shooter, a rebounder, etc. Winning teams are managed into being, they are the result of smart timely moves, smart player assessments, smart drafts, smart trades. At the end of last season, JVG admitted that the team lacked talent. He was right. But the moves he made haven't worked out, not just because of injuries, they were the wrong choices. New coach or not, the Rockets need some new ideas. Surely you agree.
Once again how can you say that it hasn't worked out in terms of talent, if we haven't seen these players on the court at the same time?
Speak for yourself. I'd definitely take Howard over Cato. The slow, awkward, center-playing-PF-tactic isn't going to cut it in today's NBA. Yes it's only been two years since Cato started an entire season, but a lot has changed since then. And Howard has easily been our most consistent player this year.
Solid, unless you can provide a better explanation of why it's JVGs fault we have the record we have even with the injury problem, I think you're better suited to posts where you can fantasize about potential lineups and ohh and ahhh over european scouting reports. Implying that it's JVG who should be fired because he's unable to coach a bunch of role players to the playoffs is ridiculous. Your inability to even acknowledge the difference a full, healthy roster would make baffles me. Tell me, so I can shut up and go away, what JVG is doing wrong, with the current crop of healthy players that makes him expendable? Yeah, this board is all fun and it's a game blah blah blah. I've been lurking on this board for a while...as you can see by the number of my posts...but I'm getting sick and tired of all these posters with the fire JVG threads. It makes no sense! I'm sick of reading about all these fantasy trades and prospective lineups if we do this and do that. It's all garbage. When will more thoughtful, concrete, imaginative, posters arrive! Or is this board full of NBA Live'ers who do nothing but waste hours making their ultimate Rockets fantasy squad that is neither financially plausable or reasonable to other teams? Thank goodness the Longhorns won the National Championship or else I'd be in an even worse mood.
gosh i hate replying to this insanity about who is to blame, but rest assured blame is to be shared by all parties. but edc pasox and solid are just haters without specifics. they say jvg is in charge of personnell, but they have no idea. they say we should have picked younger players, without giving names and with no knowldedge on the salary cap or the luxury tax. the main injuries are to 3 guys below 30...tracy, yao and alston...the other injuries are somewhat irrelevant. the salary cap that vangundy and dawson inherited with cato, taylor, posey allowed to go for nothing, griffin turning out to be a complete bust is what set the franchise back. but everyone is right...unless more talent is added around yao and tracy...more firepower...the first round is the only round for the rockets in 2006 or 2007. by the way edc, i looked up your profile and was amused that ballroom dancing was your hobby. i hope van gundy and dawson can come critique your style and moves.
