The Cost of Winning an NBA Championship

The whole point of Morey is so Les doesn't have to exceed the cap. Providing Morey with the largest sabremetrics staff in the league costs less than 1 vet on the bench.

Also the idea of "you get what you pay for" is en vogue on ESPN atm but you have to go back alllll the way to THREE YEARS to find the Spurs winning the championship without the largest payroll in the league. Compound that with the fact that a couple of teams with the biggest payrolls, Knicks and Portland are not contenders. Plus the fact that the last 2 champions who form the basis of support for "payroll wins" won on the back of a couple of dubious trades that handed them key pieces, more than pure $$$ paid out.

All that leads me to believe that Les who is cheap wont be willing to shell out for 2 guys like Butler and Iugodala, not least because hiring Morey indicates that he thinks he can in fact win with a moderate payroll surrounding 2 stars.

Morey's said in interviews posted on this site that he thinks Houston needs healthy Yao plus ONE star who can deliver 5-6 wins to be in contention. That seems to indicate that they'd only pull the trigger on one trade, and fill the rest of the cast out with sabremetrics

For what it's worth, I support the idea of outspending the league to give us the best chance to win, and that's what a truly singleminded owner dedicated to doing EVERYTHING to deliver a championship would do... but Les hasn't ever indicated that he's willing to do that

 

hmm...not a bad proposal...i'm gonna have to put this lineup together in NBA2k9 and see how we play. If we play well...MAKE IT HAPPEN MOREY! If not...try again! :grin:

 

Good work, but I think a better option would be trading for Butler and then hoping to work out a sign and trade for Bosh (Scola / Landry + Brooks + filler?)...of course thats probably as unlikely as the scenario you suggested, but I think its a better option as Bosh is a top 10 player unlike anyone else on our roster, even with the trades.

 

There is spending, and there is spending smart. Dropping a large amount of money on players who won't win you a championship is stupid move, ask Spurs fans if they are happy about how things have turned out with the deal for Richard Jefferson, a big money player who doesn't fit the role of a shooter which the Spurs need. Teams have to spend intelligently to win, or spend significantly more than everyone else(ie. Lakers and Celtics).

Anyone who calls Les cheap really has no perspective. The Rockets have always been willing to make the deals needed to get big name players, whether the moves have worked or not, and that has shown a commitment to winning on Les Alexander's part. The move for Charles Barkley, the trade for Scottie Pippen, both big money moves to bring in big name players who Les/CD thought would push the Rockets to a championship are proof of that commitment.

People who call Les cheap are the same people who erroneously call Drayton McClane cheap. Uninformed, impetuous, silly fans. Both men run businesses in which they spend according to what they make from the teams. Drayton and Les are far from cheap, and to accuse either of being so is just stupid.

 

Well I'm neither uninformed nor impetuous and silly and I called Les cheap. So there goes your entire post, since you didn't bother doing anything besides get oddly personal and post insults and spout platitudes on the value of winning.

Les is cheap because he's not spending commensurate to the value of the team. Houston's valuation is 5th or 6th and Houston's payroll hovers around 12-15. So he's cheap. He has a model arena with good attendance and a massive personal asset in Yao Ming, but his payroll is not competitive atm to the stop spending teams... which is the point of crash5179's thead. So he is cheap.

It's true that he's been willing to sign "big name players" and you note a washed up Barkley. But that has nothing to do with anything in this thread. I'm pretty sure any owner views signing a "big name player" as a plus. He's also "committed to winning" which I guess means yes he does want to win.

If you feel like throwing more unsubstantiated insults go suck an egg. I still can't figure why you are taking it so personal. Either way grow a thicker skin if something like that sets you off.

Yo crash5179, I actually like what you posted and understand your rebuttals. I simply dont think Les is going to pull the trigger on 2 big trades like that which increases the payroll that amount.

 

this could be the biggest trade of the season, but still I don't see it happening, but u never know..

 

I agree with the concept of spending smart. There are different kinds of value: pay cheap and get solid talent; or pay reasonable to get superior talent; or pay max to get true franchise talent.

Morey has done pretty well in the first category. Denver's trade for Billups, I believe, falls into the second category. And for the last one, I believe every GM would be thrilled to pay max for a young MJ,Lebrone,Hakkem...One example is how Boston sacrificed more than half the team to acquire KG even if he's no longer a young star.

No they wouldn't be able to know for sure all will work out at the end, but spending smart doesn't mean always spending small.

To OP's credit, I think these trades(if calculated correctly by op) are based on rational analysis and deserve a try. Although I do have a feeling Morey is indeed working on something big if not this.

 

i don't think adding igga and butler will change us into an instant contender,moreover i don't see any chance for les to pay for the lux tax for this lineup.

giving up lowry is not a wise decision,imo,this small PG is the future for this team,he is more aggressive and play consistently than AB.i would send AB in order to keep lowry,

 

So that's your measurement whether an owner is cheap or not? Payroll? And you say you're not uninformed and/or lacking perspective.

There costs more than payroll when it comes to running a team. In case you haven't noticed, we have been buying draft picks every year, those are costs which are entirely optional but Les has allowed. Buying draft picks have a good history of producing good players. Overpaying for players? Not so much (see Knicks, Old Blazers, Milwaukee Bucks, etc.).

How much do you think it costs to hire Morey and provide him the equipment AND staff he needs to do the things he does? IT equipment cost a lot, the Chron mentioned that Les has already spent millions on providing DM the infrastructure he needs. Not only that, he also hired one of the best (and likely highest paid) coaches in the biz and surrounded DM with top of the line staff (like Rosas who they pirated from another company).

Point is, you can spend money on the roster, or you can spend money on stuff that don't require you pay dollar for dollar for everything you spend on. Sure you can be like Portland and spend money on both, but not choosing to do so isn't an indictment on Les as much as its ignorance on your part. Its like getting mad at the fireman for not saving your appliances when he just rescued you from a burning building.

To sum it up, show me concrete evidence that spending more on the cap trasnlates into more wins and maybe you'll have a point. But then you'll have to explain why teams like the Knicks, old Portland and the Mavs have been paying the tax year after year and have a grand total of 0 rings to show for it. By the way, the dish has a thread about the Celts wanting to dump Allen and his ridiculous contract. I guess they're sick and tired of getting what they paid for, huh?

 

I don't think the Rockets are going to make any risky "swing for the fences" deals unless they are absolutely sure Yao is going to be healthy. Because if Yao doesn't return to full strength, you're left with a team not good enough to win a ring and probably way over the luxury tax line for the foreseeable future.

That's why I see them adding a complementary piece that doesn't tie them up financially, someone like Caron Butler by trade or a free agent in the offseason, and then waiting until they get Yao back on court healthy. And while they wait, there's always a chance better deals and better players become available. Why tie everything down now?

Morey is right in saying that there is no reason to make a major deal now unless it's one that absolutely knocks the Rockets over.

 

I apologize if what I said came off as a personal attack on you, it is more a response to Houston sports fans who always call their owners cheap when we don't really know cheap, cheap is the Pittsburgh Pirates or the Memphis Grizzles. Les spends $7 million less in salary than the Orlando Magic who are the 5th highest salary in the NBA. I don't see that as a large enough difference to label Les as a cheap owner.

I believe Les will shell out the dough if he believes a player will make the Rockets true championship contenders. If the Rockets were picking up KG and Ray Allen (which Caron Butler and Andre Iguodala are not) then I'm sure Morey could convince Les to do the move. But with those 2 players and this season's team or even next season's with a questionable Yao, the Rockets aren't automatically championship contenders. Now, if the Rockets could pull off a move for a "superstar" like Bosh + Caron Butler, I would like to think Les would do it in a heart beat.

I really think its ridiculous to call Les cheap for not paying the luxury tax, its a prudent business move and allows the Rockets the flexibility to possibly make trades to improve themselves b/c they don't have huge contracts which no one would want to trade for.

Morey has been slowly collecting assets over the last few years and now we see if he is able to turn these assets into gold. As much as I love AB, Lowry, and Landry, now is the time to trade them b/c their value will never be higher.

 

cmon daryl morey dont dissapoint me plz!

 

No way that trade benefits Houston.I say send Mcgrady and Cook to Washington for Butler,Haywood,and Jamison.

Washington would win big with this trade just because both Mcgrady and Cooks Contracts are up this year.The can go for the Bosh,Lebron,etc sweepstakes.

Washington has there money out there already.Might as well profit from it by trading for expiring contracts.

I would if I was GM.... :grin:

 

The money saved by not playing TMAC&YAO should be more than enough to buyout Dalermbert's final year. Can we then resign him to small salary contract? If not, can we buy out him next year and trade him to somewhere else?

However, if such big money is involved, I would rather try possible Bosh related trades.