? Our season would not be dependent on Yao. We want him back cheap. That's that. low risk/high reward. When are folks going to realize that?
Yeah...tell ya what. Call me when you can walk. Then we'll talk about whether or not you get a contract to play basketball professionally.
If this keeps us from going out and acquiring a REAL center and a REAL backup because: 1. we dont have the cash; or 2. none of those guys want to come here and risk riding pine behind Yao' then I'm completely utterly and totally opposed to even remotely considering bringing Yao back. i do not see a scenario in which it ends well on the court for the Houston Rockets to bring him back.
Right... and is Yao Ming or anyone else demanding that the Rockets give him a contract offer/extension right now? Is Morey or anyone else talking about signing him up right now? Everything I heard so far is that everyone will wait for further medical development to decide on the future, so what's the point of this "Call me when you can walk" comment? Nobody's been calling you and nobody will. Neither Yao or the Rockets have any plans to call each other about a contract until much later with or without your sage advice. 1. I doubt there is a huge market out there to pay a lot of money to a player who was injured for 2 years. As such, I doubt whatever money the Rockets spend on Yao is going to prevent them from signing anyone else they want. Les Alexander isn't exactly running out of cash. 2. If a player is afraid of riding the pine because he couldn't beat out a guy coming off of 2 years of inactivity, he probably ain't that good at basketball. Yao Ming's potential return to the Rockets isn't having an impact on their ability to pursue a C any more than his potential signing with any of the other team would prevent that team from pursuing a C. The limiting factor on pursuing a C for the Rockets (and any other team) is the fact that there are relatively few good ones around.
I am not opposed to paying Yao the minimum if he'll take it but to me, this entire discussion is moot. The issue is NOT about how much money the Rockets should pay Yao - it's about him being able to continue to play professional basketball. That's the ONE thing that keeps getting lost in these types of discussions: basketball - specifically WINNING basketball. It doesn't matter if he's paid $1M, $800K or even $1. If he is unable to play - if his presence on the team does nothing to materially improve their ability to start competing in the Western Conference (sorry but 5th place in the Southwest Division is not my idea of competing), then what exactly is the point? It all depends on what you expect from the Rockets. If you are fine with the continuing story line of the last 5 years then this is the type of move that will appeal to you and yours. However, if you are tired of the Rockets' continuing re-enactment of Groundhog Day, then you (and I) are in agreement with the premise that it's well past the time for them to move on to the next stage.
Yao Ming for the minimum is a no-brainer. --He isn't going to keep the Rockets from signing another player who would play. His cap number wouldn't be prohibitive. And any other player who they could get for the minimum would not be a player worth playing ahead of Yao. --His name still means SOMETHING in NBA circles. If he shows anything--anything at all--it may (I repeat, MAY) influence the decisions of other good players otherwise on the fence between Houston and other destinations. --For Yao's benefit, having him on a one-year minimum deal would make him (at least under the current rules) a "One-Year Bird" player, meaning that he could not be traded next season without his consent. That should at least be somewhat reassuring to Yao if Morey were to approach him with such a small contract offer. --This is the EASIEST way to get good again. If Yao can return to form (again, no one's holding their breath on this), the Rockets could have the perfect confluence of (a) tons of 2012 cap room and (b) the ability to re-sign a "reborn star player" to any amount while only having to deal with a miniscule cap hold on him prior to signing him. At the freakin' league minimum, it does not adversely impact the team in any way. Under the current rules, at least. Other than those who honestly feel that Les Alexander and Daryl Morey are complete morons who cannot make any future plans not involving Yao, and those who are simply too selfish ("I want to move on") or too ignorant ("Yao sucks") to see the ultimate low risk/super-duper high reward move right in front of them, no one can be opposed to this approach.
If the doctors clear him 100% and he plays very limited minutes coming off the bench he could be effective. However, his days as a starter are behind him. I also think the Rockets if they want to resign him, it should be for the minimum. Yao is good for the community and the team so I have nothing wrong with him staying.
For me, it is not how much moneywise, rather it is the predictable soaring expectations followed by the crushing disappointment....how many times now? Four..shall we go for five, six, seven....how about the next ten years or so? How about the entire future of all the current and new players being wrapped around the same insane replay of the last several years continuing into the future. Is there no learning curve for Yao, Les, Morey, fans, no one? Are we all totally fixated on utter stupidity.? Yao, RETIRE!!!!!!! END THE PAIN!!!
Again I have to ask: Exactly what outcome are you (and yours) expecting to come from this move? Please explain what your expectations are for Yao on the court because that's the ONLY thing that should matter to the Rockets at this point unless their ultimate objective is something other than winning.
thank you Hillboy, I love Yao, tremendous guy and player when healthy, well always a tremendous guy, but its time to move. the dream is dead
The Yao for the minimum "no brainer" is a tease. It will mask the real expectation of FULL RECOVERY and the return to STARDOM, the rise of the Rockets, the fulfillment of all our dreams, the contender status that we we have always........opps.......he is down again, oh no, same foot, it's all over......crushing disappointment.....oh well....we can try again next year!!!!!!
Ilgauskas had BOTH feet restructured so that there would not be stress placed on another part of the foot. Yao did not, and he got injured almost immediately again after he started playing. Also, Yao is much heavier than Ilgauskas is and Yao plays a lot more in the low post, using his foot as a pivot. Ilgauskas never once ever played during the summer. There is no comparison between these two cases and never has been.
A Realistic (Pessimistic, Even) Scenario: Let's say Yao continues to rehab and isn't even ready to play by the start of training camp (whenever that is). He slowly gets back into the swing of things and builds up his conditioning. He begins the season not being on the Active List for games. Then, by about 10-15 games into the year, he starts playing in games, getting 10-15 mpg off the bench. Maybe he builds that up to 15-20 mpg by late in the season. He scores a few points, grabs a few rebounds. Nothing special. Pedestrian, even. The key: He makes it through the season in one piece. (Yes, this is realistic. It doesn't mean it's going to happen. But if it doesn't, GAME OVER. No big deal. He's a minimum salaried player.) Summer of 2012: Yao has shown he can make it through a season. He has rebuilt the strength in his leg, and other teams take notice. Remember, Yao would be a 2012 free agent, and after showing that he's able to play, he's got much better value than he had in 2011. Meanwhile, the Rockets have managed to clear tons of cap room. Yao's cap hold is barely anything at all. Daryl Morey is armed with all this cap room, a great supporting cast (Martin, Scola, Hayes?, Patterson, Budinger, and maybe Lee if he's being re-signed), and the ability to re-sign a Yao Ming who has slowly but surely gotten healthier. Top free agents take notice. All of a sudden, the Rockets can be taken more seriously as a viable free agent destination. Again, this doesn't even account for Yao "returning to form" and putting up 20-10.
Nobody know for sure what to expect from Yao at this point. He may not come back at all. In that case, there will be no signing. If he makes it back, he might (a) get injured and have to retire, (b) stay healthy but is nothing more than a replacement level player, (c) become a useful 15-20 mpg role player like Bill Walton with the Celtics, or (d) come all the way back to his old self. I don't see how, under any of these scenarios, signing Yao to a minimum-level contract would hurt. The Rockets are obviously going to look for a new starting C. Whether Yao can return or not will have no impact on that pursuit, particularly given that they won't be paying Yao a ton of money. Beyond money, the coach will obviously play the players who give him the best chance to win. If Yao is merely ordinary, I doubt the coach will give him 30+ entitlement minutes a year simply because he used to be really good. Hell, even Shaq isn't getting that. There is nothing about signing Yao to a small contract that will prevent the team from moving forward.
I'm pretty sure people are not having any soaring expectations about a Yao signing now. I think reasonable people know that there is a huge injury risk even if he comes back. If you are having soaring expectations, and if you are crushed later on, it's frankly your own fault.
Good for you Yao. This is a low risk high reward type situation. I surely have given up hope for him being the focal point of our team, but if he can produce 15-20 minutes a game next season that would be great. He would still be effective due to his sheer size alone. We may never be able to get a 7'6 center again so I hope that he can still be effective. And remember, he is still only 30 years old, and this latest injury isn't related to the one that happened in the 2009 Playoffs. I have a strange feeling that he may actually last most of this coming season, because he isn't the face of the franchise, so will not be rushed back of feel as pressured to be back to "save" the team. Morey and Co. have to realize by now that the Ming Era is over, so maybe give him a short term contract.The Rockets have obviously moved on due to the aquistion of Thabeet and draft picks, but Ming could provide leadership/mentoring to our future center(s) whoever they may be. Good luck Yao!
Money-wise, this is true. First part is again true. In hypothetical terms: if he's signed at the minimum, then his cap number would not be an issue. However, I disagree with the last statement because any other player they can get who is able to play when asked would be better than a Yao Ming who cannot do so because he's hurt (again). While I can agree with your first statement, especially if you consider his marketing value, I don't see a reason to believe that his mere presence on the team would be enough to sway someone to come to Houston - especially if that someone is a D Howard or a CP3 type of player. I like your thinking here. Oh wow: where to begin? Firstly, there is simply no basis in fact that this is indeed the "easiest" way to get good again. Your entire argument rests on the premise "If Yao can return to form" which is the basis of this discussion on bringing him back. For them to "get good" as you put it Yao would HAVE to not only manage to stay upright on the court - he'd have to play consistently at a moderate to above average level. Were he to do so, then the Rockets come out winners because they would have in effect won the lotto. Any scenario where Yao can't play due injury defeats the entire argument for your position. It's safe to assume given his history and all that has transpired the most likely outcome here will not be one where Yao "returns to form". I don't see how it's selfish for folks to want to "move on". After all, I don't consider it wrong for people to have reached their limit with Yao's inability to stay healthy especially it they are more interested in seeing the Rockets actually contend. I will admit that I admire his heart and spirit and it says a great deal about his character but in the end, that won't be enough to propel them past Dallas, SA or even OKC and that is what really matters here.
Hillboy, while I respect your arguments, I think you misunderstand what I mean by bringing back Yao as the "EASIEST" way to get good again. I am not saying it is a LIKELIEST way to get good. Just that it is the easiest. Fact: There is no other player in the universe capable of being as good as Yao COULD be if healthy who will also agree to sign for the NBA league minimum. Fact: There is greater than a 0.00% chance that Yao Ming can return to form. If you have a guy right in your back yard who COULD be a good player, and you could keep him AND sign other good players, THAT is the easiest way to get better. Again, you are confusing "likelihood" with "ease".
I do understand and you are right: IF Yao COULD become a good player (again) and you SOMEHOW manage to sign other good players, then they (Rox) would indeed get better. As I said earlier: I would consider this scenario to be the equivalent of winning the lottery with a $1 Quick Pick ticket. It's not impossible but the odds of it working are very long indeed.
