I'm not clear on your definition of talent. Jumping is not the only measure of talent. Body control, leverage, vision, reaction time and the ability to process the game mentally also require talent. They are not things you just get for being tough minded, tenacious, or play-off experienced. It is in these other areas of talent that the Rockets are superior.
I'm assuming this wasn't a troll post considering you been here since 99 and I am assuming also that you are not a 15 year old kid who judges talent by the way someone dunks and gets talked about on ESPN. So anyways if they really do have more talent lets compare it in an easy way. You are Morey and the Blazers say you can have any of our players for free. Who actually do they have that make our rotation? Roy and Aldridge for sure and Outlaw off the bench maybe...and one of the centers just due to the fact we have no backup now. You look at it the other way round... Yao, Artest, Battier are going to get big minutes on that team, Scola would be the backup big man, AB and Lowry would battle it out with Blake to start at the point... you get the point. Don't mix potential and current talent... just because these guys could be better in the future, they are not better now. It's a team game still and even if your top 2 is better than the other teams top 2 doesn't normally mean anything anything if the rest of your team is poor.
Not to jump on you any more than you're already being jumped on in this thread, but no one really disagreed with these points. But you did say a lot of other stuff like oden would start on 3/4 of the league's teams, aldrige is the best jump shooting pf in the league, the rockets' clear advantage is at the point. Like, buh? Why are you surprised that people took issue with that? Do you stand by those statements? Also, I think you are thinking too much about the blazers' hot finish to the season and beating the lakers twice. Teams have their runs, it's not the be-all-end-all. And finally, the rockets' comeback in the 4th quarter of gm 4 isn't as much of a miracle as you make it out to be. They were down by what, 6 points? And Battier made two 3's? Newsflash, Battier is a decent 3-point shooter. One of those was completely uncontested. What about Fernandez's outrageous 3? If he doesn't make *that* miracle shot, the final differential is probably more like 7 points instead of 1. Hayes took a charge? Hayes has been taking charges all season long. Lots of other points like this can be made. You're really not considering all of the information. Having said all that, I see where you're coming from. I think it's from being disappointed so many times with the rockets over recent years. In the past 6 years, it always seemed like all those offensive rebounds just bounced to the other team and killed us. So we've gotten used to it and are afraid of the rockets' success. But ask yourself, why *shouldn't* they get some of those offensive rebounds? They don't deserve it? Scola, Landry, Lowry, they don't play hard enough to get an offensive rebound once in a while? No, I say it's time we get something to go our way. We can all agree that we want the rox to go and get game 5 and finish this.
See OMR, The only part of your post that most people saw was the title and the first paragraph.. They never even got to this part of the POST... Like a sermon from a Pastor, they never heard or read the middle or the end. Just amazing...
Um, like I said, no one is disagreeing with the majority of that second large quote. "We can't let up, we must beat them because they are a dangerous young team." Ok, here: I agree! People will respond to dispute the part they disagree with. That's how messageboards often work. That's amazing to you?
WOW!!! Well aren't you just a lil genuis there Einestien.... No one here has a problem with a GOOD debate, but the ridicules part comes when everyone is so hung up on the Talent part they never took time to read the OP's post and main thoughts. So agree or disagree with what you want, but at least read the entire post to make a sensible debate instead of some half-ass, smart-ass remark.
Good post, Old Man Rock. The Blazers are definitely talented, if by talent we mean athleticism and shooting touch. The two things they lack are veteran smarts and discipline, which are the things that the Rockets have a lot of right now. However, there's no guarantee that in the future the Blazers will develop the necessary b-ball IQ and discipline. There have been many young, talented players and teams that just haven't been able to get it together. IMO, the b-ball IQ and discipline of the Rockets are not just a product of time. It took a combination of two demanding coaches in JVG and Adelman to create the right environment. In addition, we have been "lucky" to have players that have responded well to such demands, and to have a general manager who knows how to pick such players. If they stay together, there is no question Portland develop into a much better, more cohesive team next season. They're too talented not to do so. But whether they will ever develop the smarts, toughness and attitude that the current Rockets have shown remains to be seen.
I agree with Old Man Rock. They are more talented. But that doesn't mean they are the better team, at least in this series. And for those who bring up, well, we have beat like 7 of the last 10. Look at their record versus the Lakers than ours. When the Lakers went all out late in the season to try to keep the pressure on Clev and Portland took it to them playing to the Lakers style--could we do that? We happen to the worst WC team they could have faced, outside of maybe the Lakers (though maybe not, remember they do have a lot of success against them). We are beating them at grit and getting the style to our advantage. But no, we are not more talented. They have two great young players, and many young good players. The fact they are in a funk against us doesn't take that away. I do disagree with OMR about 1 thing. We don't throw the kitchen sink into game 5. We start hard and deliberate and see where it goes. But if they get on a big roll early (15ish point lead), which they are very capable of, we empty the bench and get ready to dig in game 6 at home. We only have 1 day off between--we have to be prepared to give maximum 48 minutes effort with our crowd behind us on Thursday if Tuesday just looks like their night. I think we have a much better chance in game 6 and even a better chance in game 7 if it comes to it than we do stealing game 5.
Very few people are just ridiculing it, most of us have made many actual points. And since you are making such an issue accusing ppl of not reading the whole post, why don't you get past the first few sentences of *my* initial post in this thread and those of many others? Instead of just dismissing it "half-ass, smart-ass" and doing exactly what you are criticizing. Tell me, if we agree that yes, portland does have some good talent and the rockets shouldn't take them lightly (which is obvious to anyone reading this), what else in the OP is up for debate? Maybe all those other statements that people have been disputing with reasoned arguments that you are hypocritically ignoring.
Brandon Roy is a good player, on his way to becoming great...but he isn't there yet. I would say Tmac in 06/07 was MUCH better than Roy is right now. Before yall start bashing me for saying that, I want to say that for a player to be a superstar type player, they have to be able to get others involved. Roy is doing a lot for himself, but he himself even admitted that he has not been getting others involved as much as he needs to in order for them to win. He is not a selfish player, but he hasn't shown the ability to do that on his own with consistency. Look at Kobe, Lebron, Dwade, Paul Pierce, Tony Parker, Chris Paul, Chauncey Billups and Deron Williams right now...those guys can all get their teamates involved with ease. With Roy, its very easy to make the Blazers a 1-2 punch offense. A lot of that has to do with Houston's defense. Brandon Roy is not going to score 40+ often and when he doesn't, he doesn't get his teamates involved that much either, so it makes it a little easier to guard the Blazers. The only guy who he gets going is Aldridge, who is already a nice player offensively. With somebody like Tmac, who many here feel is not that talented or a good of a player, in 05 and 07 playoffs, he managed to get his offensive #'s, but more importantly, he got others involved. He made it tough for the Mavs and the Jazz to guard the Rockets, even though our options were limited, Tmac even found a way to make Ryan Bowen an Chuck Hayes get points! Kobe is spreading the wealth in LA, same with King James, and all the other guys I listed. In our era, Lebron has been the only player who has been able to basically carry a team by himself with little help through season and the playoffs. Brandon Roy isn't at Lebron's level yet. He is at the Melo, Joe Johnson, Ginobili, Durant, Granger, and Vince Carter level, just a tier below as far as wing playes go. Roy, Melo, and Ginobili all have success in the season because of the help of All stars or near all star (Aldridge). However, in the playoffs, you need more than 1 or 2 main guys to win. Ask Chris Paul, who's team got obliterated by 58 points tonight. The Blazers are good, but I don't think they are necessarily more talented than us player for player. Roy and Yao are equal as far as impact on offense (Yao's double teams and his passing ability help our offense A LOT), but Yao has much more presence on defense because of his size. Aldridge and Frye combined equals Scola and Landry, maybe with a slight edge to the Rockets. Battier>>>Batum. Batume is younger and longer, but not as smart or as good on defense as Battier and not as good a 3 point shooter. Artest is better than Outlaw on both ends of the court. Outlaw has great length and his jumper isn't bad, but Artest is just better. Brooks and Lowery>>>>Blake and Rodriguez. Brooks has a quickness advantage and Lowery has a much more strength than the Portland PG's. Wafer<Fernandez. Just by a little bit, but Fernandez has proven himself many times before in international play and is much more experienced and smarter with the ball. Wafer is great when his shot is going in, but can be boneheaded when he tries to do too much with the ball. Portand centers just keep racking up fouls, so its hard to compare them. Chuck Hayes has been effective when he's in the game with defense and the occasional nice bounce pass to a cutter on the baseline. Now this is comparing the Rockets without Tmac, who was better than Roy just 2 years ago. I say the Rockets STILL have a better team. Portand is last year's New Orleans Hornets. We knew they would be good, but they exceeded expectations this year, due to Brandon Roy becoming a star player, Aldridge stepping up his game to another level offensively, and great coaching by Nate McMillan. They don't have more talent than the Rockets, what they have is depth, 3 point shooting, and length, which is key. However, when you rely so much on 1 or 2 players offensively, you have very little room for error. Kobe and Tmac have both been in situations where they took a much inferior team to a 3-1 lead, and ended up losing because the lack of help they had. Roy is going through the same thing. Even if he steps up his game to the superstar level, he is not going to be able to do it by himself, he needs help and he has to become a better distributor with his ability to create on offense.
I think they are more talented if you consider the starting lineup, but the Rockets has a better bench. It's not just their athleticism, but the individual basketball talent as well. But the Rockets plays better as a team than the Blazers, probably due to their inexperience & youth. I wouldn't want to face this Blazers team next year.
Then what is considered talented?? Does talented means a player being able to jump like a kangaroo and slam dunk a ball?? So does talented = better?? So does better = wins??
I think the Rockets play better team ball and the Blazers have better individual talent (mostly athleticism though).
