Texas liberals shamefully protest Perry's measures to safeguard women's health

While I do morally believe abortion should not be legal in any sense, that is not what I am supporting here. I think that as long as it is legal it should be 1000% safe and the time limit should be set on currently youngest survivor. I believe there was a 19 week old who survived shortly, and a 20 or 21 week old who has survived to this day. I am not in any way religious. I have not been to church, outside of a wedding or my mother begging me to come on big family holidays. I just have a moral sense that these are human beings, with separate human DNA, separate bones, tissue, organs, and limbs. They move, react, kick, and squirm.

Do I think the answer to solving gun violence is to ban all guns? IF you could remove the invention and even thought of a gun, YES. I would be in 100 percent in favor of banning guns, but you can't, it is not possible to go back hundreds of years to the invention of the first firearm, or the first use of gun powder. Also, abortion rights are based on two state interest, the woman's HEALTH and protecting pre-natal life. Health, not convenience.

Should we not have laws just because some people won't follow them? Should we just make murder, prostitution, drugs, theft, etc. legal since they are going to happen anyways?

 

PolitiFact Busts Pompous Lib Rachel Maddow Lying About “Mandatory Vaginal Probes” In Ohio Pro-Life Statute…



Keep in mind PolitiFact skews heavily to the left.

Via PolitiFact:http://www.politifact.com/ohio/stat...-maddow-says-ohio-budget-includes-requiremen/

Ohio’s new operating budget calls for $62 billion in spending over two years and several abortion restrictions, including one that requires patients seeking one to first undergo an ultrasound. [...]

In interpreting some of the budget’s more-ambiguous abortion language, Maddow contended that the new regulations included a “mandatory vaginal probe at the insistence of the state.”

Maddow was referring to a new requirement that women seeking abortions first receive ultrasounds to determine whether a fetal heartbeat is present. Her provocative words quickly went viral and sent PolitiFact Ohio in search of a full copy of the massive state budget.

Did it go as far as she claimed? Did it mandate a transvaginal ultrasound, as Maddow claimed, or did it allow for an external transabdominal procedure? We found our answer in the new Section 2919.191 that with the budget’s approval is now part of Ohio Revised Code.

Division A of that section says that before performing an abortion, a provider must “determine whether there is a detectable fetal heartbeat of the unborn human individual the pregnant woman is carrying.” The method for detecting a heartbeat is then spelled out in Division C, which says:

“The director of health may promulgate rules pursuant to section 111.15 of the Revised Code specifying the appropriate methods of performing an examination for the presence of a fetal heartbeat of an unborn individual based on standard medical practice. The rules shall require only that an examination shall be performed externally.”

In other words, not only are external methods such as transabdominal ultrasounds allowed under the new law; they are required. That sinks Maddow’s claim of a “mandatory vaginal probe.” [...]

But there should be no debate about what types of ultrasounds these new regulations require. Had Maddow read the language closely, she would have seen a mandate — for external detection methods. That puts Maddow’s “vaginal probe” claim about as far as can be from the truth, into the realm of the ridiculous.

Or, in Truth-O-Meter terms: Pants on Fire!

http://weaselzippers.us/2013/07/11/...tory-vaginal-probes-in-ohio-pro-life-statute/

 

That would be true of everything in death unless you believe in an afterlife.

 

The word is viability, not let's see how many machines it takes to keep this baby alive. We turn off machines for actual people all the time and they die. Where's your weeping for them?

I guess we're going with the is it not wrong to end a life thing today? So Monday, we invade Iraq (500,000 dead), on Tuesday, we execute such and such people with drone strikes, on Wednesday we execute the latest prisoner, and on Thursday oh hell we can't have abortion, life is precious! You've got to be kidding me. What is it with the abortion and the screw the rest of the people who are actually born? How about infant mortality rates? Why aren't you all up in arms about that? These are actual born babies that have actual parents that want them. This mortality rate is a national disgrace. Not a word from you life is precious people.

The US has by far the highest first-day death rate in the industrialized world. The report states, “An estimated 11,300 newborn babies die each year in the United States on the day they are born. This is 50 percent more first-day deaths than all other industrialized countries combined.” The 33 other industrialized countries for which data was collected recorded a combined total of 7,500 first-day

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/05/09/moth-m09.html

What about just people dying because they don't have health insurance? What about those people? Where is the outrage about these precious lives? Conservatives are basically all about **** you if you can't afford it. Just die and go away. That's basically the conservative position on health care. Conservatives fought tooth and nail to preserve the system that allows 45,000 people to die every year because of lack of health care. You know there'd be a lot more credibility to this argument on abortion if you all gave anywhere near as much a damn about the living as you do the unborn.

Nearly 45,000 people die in the United States each year -- one every 12 minutes -- in large part because they lack health insurance and can not get good care, Harvard Medical School researchers found in an analysis released on Thursday.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2009/09/17/us-usa-healthcare-deaths-idUSTRE58G6W520090917


You know what, being born in poverty, going to a ****ty school, living a violent neighborhood, not having enough to eat, not having the money to go to the doctor, these are every day things for hundreds of thousands of kids today. Where is the whole life is precious thing for them when we want to cut food stamps, and cut head start school programs, and cut free lunch programs, and just basically gut the entire safety net that exists for these children? Where are you people then? I never see you.

With respect to the clinics, I've asked this several times now. Can you present any data whatsoever that these clinics are somehow less safe than any other clinics that do not perform surgery? Where is your information because it really seems like you're just pulling this whole thing out of your ass without any basis in reality. Are we going to ensure that every clinic in Texas for every type of procedure can ensure the safety of every patient for every possible complication or is it just abortion clinics? How weird is that. You've determined a problem without any data whatsoever and you're ready to implement a solution that may very well close 90% of the clinics in the state, all in the name of patient safety. How about we have these rules for ALL clinics? Why not that? We do want to ensure patient safety for every possible complication after all.

 

BTW, has anyone been following this in NC? Seems republican cowards pushed through a similar bill by attaching it to new motorcycle regulations.

I kid you not


North Carolina House Passes New Abortion Restrictions

North Carolina's GOP-controlled House passed controversial abortion measures Thursday tucked in a motorcycle safety bill on a 74-41 vote, according to the Charlotte Observer.

Republicans argue that the bill is about ensuring women's safety, while Democrats say the bill forces abortion clinics to adhere to unneccessary regulations they can't afford to comply with, essentially forcing the clinics to shut down.

Republicans came under fire for attaching the measure to the motorcycle safety bill because it allowed them to quickly push through the bill with limited public input.

 

No, those are pretty much verifiable facts.

Why are you even here any more? You have nothing of any substance to provide and all your posts amount to nothing more than some drive by quip nonsense.

You've become a complete waste of everyone's time. The troll game is up kid, move on.

 

I've asked these questions repeatedly in this thread with no response whatsoever. Since you're not here to troll perhaps you have an answer.

Can you provide statistics on safety standards and how they differ from clinics that don't do abortions? How many botched boob jobs and nose jobs and any other kind of outpatient procedure? Do you have any actual data that spells out a need to improve safety standards at abortion clinics? Where is all the evidence?

 

That's the point, everybody is talking about oh the baby, what about the baby?

The fetus doesn't care.

"Oh every baby deserves a chance at life"...did you ask him?

Hey baby, first you're going to **** your pants every 4 hours for the first 3 years, then you have 12 boring years of getting up every damn day to go school, your hormones are going to drive you to want to screw everything that moves but you betters are telling you, you must remain abstinent, then you go to work every damn day, screwing in screws, for 30 years, then you get to retire when you get sick and bent and then you get to spend the last 3 or 4 years, fearing your eminent death and ****ting your pants every 4 hours.

Sure, sign me up!

 

Typical post by you in a thread you started yourself. Nothing to say of substance, merely yet another nonsensical "Fail!" Really, you should try a new shtick, texxx. This one is getting rather boring.

 

Don't deflect. These are all things we should be striving to work on. Just because we disagree about the ways to accomplish the goals of education, healthcare, and poverty relief, does NOT mean we don't want to address these issues. Republicans disagreed about the methodology of the Affordable Care Act, it was bum rushed through Congress and it was so comprehensive that more than 3 years later they still can't figure it out. For heavens sake they admitted to not even READING the bill before some of them voted! Just like nobody wants abortion, nobody wants people to die because the are too poor to eat, or to go to a doctor. Nobody wants low income people to receive poor education. Nobody wants infants to die. We have to address all of these issues, but that does not mean we ignore THIS issue.

In respect to the clinics, there are most certainly complications, they are not reported because where do these women go? They go to emergency rooms. Did you not see all the women who testified that they were specifically instructed to call 911 if complications arose? Did you not hear the doctors who testified they have treated women from these complications that don't seem to show up on these statistics? Did you not hear from the women who experienced these complications and oversights and were scarred for life?

And once again, the scare tactic with the clinics closing. I do not believe that will happen. They used the SAME rhetoric in PA and what happened?

 

Yeah, I haven't heard why the Docs that want to do this just don't do it in a surgical center. Seems like there's one in every abandoned Piggly Wiggy around town.

 

Uhh... clinics closed. In Pittsburgh, for example, 5 of the 7 have shut their doors.

 

It was a republican bill.

anyway please proceed

 

It was Charlie Rangels bill...

 

There aren't many freelance abortion doctors. Most are from organizations like Planned Parenthood, do you think Planned Parenthood is going to allow it's doctors to testify on behalf of a bill that would cost them profits?

As for the centers closing down, from what I understood 5 total clinics closed in PA, out of the nearly 50? And I am sorry, did you miss the Gosnell case??? Clearly every abortion clinic isn't as well kept as you would prefer...Not to mention, if women's health is their main concern, they will have no issue because they can continue those services without upgrading AND!!!! THEY CAN RECEIVE STATE TAX DOLLARS!!!!!

 

http://triblive.com/news/allegheny/4012325-74/abortion-clinics-pittsburgh#axzz2Yn0j1hIc

Since June, five Pittsburgh abortion clinics have closed, state Department of Health records show. The department shut down American Women's Services on Fort Duquesne Boulevard. Others voluntarily closed their doors.

Two registered facilities remain in Pittsburgh, records show.

 

I just responded to that ^^^

I didn't say they all would stay open, but those that are unable to upgrade to compliance can remain open and continue to serve the population with 97% of the services they apparently are already providing.

 

Sorry - you thought that 5 closed in all of Pennsylvania. My link shows it's 5 out of 7 just in Pittsburgh.

...

 

I feel a bit sorry for you. I think you honestly believe the reasoning behind the bill. You've been duped, and were I you, it would tick me off. This bill has nothing to do with "women's health," and everything to do about outlawing a woman's right to chose what to do with her own body without the permission of a bunch of men. It's attempting to do that through the back door. I know your feelings about the matter, but you should at least understand the situation, understand what's going on. I repeat... this has nothing to do with women's health, and everything to do with attempting to legislate an end to a woman's control over her own body.

No thanks needed for telling the unvarnished truth.