Jackie, if you asked your average Chechen rebel what they were fighting for, to a man (or woman) they would say "a free and independent Chechnya" I don't think too many AL Qaeda operatives would say, and actually believe, that they were fighting for "The restoration of the Caliphate of Al-Andalus at Granada after Boabadil was expelled by Ferdinand and Isabel " or "the Reemergence of the Ummayyad dynasty", or "free and independent muslim America". Hence Bin Laden's relative unimportance as far as defining the actual goals of the movement -- which, now fractured, are especially unclear. You'd likely get generic answers about revenge and infidels and dogs and jihad and martyrdom, and America and Israel, etc. It's a broad based, relatively low intensity conflict, with ridiculously broad based (and unattainable) goals. Even a suicidal jihadist would realize in a logical sense that a free and independent chechnya is not outside the realm of possibility in their lifetime. THe restoration of the Caliphate is not, even if they state otherwise.
It's just beyond me how people can justify killing children in order to gain independence. What value does independence have, really...compared to the life of children? These people have everything completely messed up...how can people be so misguided. It's sad that people find justifications for living out the hate inside them. Fanatic extremists...I don't think people are born with that hate inside them...they somehow build it up or someone incites it...the worst are those who stir up the hate...and unfortunately, some muslim clerics keep doing exactly that .
Truly a sad day. The death toll seems to be increasing so I hope it comes to an end. I hope they capture the remaining terrorists who are running like dogs. These douchebags need to be brought to justice and in this case I really hope they die a slow and painful death. My prayers to the children and teachers and their families. Truly a sickening day and I hope justice is served very swiftly.
But aside from capturing the individuals who did this, how do you do that? THe Russians levelled Grozny once. http://www.siue.edu/~ejoy/Grozny March 1995 (van Wessel).jpg Are they going to do it again and destroy the burned out buildings? I don't honestly see any solution that doesn't lead to more violence and that is very depressing.
Sam, It has been reported that this was a JOINT operation among Chechen rebels, and Al-Queda. I know it is not the Muslim religion as a whole, but MAN, there are sure a lot more Muslim terrorists in the world than any other kind right now. If you read my posts then you would know that I am not against the Muslim religion per se, and I actually think it is a cultural war of a fuedal based system versus a democratic one. The corrupt leaders of these Muslim countries are hiding behind religion to line their own pockets and keep their populace poor and ignorant. Just my .02 DD
Then that is a truly disturbing development. The chechens are by far the most technologically advanced insurgents around.
Sam you make a great point and I don't honestly know, I don't follow Russian affairs to know the whole story and who is right/wrong and what needs to be done to fix things politically. All I know is they need to find who did it (including anyone who helped them) and deal with them. It just scares me to think something like this could happen anywhere (it is similar to Columbine but much more severe). I thought it was bad enough to go after civilians but targeting kids is unbelievable.
the connection to Al Queda maybe a way to discredit them it has become liken to comparing someone to hitler I don't kno what is up in russia but this is some sick sad sh*T rocket River
The ideal strategy would have been for Russia to cut the chechens lose back in the early 90's like they did for their other republics. Now they can't do so without losing face and it looks like a no-win situation for either side. Good background article http://www.qantara.de/webcom/show_article.php/_c-476/_nr-89/_p-1/i.html
President of Chechen republic Alu Alkhanov answered the questions of PRAVDA.Ru reporter Reporter. How can you explain such an outburst of terrorist activity in Chechnya in the last 10 days? Can the recent terrorist be connected with the elections of the new Chechen President? President Alkhanov. I would not connect the activity of terrorists in the last 10 days with the elections in Chechen republic. I think they want to destabilize the situation all over the region of the North Caucasus, not just in some republics. This is aimed to demonstrate the sponsors of the international terrorists that they do their job paid by the dirty money. And demonstrate their power and influence in the North Caucasus region. The second cause of the terrorist activity outburst is the need to remind of themselves on the eve of a number of political meeting at high level, where the Chechen issue was discussed. Reporter. Are the terrorist acts linked with the attempts to have the world public opinion influence the Russian authorities on the Chechen issue? The are still "freedom fighters" for somebody. President Alkhanov. No, these people have no morale, and the world has seen it. We have known this for a long time, and the new terrorist acts committed by these monsters, demonstrate their evil attitude to the humankind. In May 2004 these bandits knew what they were doing when they arranged the explosion at the stadium in Grozny, they were aware that the veterans would come to celebrate the Victory Day with their families, children and grandchildren. This could be done by people who have nothing human left - I have no doubts about it. As for the tragedy in North Ossetia, I have not encountered such a villainous crime towards children before. I have not heard of similar crimes in human history. Remember the words of Russian writer and humanist Fedor Dostoevsky that nothing is worty of a child"s tear. I want to look into the eyes of those Western and Russian journalists who still demonstrate their sympathy to those monsters. Will they dare to justify the bandits now? Today they committed the things which shocked the world. Reporter. What are the consequences for North Caucasus region and entire Russia from this most terrible terrorist act in Russian history? President Alkhanov. These bandits also have some other purposes. After every terrorist act, ordinary Chechens who are not involved in terrorism, who hate terrorism, com under the scrutiny of law-enforcers. Quite often, some people transfer their horror to terrorism to all Chechens. As a result, people who want to live on human values, who want to live in piece and raise children, suffer. As a result, we all, Russians, get caught in a trap on the rod of the insidious purposes of the terrorists and their commanders. ðÅrrorism has no nationality - everybody knows this. However, after every terrorist act, prosecution of people of some nationality takes place. We have information that people of different nationalities were in the terrorist gang which seized the school, but somehow it is emphasized that they are Chechen bandits. I believe that the entire Chechen people cannot be blamed for the illegal and unnatural way pursued by some bandits. If the society starts prosecuting Chechens, it contributes to implementing the purposes the terrorists pursue. Chechens suffer from terrorism most of all. I cannot call Basaev a Chechen. The fault of the Chechen people is that this b*stard called himself a Chechen. I would like that he would not be associated with the Chechen people. My condolences from me and the all Chechen republic to all the people of North Ossetia, all people of Russia. There is too much blood, deaths and suffer on our soil. This is our common pain. I said from the very beginning that we in Chechen republic are ready to assist the victims in any way. There has been a wave of protests in Chechen republic against the terrorist act in Beslan. People are condemning terrorism. Our people are against terrorism. We are mourning with the entire country.
Sane, I don't think anybody here has directed this at Islam as a whole. But how do you explain the fact that Arab muslims were among the terrorists? What other connection do they have to the Chechnyan terrorists?
I honestly don't know why Arab Muslims were among them, to be quite frank I'm not too familiar with the Chechnya issue. One thing I can tell you for is that it goes against Islamic law. You can't hard a child, woman, or even a TREE in war... and this is not even that kind of "War." But ofcourse, I don't speak for all Muslims. I gave you the facts (no harming children/women), and you can judge for yourself if Islam endorses this.
People blaming the Islamist involved worst than targeting innocent children??? Sane you thinking is messed up on this one.
