Not that I'm condoning it, but Islamists could put together a list of American atrocities that they would find just as reprehensible ...from their perspective. Think about that. They FIRMLY beleive Americans are terrorists. If Islam were to become the dominant culture in our world 200 years from now, for some reason, how do you think their society would reflect on Americans/westerners? ...as terrorists. Our modern day conflict with Islam stems from America "stealing" Isreal. And they are perfectly justified in that beleif. As already stated, the victors get to write the history books.
Everyone DOES NOT try to minimize...Many middle-eastern based terrorists actually target women and children willfully, such as those involved with Hamas, etc....
Exactly...If we operated on rules of middle-eastern based terrorists, we would just drop 15 to 20 MOAB bombs and call it a day in Iraq...
Like what?.... They also FIRMLY believe in the virtue of suicide bombing against women and children For some reason, Israel is willing to co-exist and recognize...Middle-eastern based terrorists do not. Further Israel like it or not is an ally...Even Obama on his website has reinforced the partnership of Israel. Also America did not steal Israel...Israel withstood many attempts on its destruction and the fact they have stood up to multiple fronts is perhaps divine. Jewish people have always been in the region and deserve to be there on a homeland free of those who wish to destroy them or wipe them off the map....I know feedom and choice is a weird concept to middle-eastern based terrorists,...but that is what the US is all about...God willing, that we always be the case.
Morally, I agree with everything you said. But looking at it objectively, all I am saying is if you ask them, they feel as strongly that we are evil ...just as we feel their actions are evil. And if their society happens to become the dominate society over westerners, then it is VERY easy to paint an ugly picture of western/christian societies. It was only 150 years ago christians were beheading people in the name of god. It wasn't long ago christians were burning "witches." It was America that supported the invasion and occupation of Palestine ...the most sacred place in the world. It was America that invaded Iraq ...where MANY women and children were killed despite our best efforts. ...and for good measure, Hitler was christian, right? So all I am saying, as an American, we take a crap every now and then and ours crap stinks too. And if Islam should become the dominant culture, then historians could very easily paint western societies to look pretty barbaric. To be sure I tie this in, I'm sure THEY feel we are terrorists. We're justified cause we support Democracy and human rights. They're justified cause they support God. Whoever is victorious, will be 'right'
With the Islamic terrorist it is easier to just call them terrorist. The target civilians way too much. They don't seem to have any code of ethics. The problem is with the way the American goverment has conducted itself lately it has been harder to take the moral high ground.
Bull. Source? The laser-guided bombs are built for better aim, nothing more. As I said, if "terrorists" had better bombs, they would use them. I'm not FOR calling anyone a terrorist. krosfyah is absolutely right. The people in power write the history books.
I'm sure they think we are evil...They don't call us the Great satan for nothing lol... And that was wrong... And that was wrong... Totally wrong,...How did the Jews invade when they always were in the area? All they need, deserve, want is a small homeland free of prosecution and those that want them wiped off the map. Hitler tried, several middle-eastern nations tried,...but you fail. Victor goes the spoils...It's time to recognize them and give them a hug...They are there and not going away...Even the most bad momma jomma liberal,..Obama has supported Israel in his website...Watcha think about them apples? Sure but pat your terrorist friends on the back for that...Pat dead Saddams grave site with the bottom of your shoe for that.... If you think so... They can say the holocaust didn't happen as well.,..er ..oops. yet we don't target civilians...VERY interesting....If we did, would it make you feel more justified in us being equally terroristic? We support God too, and we support things weird like rights, choice and freedoms...That's the differance. God willing that along with Israel will continue...The more countries which propagate rights, freedom, and choice the better...no?
I don't know...Ask Obama: On Israel Ensure a Strong U.S.-Israel Partnership: Barack Obama strongly supports the U.S.-Israel relationship, believes that our first and incontrovertible commitment in the Middle East must be to the security of Israel, America's strongest ally in the Middle East. Obama supports this closeness, stating that that the United States would never distance itself from Israel. http://www.barackobama.com/issues/foreignpolicy/
Exactly.. Terrorism is a tactic not an ideology. Nelson Mandela when he committed the ANC to all out violent war with the Apartheid regime rightly was called a terrorist for his willingness to embrace the tactics of terror to overthrow Apartheid. Nelson Mandela changed his mind and embraced the idea of peaceful negotiation and gave up terrorism so at that point he didn't deserve being called a terrorist. The problem is that we want to make the term to imply an ideology when it isn't that. Al Qaeda, the IRA, the Contras, Baruch Goldstein and Timothy McVeigh don't all share an ideology yet to if we come to classify "terrorism" as an ideology we might as well be saying they do. Yet we recognize all of them don't share an ideology even though they have used the tactics of terrorism. Instead IMO the definition of "terrorism" has now been dragged into convoluted definitions, of non-state actors, non-recognized actors, irregular fighters, non-uniformed combatants and etc... to get around that we've come to use the term as a general term for those who use violence that we don't agree with.
The history of the creation of Israel involved terrorists, Jewish terrorists. Groups like the Stern Gang, that included Yitzhak Shamir who later became a Prime Minister, actively engaged in terrorism against the British including the bombing of a British hotel. Other groups while more official groups that fought an armed conflict with the British like the Hagganah would be on par with a quasi-state actor like Hezbollah. Also if you're making an argument regarding morality and the use of tactics the use of terrorist tactics historically has had more to do with the difference of power regarding the combatants. The great Islamic military leader Suleiman was noted for his mercy, even by Christians. Salahudein who led the Muslims against the Crusaders was also considered more merciful than the Crusaders. It should be noted that during those times Islam was considered a greater power than the Christian World. On the flip side some of those who we consider heroes such as Benjamin Martin, of The Patriot fame, was rightly considered a terrorist even by Revolutionary war standards. We live now in a time where our country is the one with the powerful military with bombers, attack helicopters, and laser guided munitions yet if the tables were turned and we were the ones who only had small arms and old artillery shells fighting a foe vastly superior if we wouldn't turn to terrorists tactics.
I think you are missing the point. I'm not debating with you about the right and wrong of any of these things. I'm simply saying that just as much as you beleive you are right ...so do they.
Yeah, but why? Come on. Let's hear it. I'm also still waiting on your source for "terrorists" (I forget who you were referring to) targeting women and children intentionally. I'd like to see this for my own information.
No one id denying these people peace and independence. The question is why that land had to come from Palestine. This begs two further questions: - On what basis was it that Israel deserved Palestinian land? - What is the logic behind the expansion of Israel? I'm intentionally not making any claims here. I am truly just interested in what you believe.
Who should we target - the Sunnis or the Shiites? Or should we just bomb everybody? Who's the enemy, Roxran?
The only way to win a war completely is to whipe out a culture or hurt them so bad they capitulate. Anything else is a waste of time and/or money. Another way to win a culture clash - and IMHO that is what this is, is to slowly infiltrate their culture with our McDonalds, Music and KFC...eventually the world becomes one huge melting pot.... THAT way is much less expensive and much less loss of life. The other way is un-winnable unless you are willing to whipe out everyone, men, women, children...everyone....Roman style. DD
I spent a few nights in that hotel in Jerusalem in the mid-60's. The King David Hotel. It was a huge bomb that killed a bunch of people and injured a lot more. Almost all of them, probably all of them, had nothing to do with anything politically aimed at Jews or preventing the formation of a Jewish state. It was an act of terror, pure and simple. A real bummer. So yes, there are actors in that business of death and mayhem on both sides. The bombing of the King David Hotel merely being the most famous in the early days of fighting for a Jewish state. None of it, from any side, should be excused. You can never justify the killing of innocents. Sadly, the killing of innocents has become more common, not less. I hope that changes someday. Impeach Bush.
