What you do is what every other SERIOUS political movement has done and train your members on how to behave and conduct themselves at a rally, meeting or whatever. The groups that used non-violence for the civil rights movement trained their marchers to such a degree that they were able to be attacked, beaten, and worse without striking back. They knew exactly what kind of behavior was expected and carried it out. People in the tea party should post expectations and guidelines for any kind of function they hold. They should also not invite racists to open their convention with a racist speech advocating one of the primary tools of racism, the literacy test.
If I were in the crowd when it happened, I would speak up. If I was not in that crowd, but wanted to stay a Rockets fan, every time someone mentioned the action in question, I would decry the action, maintain that Rockets fans as a whole are not represented by those morons, and would steadfastly and consistently make it known that their views did not match my own. The disagreement was started by the TP and amplified by Faux "News" hosts. Since then, the only thing I seem to hear from the TP members and supporters is that there isn't any proof of what happened. They don't even preface it with "anyone who would say such a thing is a racist who doesn't belong in the Tea Party," they just ask for the "proof" over and over again. Silence on the subject of the racist remarks and questioning of the word of a civil rights leader who happens to be a congressman is a tacit approval of the racist action. All it takes is a single sentence to decry the racism, but I haven't heard any of the TP supporters saying such a thing, just "where's the proof." You have questioned the word of a congressman who, given his past, I would assert knows far more about bearing the brunt of racism than you do. When such a person says they were called a n***er, I tend to believe them over pundits who were not there. No, I decry the actions of racists because racism is deplorable and racists are despicable.
Giddy that was not the problem with the literacy tests. That was one problem with that particular literacy test. It is even clearer from this that you have no idea about the problem with literacy tests as they were used in prior to the successes of the civil rights movement. Tancredo advocated literacy tests to keep people who voted for Obama from being able to vote. Here is a sample from a literacy test. The problem with the sample isn't that it simply left off a party affiliation box, and with that it would have been just peachy. Guess what giddy? Literacy tests were ruled unconstitutional because they were tools of discrimination, not because they left off a box of party affiliation. You do yourself a real disservice by trying to defend this tool of racism. Again look at the photos of sacrifice that African Americans went through to get rid of literacy tests. Think about that while you say they would be OK if only they had a box for party affiliation. Think about what you are defending when you don't find fault with TAncredo saying that Obama was voted in by people that should be given a literacy test to keep them from voting.
If that happens its likely other Rockets fans will disown them as the mods on Clutchfans have kicked out posters who act offensively. If these guys got a lot of attention the Rockets organization would probably tell them to cease and desist any activities related or use symbols of the Rockets franchise, ban them from Rockets' games and likely speak out against them. For instance if an obnoxious Rockets fan called Kobe Bryant a "N---er!" and spit on him while he was walking into the stadium that fan would likely get banned from Toyota Center and persona non-grata on Rockets events. The Rockets organization and other Rockets fan groups can certainly police their own yet you are saying the Tea Party cannot.
As I understand it, TPs are a protest movement that may be morphing into a political movement. They are no organization, so how can they have a guidebook on how to train anyone. You are setting up a strawman here. No one has the authority to publish guidelines. If you are so hot onto it, why don't you post it and see if you can bring them into line. Hell, you can't even "control" the hotheads on here, how are you going to impact some stranger seven states away...
You'd have to hear it first. So when you are not there, what are you going to do: shout at your TV set? curse your computer screen? Do you think any Rockets fans have ever said something ugly to Karl Malone or any of the other reviled arch-enemies of the Rockets? What have you done to rectify that? I'm pretty sure some have done exactly what you say they haven't done. I'll look for same. Did you read the article I posted. Lots of TPers were outraged at the event headlined by Tancredo. What does that do to your theory here? David Gergen, among others, has said "where's the proof?" When I have time, I'm going to dredge up a sh____ad of kinder, gentler Tea Party stuff so that you guys will have to eat your words. It's okay to question the word of a congressman. All those hundreds if not thousands of protestors and one epithet was heard yet you want to boil it all down to that? Unreal. Agreed but let's have a proportional response to what happened.
I understand they are not organized. But when they feel like it they can organize enough to have conventions with racist speakers, and to try and craft a media image for the tea party. I'm just wondering why those things are more important than organizing for the purpose of cleaning house on some resident racists?
Are you saying that Tancredo is saying that those voters can't read or that those voters are not legitimate voters? Those are vastly different accusations. Perhaps there is more than one history behind literacy tests, but the mid-century version I read about Alabama indicated that the "test" had nothing to do with "literacy," it had to do with a means to manage the vote unethically and illegally. The party affiliation box (or lack thereof) was the mechanism that allowed such interference by party bosses. Did you look at the sample. There was NOTHING discriminatory about it. The way it was used was discriminatory. Doesn't that Alabama literacy test plus a party declaration = modern voter registration?
What Tancredo is saying is those voters are legitimate voters but they shouldn't be legitimate voters, and a literacy test would keep them from voting, so it would be a good idea to have one. Of course the literacy test doesn't say anything discriminatory on it. That was the point. It was the way they could discriminate and try to make it legal. But the tests were in fact discriminatory and it is why the Supreme court outlawed them. It is one of the reasons why protesters were willing to be beaten by police, attacked by dogs, hosed down, arrested, and even sacrifice their lives to rid our nation of such a horrible practice as literacy tests for the right to vote.
The hell he didn't: "... the accusation that he had been called the N-word and spat upon was a searing moment... many of us took it as "that's what happened"... if it didn't happen, I think it is important to know that... or if somebody was an impostor-- now maybe we'll never know."
He said "If" it didn't happen. He's not saying where's the proof. All he said was IF it didn't happen then it's valid to raise that as an issue. He never said show me the proof. or anything like that.
He lamented that we'll "never know." Is that not a cry for proof? And he "apologizes" by saying that many of us "took it for granted (that it happened."
If I wasn't there, but was painted by a Jazz fan of thinking the same way as the person acting a fool, I would let the Jazz fan know that what happened was the deplorable action of a sick individual and that the actions of one person do not equal the feelings of all Rockets fans. Well, when I was a Rowdy, I went and got the ushers several times when people around us got belligerent. If I heard someone at a game call even the hated Malone the 'n word,' I would let them know that I didn't appreciate their language and would get security to escort them out. There is no place for that in our society, racism is ugly, vile, and despicable. You do that. I am certain that there are some Tea Party members who are dismayed with the behavior, many of them have found their way to the Coffee Party lately. You may be able to find a few people who disavow the racism and those people have my respect. My perception is that there are a lot of Tea Party members who are not racists, but I have been disappointed that they have not been more vocal with the extreme elements in their midst. That is one of the things I like about the Coffee Party, civility is priority one and the extreme elements from both sides are censured or removed. The term "teabaggers" has been banned from the forums and moderators remove the term from posts, admonishing the posters to use the "proper term" for the group. It is refreshing to be able to converse without as much abusive, vitriolic nonsense being spread like so much manure. Wrong poster, I haven't said a word about Tancredo. I would hope that a lot of people would show some outrage to a twenty first century call for literacy tests, but I haven't followed that particular story. Who is David Gergen and why does his word have more credibility than a sitting congressman on the subject of whether that congressman was called a n***er? I would love to see said sh!tload, I could use some kinder, gentler words from a Tea Partier than what I have seen so far. Of course it is OK to question the word of a congressman. However, given the facts, I don't see any reason the congressman would have to lie. It doesn't "boil down to that," it is one element of the picture. It could have been a simple matter of everyone decrying the racist remarks and distancing themselves from the behavior. Instead, it has been a nonstop chorus of "where's the proof," which tells a sad tale about some people's willingness to excuse behavior which should be inexcusable in our society. How has my response been out of bounds? I would like to see Tea Party members and their mouthpieces of Faux decry racism in all of its forms. "Where is the proof" is a sorry response when someone in a group you support displays racism.
I don't think that "where's the proof?" was the original response. After the charge was raised and it became the flash point, some doubters rose to the surface to say "i was there and I heard no such thing..." Then it gained momentum. In this day and age, our natural response is to seek and expect audio/video evidence and it is usually abundantly and convincingly available... for my money, the N word was probably shouted by some angry lone wolf. Had a chorus of same arisen from the throng, I'd be worried. How many years did the Dems put up with the likes of Robert Byrd as a US Senator? I find it laughable that such a hissy fit and the onus of disciplining its ranks is heaped upon a loose aggregate like the Tea Party.
Are you effing kidding me? I heard of "where's the proof" comments coming out of Faux hosts within an hour of the incident. The "doubters" rose up alright, but it is not clear that any of the original doubters were even present when the alleged incident took place. More than ever before, this is the case. In this case, there was no video or audio, but I still don't think a sitting congressman would lie about having a racial epithet hurled at them. I completely agree. It was a lone nut whose actions should have been called out by the people next to him. He is a bigoted racist whose words should have been decried by the entire Tea party movement and he should have been excoriated by Faux. He deserved all the abuse that could be heaped on him, but instead got tacit approval from the people around him, who didn't say anything, and the people on Faux, who helped echo the "where's the proof" meme. After the civil rights movement, how many racist remarks did Byrd make? How many times was he accused of calling someone a n***er? IIRC, Byrd recanted his racism and called his participation in the filibuster of the civil rights act "regrettable." He took accountability, the TP has taken none.
I find it disturbing giddyup that you are defending the Tea Party's lack of discipline against racial hatred, homophobia, and a persona that borderlines on a xenophobic type paranoia. I mean, the Tea Party is about anger, and it's all about embracing everyone and anyone who's angry. Angry at "lazy blacks" angry at "liberal values" and angry at "gays". The Big gov't thing is all a cover for what's lying really underneath. Sure there are some who actually want a smaller gov't - but the truth is that gov't has been big for a very long time. Why now? Where were these folks when FDR expanded gov't like crazy???? These guys are asking to revoke the New Deal - why not? Why not end Social Security? Why not end all public programs??? eliminate all tax that doesn't support the military? Let states manage all these things themselves? Why are these guys just oppose to Health Care? Because it's a bunch of bull. This is just a guise to go after a black liberal president and they are not pissed at big gov't, they are pissed Obama won the election. That's why they won't disown their racist and disturbed friends in the party - because they identify with them. That is what represents this movement. It's the fire and spirit - that anger. Sure not for everyone, there are some fools who actually believe in the Tea Party's so called "mission". But let's be honest here, this thing is a joke. If a Republican wins in 2012 the tea party will be over - they will claim victory and crawl back into the shadows. They will disappear just as move-on has.
