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Taxing ammo over taking away guns

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Two Sandwiches, Jun 15, 2016.

  1. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    The US has been and continues to carry out military strikes against radical Islamic forces including drone strikes in various part so the World. The FBI and other law enforcement agencies have been and continue to monitor and arrest suspects who are expressing radical Islamic terrorist leanings. The president not mentioning "radical Islam" hasn't stopped his administration from actually going after groups and individuals who espouse radical Islam.
     
  2. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    You say that, but mostly the strikes have been ineffective.....and the only reason ISIS rose to power was the withdrawal from Iraq that Obama campaigned on.

    So sure, there are strikes going on, but they aren't really doing much to combat an enemy that Obama helped create. I know, we can blame what Obama campaigned on and took credit for on Bush, but I'm not sure that makes anything any better.

    If the US had never left Iraq, ISIS would never have become such a serious threat and it's likely those ISIS inspired attacks never happen. Hell that whole region is likely a lot more stable if the US had just done the right thing and stayed to provide security as Iraq rebuilds.....but that would have taken better leaders than the US had to work with.
     
  3. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    I really wonder if people like Space Ghost and the "Obama isn't explicitly stating 'Islamic extremism'" party honestly believe that because he doesn't state these things in public speeches, the FBI, CIA and the DOD etc. aren't targeting terrorist activity? DO they honestly believe this?
     
  4. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Or you know... not invade Iraq in the first place. Again, I keep on coming back to the oil spill analogy. Blaming Obama is like blaming the clean up crew instead of BP for the natural disaster that resulted from the oil spill.
     
  5. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Since the strikes have started DAESH has lost a lot of territory and resources. They've lost Ramadi and Fallujah in Iraq and within the year will probably lose Mosul.

    We've had this debate before but to reiterate the Iraqis wanted us out and as shown many were willing to die for that. The US could've stayed but it's pretty obvious that unless the Iraqi's were willing to do most of the fighting themselves they never would succeed.

    The US airstrikes are huge help to the Iraqis but the vast majority of the fight against DAESH is being done by Iraqis.
     
  6. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    If the US had better leaders, they could have convinced the Iraqis that if they left, the region would fall into chaos. Only those on the left and in Iraq seemed to not realize that instinctively. Of course since we had a president that ran on cutting and running, of course he was cool with it so the US cut and ran and Iraq became a failed state. They are starting to re-take some of what they lost to ISIS, but it would have never been a problem in the first place if the US had stronger/more capable leaders.

    The US tucking their tail and running away was a great propaganda tool for ISIS and was a big part of their rapid expansion. We basically created them and now there are multiple ISIS inspired attacks here in the US.....if Bush was still the president, we'd be blaming him for it, some probably will blame him anyway because the one constant rule is that you can't blame Obama for anything.
     
  7. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    It's as if you were in the situation room of the president himself as a close adviser when he made these decisions and aren't just some former enlisted soldier with no formal higher education with an insular lifestyle.

    So much conjecture and assumptions in one **** post. Typical bobby.

    "If the U.S. had better leader" then what? Then that superior leader can undermine the sovereignty of another nation? That's not how **** works bobby. I know you are just a mere enlisted low education indivudal, but let's be real here.
     
  8. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    Chris Rock once again with the answers to our problems.
     
  9. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    If the FBI were investigating, why was this guy not stopped and instead of closing his case? Listen, I am all for meaningful gun control. What I am not for is using every event as a platform and ignoring the root of the issue. Extremism is extremism and it should be denounced, not shuffled off onto another hot topic. Gun supporters fully understand this and all it does is agitate them more. How do you expect to get pro-gun people to go along with you when you fault their belief at every change.
    This is why Obama is a complete buffoon and his constant style of trying to anger people against each other to get his ideology passed is not working. If liberals gave a damn about effective gun control, tackle the day to day issues, not with some mental or fanatical mass shooting.
     
  10. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    Once upon a time they were investigating him, but they couldn't find any solid ties to terrorist organizations and so they concluded it was just him shooting his mouth off as a reaction to Islamophobia and stopped watching him. If the FBI was currently investigating him (like they are currently investigating Hillary Clinton) his firearm purchase would have been flagged.

    They don't follow people forever, but maybe a healthy change could be that if anyone once suspected to have ties to terror organizations purchases a firearm they flag them for further scrutiny even if they couldn't conclusively prove the link to terrorist organizations. I think that would be an acceptable compromise that wouldn't trample upon the 2nd amendment.
     
  11. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    This is a discussion better for another thread but to reiterate what has been brought up before.
    Both the GW Bush and the Obama Administrations told the Iraqis this and also tried to negotiate a new SOFA agreement that would have kept US forces in. The Iraqi government wanted nothing to do with it. Further most of America was very weary of the US involvement in Iraq. Yes Obama did run on a platform of reducing US involvement in Iraq and he won a very convincing victory. It was much more than just the Left of the US that wanted to leave.
    IN this case it is true because the original treaty was negotiated by the GW Bush Administration.. If you want to call it tucking tail and running the last administration does bear direct responsibility.

    Anyway I personally don't blame the previous Admin. The Iraqis wanted us gone and so did most of the US. Iraq is there country and ultimately it's always up to them to defend it.
     
  12. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    I hate to break it to you but LE doesn't stop every single situation.

    Further what does that have to do with Obama not using the term "Islamic radical"? Is because Obama didn't use the term that the FBI dropped the investigation into Mateen?

    Once again none of that has to do with that under Obama a very active campaign is being carried out against those very extremists.
     

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