Israel's indigenous arms manufacturing capability is more than enough to deal with the Palestinians or another set of Arab invasion attempts. Isolating Israel only removes whatever influence we might have on them. Not to mention that the PRC, France, and other arms manufacturers currently also sell Israel weapons and would be more than happy to fill any need.
Totally...at a recent gun show I saw the most menacing looking weapon I had ever seen. On the barrell it said "Product of the Israeli Military."
What I don't understand is why they keep surrounding his compound and shooting at some of the buildings. What kind of sense does that make? Either take over and get Arafat or what the hell are you doing?
They don't want Arafat. They are seeking the Palestinian officials to turn over 19 men who have been implicated in terror attacks. That is why they have surrounded the complex. If they took Arafat all they would do is turn him into a martyr...the Israelis know that.
I think I get what's going on now. Bush is using the Israelis to blackmail the Saudis to give us use of their bases to attack Iraq. It's the ole good cop/bad cop game. Bush sends in Sharon to surround Arafat, Arafat calls his buddies in SA, Egypt, Jordan, etc. to try to get Bush to call off Sharon, then ole Dubya says well... I'd love to help yall out with this thing but see we got this whole Iraq attack plan all ready to go but we got no stinkin bases to launch or planes from. Brilliant scheme Dubya!!! Errr... eh... uh...
HayesSreet, I don't get it either. Are the Israelis thinking they can just blow the building and Arafat up and say "whoops, it was an accident... sorry"? Do they think Arafat will give up and then they can ship him out of the area? Do they really think either instance would result in an improvement of the situation for Israel? I really think Sharon is half mad, as well as Arafat, and that the Israeli government as well as the Palestinian Authority are out of control. They both have been for some time. By out of control, I mean of the situation as well as their behavior. Extremists on both sides are pulling the strings and many of them are members of both governments. I visited the area in 1965 as a teenager when the West Bank was ruled by the Kingdom of Jordan. We went where we wanted, unless it was to cross the border to Israel, and it's difficult to think things have decended to such a hell for both sides. There is no freedom for Israelis and no freedom for the Palestinians. There is only fear, terror and death.
I think the basic premise is that if we make your life hard enough for long enough you'll give up those 19 guys. I'm not saying that they're right or that it will work...I'm just saying that looks to be the plan.
LOL! I wish Bush et al. could form such a detailed, consistent, and cunning plan on, well, any single thing, especially anything domestic.
Here we go again. Any criticism, or in this case a simple statement of common sense, is considered an extreme statement against all Jews or a desire to see all Jews and Israel exterminated. Oh well, this paranoia is understandable, but.....
How is this paranoia? Azadre once said himself, " when arabs get their sh*t together, Israel won't exist."
I Personally feel that our unwavering support of Israel caused the US's "war on terror". I do think Israel very much has the right to exist, i'm sure it could have been more diplomatic in its creation, but my only problem with Israel is its occupation and continual expansionist policies. Saddam is called an "expansionist" in the middle east yet the only country there that is continually creating new "settlements" and throwing the current residents out of their homes/land is Israel. This I don't agree with at all. It has nothing to do with religion or race, just right or wrong. And in terms of "Arabs get their s*$t together and Israel will be gone", that is just as blatantly a wrong policy as Israel's current one against the Palestinians. My only concern is that as a US Taxpayer, we give close to $15,000 a year to EVERY individual in Israel, not including Military weapons, IMF benefits, favored trading status and other benefits. In the meanwhile, Israel has sold secret U.S military and satilite technology to China, sent spies to the U.S. (Jonathan Pollard), mocked our country in their Cabinet meetings as to their control over us (Sharon to Peres) and created a huge backlash towards close to a billion people in the world. From an economic standpoint that is a huge group of people that are becoming disenfranchised with U.S. goods and companies and will ultimately adversely affect our international trade and foreign income of our US corporations.
...which means that we are responsible for what happened on 9-11? Even without the Israeli issue, we would have placed military bases in Saudi Arabia. That is the reason that bin laden initially declared 'war' on the US. He did not start mentioning the Palestinian issue until years later, when he found it to be beneficial to his cause. What US support for Israel does do is create discontent with the US among the Arab world, making it easier for obl to recruit. The question is, how much of the discontent is valid and how much is not? When you have closed societies, and reportedly school textbooks teach how evil the US is, how much Arab anger is attributable to valid reasons? I believe that Israel has done many wrongs, and I don't like Sharon. I think that we should feel free to lean on them when we think that they are headed down the wrong path (e.g. I think the settlements are cr*p). But I won't say that it's wrong that we should support the Israeli's right to protect their country. They make mistakes, but so have we (the Shah, bin laden, etc) and so do the Palestinians (suicide bombing civilians). To make it seem like such a one-sided issue is misleading and unhelpful.
Because glynch either does not have the memory or the proclivity to recall past comments. He often will only interpret the post at hand.
All kinds of stuff needs to change. There are palestinians and ARabs that believe Israel should not exist. There are plenty of Israelis who never want to have a palestinian state, and want to either kill or drive out all of the Palestinians from the area. When working toward peace the groups on both sides that feel this way, need to know that they will have no part in the future govts. of either side until those views change. And those views can change. There are people on both sides that are willing to co-exist. There are palestinians who don't believe in suicide bombings, and Israelis who are against the occupation and settlements. There are ISraelis who even want to give up some of the settlements that already exist. I just wish these groups could rise in power on both sides.
This ignores many facts. Saddam is an expansionist because he attempted to annex the sovereign nation of Kuwait. Israel has put up settlements in Palestinian areas which are within the borders of Israel. You can't be an expansionist in the true sense of the term by putting up settlements in your own country. I live in Harris County. If I build an apartment complex in Fort Bend County, does that make me an expansionist? Not in the true sense of the word. Same logic applies to Israel. I am not a big fan of the Israeli government...but let's be accurate about the highly charged words we throw around like "expansionist."
I think he means "expansionist" by using the UN Resolutions. I believe they state that an occupying country can't expand into an occupied territory. I am against the settlements and I believe that they should be on their own(No gov't funding) if they want to settle that land. Does this mean that they should be targetted by Islamic radicals? A few things need to happen NOW. The Palestinians need to start following the Oslo Accords and disarm themselves immediately. Hamas, Islamic Jihad, and Fatah need to stop the bombings or face destruction. Israel needs to stop shooting people for not obeying curfew. I thought that it was ironic that 2 days after Israel declined a peace deal, there were 2 consecutive suicide bombings. This is like Saddam telling the U.S. that he is harmless and asking for a peace deal. Sharon needs to ensure his people that radicals within the Palestinian people will not attack them.
Arafat wont name names. By JAMIE TARABAY .c The Associated Press RAMALLAH, West Bank (Sept. 23) - A defiant Yasser Arafat dug in at his besieged compound Monday, rejecting Israel's demand to hand over the names of all those inside. As Israeli troops settled in, criticism of the blockade - the third in 10 months - intensified in Israel. Prime Minister Ariel Sharon is boosting Arafat's popularity, instead of sidelining him, the government's detractors said. In another development, an Israeli man was killed and three of his children, ages 9, 12 and 18, were wounded in a Palestinian shooting attack in the West Bank city of Hebron. The 9-year-old was reported in serious condition. The assault on Arafat's office has made an already tense situation even more volatile. With Arafat ringed by troops and confined to a building Palestinians claim is in danger of collapse, Israel cannot guarantee the Palestinian leader's safety. Harm to Arafat, even unintentional, could ignite the region. Arafat's isolation has triggered street protests, some orchestrated and some spontaneous, in a replay of the scenes that marked the beginning of fighting two years ago. On Monday, Palestinians observed a commercial strike and staged more protests, burning tires and pelting soldiers with rocks - events rarely seen in recent months. About 10,000 rallied in Gaza, many schoolchildren bused in for the demonstration. For the first time since Israeli tanks crashed into the compound on Thursday - retaliating for a Palestinian suicide bombing in Tel Aviv that killed six bystanders - Israeli and Palestinian officials met Monday to begin feeling their way to a solution of the latest crisis. No progress was reported. Israel is demanding that all the men in Arafat's office building surrender for questioning. Israel originally said 19 terror suspects were in the building, including Tawfik Tirawi, the Palestinian intelligence chief. ''Israel's stand is clear,'' Sharon said Monday. ''Those terrorists must surrender to us. We will not compromise on this.'' Israeli commentators said it was not immediately clear why the government is focusing on Tirawi, who half a year ago had participated in security talks with Israeli officials, including the Shin Bet security services chief. During Israel's 34-day siege of Arafat's compound in April, Tirawi was with the Palestinian leader, but Israel did not ask for him to be handed over. Dore Gold, an Israeli government spokesman, said Israel subsequently uncovered information linking Tirawi to attacks on Israelis. Arafat rejected the Israeli demand for a list of names of all the men in the compound, said Palestinian Cabinet Minister Saeb Erekat. ''We told them (the Israelis) that this is none of their business, and we called for an immediate and unconditional withdrawal from President Arafat's office, and an end to the siege,'' Erekat told The Associated Press. Erekat said the building where Arafat is staying with about 200 aides and security officials is in danger of collapse. It's the only one left intact after Israeli bulldozers and bombs flattened most of the others. On Monday, tanks maintained a tight siege. Israeli troops briefly planted an Israeli flag on the compound, but it was removed over the weekend. Last week, Israel's Cabinet voted down a proposal, backed by Sharon, to expel Arafat. Israeli Foreign Minister Shimon Peres is among those who oppose expulsion, but said Monday that Arafat is either incapable or unwilling to stop attacks on Israel. The Palestinian leadership should ''prove its capability to rule, or it should appoint those who can rule,'' Peres told Israel TV. Israel was considering expelling Hamas leaders Sheik Ahmed Yassin and Abdel Aziz Rantisi from the Gaza Strip, said an Israeli official, speaking on condition of anonymity. Sharon said Monday that Israel would mount a military operation against Hamas in Gaza ''as soon as we have the necessary troops together.'' Columnist Nahum Barnea wrote in the Yediot Ahronot daily that Sharon is leading his Cabinet to the ''unavoidable decision'' to expel Arafat. Many commentators said they did not believe the alleged terror suspects were the real target of the siege. Analysts wrote that it was yet another attempt by Sharon to marginalize Arafat, in hopes of creating a power vacuum that would encourage a new Palestinian leadership. Instead, they wrote, it had returned Arafat to center stage, turning him into a persecuted underdog just when his image was at an all-time low. ''Sharon saved Arafat'' was the headline in the influential Haaretz daily. Until Israel moved against him, wrote Mideast affairs analyst Danny Rubinstein, Arafat was besieged not by tanks, but critics at home. Earlier this month, he absorbed a stinging slap from the Palestinian parliament, which forced his Cabinet to resign, ''Now he has nothing to worry about. Not the reforms, not the new Cabinet he is supposed to present on Sept. 25, and nobody is bothering him with the demand to name a prime minister to share responsibility with him,'' Rubinstein wrote. The shooting attack in Hebron was carried out as thousands of Israelis marched in the Palestinian city, under heavy army guard, to mark the Jewish holiday of Sukkot. Shots were fired at a Jerusalem family as it walked to the city's disputed holy site, the burial cave of the biblical Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. The father was killed and three sons were wounded, paramedics said.
