SuperSuperstar Shaq was easily taken out of game by Rockets, with fronting defense

Exactly. And this top 20 NBA player of all time who won 4 rings was also taken out with a fronting defense.

 

How did they do great defensively when both Scola and Landry had wide open shots because Portland was over-committing on Yao?

How were they great defensively when we were up 10+ points for most of the game?

 

t_mac1 already addressed it, but I'll repeat it.

Sure teams will adjust. In fact, it's not just the losing team that adjusts it's both teams. You try to fix the things that aren't working. What you don't do is change the things that are working. Why in the world would you change something if it's working?

Portland didn't lose game 3 because they doubled Yao. Portland lost game 3 because their offense was horrible. Likewise, the 2004 Rockets didn't lose game 2 because they doubled Shaq. They simply lost to a better team...a team that went to the NBA Finals.

 

watch the 2nd half again. they fronted yao without overcomitting much and JVG pointed this out.

if portland is able to negate yao with a simple fronting defense, it's going to be tough for us to score (which was what happened in the 2nd half)

 

The main reason was that they were trying to work Payton as a traditional PG into that lineup. They finally figured it out, by the end of the season, that Payton was over the hill and the best way to run that Lakers offense was still thru Shaq.

The team had a drastic makeover from the previous year. The regular season was a work in progress. Interestingly, for Lakers offense to work that season, Malone had to be in the lineup. Ball would usually stop to a halt unless Malone kept moving it.

Shaq was same old Shaq. He teared it up against Detroit in the finals. It's just that Cato had a history of keeping Shaq under control (not only fronting but behind him as well) and with Yao coming from the weakside, it made things much harder for Shaq. Rockets also had the luxury of putting Yao on Shaq, who too has done well against him defensively.

As far as drawing up analogy of Shaq fronting and Yao fronting, this is a classic case of cherry picking. Shaq did not dominate like he usually does because Rockets interchanged two big bodies on him who had a history of success against him defensively. Even then I dont think he was completely shut down.

Yao gets shut down regularly by fronting defense by big or small player. Fronting stops Yao. Period. No ifs and but. You dont need to double Yao when you are fronting him. Blazers are just stupid for doing so. The size of the fronter does not matter either.

There is absolutely NO WAY you could get away with fronting of Shaq by smaller and leaner players even if you had weakside help from the other side. And even with a bigger player fronting him, you had to have someone from the other side with size coming over. Shaq was incredibly mobile, had great balance, and had strong hands, so a lob pass was always good with him. Yao lacks in all these departments, which is why he struggles with lob passes, which is the main way to attack fronting defense.

Let's stop cherry picking and making excuses for Yao. He has his limitations and teams exploit them.

 

/thread. very insightful post.

 

LBJ got >50 points for sure...

 

I do not understand the fascination with getting Yao his numbers...

Get the ball to the open man. I can live with Scola taking the looks he gets as a product of Yao.

 

I think that its very telling the respect that the Blazers have for him when they are over-focusing on preventing him from getting the ball. Yao could average 10 points per game this series, but if his mere presence on the floor requires double teams and hard aggressive fronting schemes(and the reliance on the 4 other defenders to protect the weaknesses of said front) is getting open looks for his teammates you cant ask for much more than that. I mean, most teams hope to get a post up threat so that they can force a double team and kick out to an open shooter or slasher. Heck, the Blazers are sometimes giving the Rockets that while Yao doesnt even have the ball!

 

Exactly...

Coaches have to make a decision do I (A) Stop the star player or (B) Do I stop the role players...

A lot of times Coaches will go with (A).. The golden rule is never let the star player beat you.

 

Very well stated....

That approach works on every LEVEL from Junion to the Pros.

 

Which is why on a final possession situation an all out fronting/deny defense is a pretty good idea. But for an entire game, the other team will get used to it and will start to make you pay.

 

Yes sir....

The Playoffs are all about adjustments... Some Coaches never adjust, some adjust per game, some adjust per half and others adjust per quarter.

 

Dude thats one game, how many time have Yao been taken out of a game from fronting? A lot more than one game. It could happen to anyone for one game but fronting couldn't stop Shaq 9 out of 10 times.

 

I think you may be missing his point.

 

Holy crap, you're acting like we're down 0-3 and the Rockets are playing terribly. We're exploiting the defense they're doing by getting wide open shots with everyone else -- if it wins the game, do it. Force feeding Yao in heavy coverage is a bad idea.

 

Kobe went 5-24, everyone has a few bad games here and there.

 

Huh?

So far we're shooting 51.4% from the field in the series.

If that's "great" defensively then, then, then... I don't know what to say.


In games 2 and 3, we've shot 51.75% from inside the 3pt line - that's with Yao being fronted.

In fact, the only reason we're not up 3-0 is because we missed an uncharacteristic 10 free throws in game 2 (22-32). (we're normally above 80% - so add 4-5 points on).

Their fronting/ doubling of Yao is no big deal for our offense, it's simply not troubling the TEAM. It might be holding Yao back, but I'll bet he doesn't mind - we're winning!

 

Tmac_1,

Sometimes you say strange things that make me think you don't understand the game all that well at all.

Teams rarely adjust after a win, but most adjust after a loss, only the truly dogmatic fail to adjust and those are the coaches that are not going to take you to the promised land.

If the Rockets committed to shutting down Shaq, and they did, but still lost, they would continue adjusting trying something else, which probably opened it up some for Shaq.

If you decide to shut down one thing it opens up others....you can not do everything.

The Blazers have thus far committed to shutting down Yao...great...who cares? The rest of the Rockets are getting theirs.....now if they adjust to let Yao have a little more freedom, then others numbers will go down but Yao's will go up.

It is the typical, if the left one don't get ya the right one will.

I could care less how many points or shots Yao gets....he got a ton of rebounds, was HUGE on defense and dominated some parts of the game there.

That is enough, you know how I know?

The Rockets won...

DD

 

See people, here is a great example of someone who DOES understand the game.

Well spoken sir...shamrock for you.

DD