Suns Lose to Hawks. Polish the MVP Trophy for Nash

Yeah Amare, you do man. A real MVP candidate.

 

Isn't the only thing he does is dunk?

 

but that isn't what the award should stand for. It isn't logical to choose the best player in the league based on how he fits a system.

dirk is having a better year, but it isn't because of team record or his teammates. it is because he is having a better year based on OBJECTIVE stats, not some crap in the sky cliche

 

Anyone who follows the Rockets knows that Battier is the third most valuable player on the team after Yao and McGrady. But his PER isn't particularly good.

So, how do you quantify value?

One alternative to PER is looking at +/- stats, or a combination of +/- and PER stats (the "Roland Rating" at 82games), or adjusted +/-. Nash does quite well based on these metrics (as does Battier, incidentally).

 

So do you think team record (highly dependent on everyone else on the team) determines value? I wonder how Nash would do in Paul Pierce or Dwyane Wade's place. He's such a valuable player after all, there's no way the Celtics or Heat would do bad if they had Nash!

 

Man nash is the mvp this year by far, but I fully expect dirk to steal his trophy cause the writers won't want to give him 3 in a row.

 

He would get them in the playoffs easily.

 

So you think the MVP should be given to the guy who's lucky enough to be on a good team with good players?

 

pure opinion

 

Stats is not everything! Nash has proved that he can fill the stats when the teams' plan is to shut down his teammates, Nash has scored 40++ points and he is such a good shooter you just cant deny it.

Nash doesnt usually put on big numbers like Wade, Kobe etc, He doesnt have to because his job is to run the team to perfection, give guys like Amare(struggling without nash, best center? my a$$), marion, bell etc easy shots and that's the easier way for him to lead his teams to victory! So in this case stats means nothing! NOTHING! Wining is all that matter!

Stop putting wade in the MVP talks, please, for god sake! Wade struggles to lead his team to victory without shaq in the leastern conference show that he is not good enough to be considered MVP. If people insist he put up crazy numbers and should be considered MVP then our very own T-mac should be included and put ahead of wade because t-mvp leads his team to victories in much tougher conference!

 

Agree on a statistical metric (hopefully a good one and not the crappy "Efficiency" rating on NBA.com, getting input from leading figures in the stats community wouldn't hurt), then give the MVP award to the player who comes out on top based on the numbers. Make it clear that that's JUST what the numbers say, and that while you're confident in the quality of the system, it's possible (and probable) that it doesn't account for everything.

If sometime later you discover flaws in the system or come up with a better metric, then don't be afraid to implement the new system and to publicize how things would have been had this new system been in place before.

 

seeing how you're picking on me and my posts, here's your answer:

Would he make the Celtics or the Heat better? I honestly have no idea. It would be stupid of me to say yes but it's also stupid of me to say no. Why? Because he proved that he was a good player in Dallas and he's proven that he's a better player in Phoenix. Quite honestly, and this is not to get you riled up, if you put him in Boston with Paul Pierce, Wally Sczerbiak, Al Jefferson, and Gerald Green who wouldn't believe that that team would be contending for 1st in the East?

And in Miami? Probably not because look at the make up of their team. The only athletic players they have that can sustain an uptempo offense is Wade and Wright. You swap Wade with Nash and I find it hard to see them being a playoff team.

The award is what it is. There will be some biasness and sometimes there won't be. There's one year where the player with the best PER won the MVP award but then got thoroughly humiliated in the WCF by a player with a lower PER. Explain that one to me.

 

Suns lost to hawks....
priceless....

 

I was with you about Nash until you turned on Wade. He absolutely belongs in the MVP talks -- directly behind Nash and Nowitzki.

 

So you think the MVP should be given to the guy who's lucky enough to be on a good team with good players?

 

Funny that you try to say Nash's team is doing good because he got better teammates. But please explain why these teammates and two of them all-stars failed to lead the team to victory, against crappy teams like sonics, hawks and road weary bulls, without nash and barely beat lucky enough to beat blazers.

Their only victory without nash is against nuggets who are with two of their best players, AI and Camby.

How nash will do in pierce and wade's place is ridiculous comparison. Is like saying T-mac will win 5 rings with shaq instead of kobe!

 

it is a r****ded award period, i only care about it because others do. I've seen way too many fans on way too many forums saying "Player X is better than Player Y because he has more MVPs." Past MVP winners are regarded as basketball gods by revisionist historians whether they deserved the award or not.

 

well would it make you feel better if Phoenix wins the NBA Championship this year? Of course, wouldn't that back up Nash's MVP awards?

And I think you need to re-evaluate the people that are making those claims. Hakeem Olajuwon won it once and O'Neal won it once. They aren't lesser players than Nash are they? Of course not, so as long as you can see that, don't bother trying to disprove them. Just...move along.

 

Basketball is a TEAM sport, and good teams are often good because they have multiple stars and good players. If Nash was putting up the same numbers now on a team without Amare and Marion, he would probably only get outside consideration for the award, with no serious chance of winning it. That doesn't mean that he would be less valuable as a player, just that his teammates aren't as good.

 

I like Wade alot too and he has proved he can lead his team to W without shaq before. But just not this season, so far, his team is barely over 0.500 mark. Well things might change in the second half cos it's still a long season to go!

For me, i will put Wade behind Nowitzki, Nash, Duncan and T-mac in the MVP race for the moment!