Now that the pick has materialized, regardless of who they pick, as long as it is one of the top 4 guys, I am starting to view some of the decisions the front office has made a bit differently. They absolutely could have gotten more for their players had they not catered to James so much before, but that is the old regime. What are your thoughts on this new front office now vs. the beginning of the season? -Avoided Tyler Herro, who's value has absolutely tanked and it looks like can be had for very little now -Losing Harden hurts, initially I felt we got 25 cents on the dollar, but seeing him unfortunately be injured and during crucial moments, it may be that we did not sell as low as we thought we did on him -The Brooklyn picks were initially not that appealing to me, but the fact is the team already looks unstable, there are rumors the front office is not happy with Kyrie taking that much personal time off during the season, and may be looking to move on from him, but who really wants to take a risk on Kyrie? That franchise has literally done everything for him, he is playing on the franchise that he grew up watching in his home state of NJ, he got paid a 1.5 years of super max money to literally not even do any work. He gets to be with two super star buddies of his, there are not many teams that make sense for a trade here. -Avoided Ben Simmons, now he was not the guy from the beginning in my opinion, the 76ers package was only initially appealing to me to flip Ben Simmons, his value has now absolutely tanked by his own team throwing him under the bus and the media destroying the kid, dodged a bullet with this trade. -Trading Victor Oladipo for what was seemingly scraps, just to have him get reinjured in Miami and likely will get the vet minimum? I may be wrong on the vet minimum, but not sure what his contract will look like now? We ended up getting KO, which when I saw people talk him up I thought it was a complete joke, but as Luis would say, he look OK. I still think we could have handled this trade better by trading him to wherever we felt like instead of his preferred destination. However, I think by us trading every player to their preferred destinations, the team has built some goodwill. Jalen Green looks like he wants to be here, any of the top picks I am sure would prefer Houston over Detroit, Cleveland, or hey maybe they don't want to leave the country to Canada either. Either way we still have some goodwill in the league in my opinion by catering to the players. -PJ trade, I believe we got a pick or pick swap? Either way, I was already fine with this one anyways. -Tate, Wood, KPJ, and KJM I already thought were good moves, my opinion has not changed on them since they were acquired. -I am not sold on Silas or the decision to hire him, but I am OK with giving him another shot, many coaches are not able to make adjustments outside of the off season, and he probably made plans as if he were going to have James Harden. He needs to put in real work this off season to keep his job. Overall I still do not like Tilly, think he has made errors in trying to save money, but the front office looks better than I initially thought, is that luck or did they see what many of us did not?
When I heard Morey was quitting , I was afraid the team would see many dark years because I had little confidence Ferntits would hire someone competent .... Stone's been pretty damn solid from day 1 , I can't complain about anything he's done really ..... I liked the Harden trade from the get go , there's no getting equal value for a player like him but controlling another teams draft for 7 freakin years is crazy. I like the young talent he's accumulated in a single offseason and think several of these players will stick in the league. The Covington / Wood transaction was an absolute steal ... gave Portland Covington , got Ariza and a #1 , gave Detroit Ariza and got Wood and a #1 .... That #1 being so heavily protected makes it impossible for Detroit to trade future picks - until that pick conveys. You know Detroit love to get out of that mess .... Now we've got three #1's to play with in the draft .... after not making a pick in the first round in the last 6 drafts .... That was one of Morey's mistakes , he let that team get old and expensive by not adding draft picks on rookie contracts. Still , as good as Stone has been , the future success of this team boils down to one thing - Has Tilman learned his lesson on spending ? You just can't cut corners and damn sure can't throw away asset after asset to save a few $$$ and expect to win championships .... even with a generational talent like Harden pulling the wagon. We'll find out sooner than later - what they do with Olynyk's bird rights and if they use the NT-MLE .... which would make for a very expensive roster for a team that's not expected to make the playoffs - but its the right thing to do in terms of building a roster , making use of all your assets for the future betterment of the team. If Ferntits hasn't learned that lesson , we may as well get used to mediocrity at best. I'm not holding my breath....
I'll give my opinion after the draft... However, up to this point, he has been pretty great. Solid B so far.
For me Stone is an A. Everybody who thinks he gets a B or lower are expecting somebody with trade override ability in real life. This team was a mess there is no quick fix, not if you want to build a long term contender. Stone went into one of the worst franchises I mean look at what we have when he got hired: 1. Harden pissed and became fat 2. Saddled with Westbrick 3. Morey traded like 5 of our future picks trading for both Cp3 and WB. 4. The Rox have 0 youth, didn't draft a first rounder the last 4 years thanks again to win now mentality 5. Capped out with 2 super max guys and a bunch of unhappy vets There weren't really any alternative aside from trade Harden and get goodies. Look at New Orleans everybody said they did a good rebuild but if you exclude lucking into Zion how good would a squad of Lonzo and Brandon Ingram look? It's not really better than we have now. After 1 FREAKING YEAR, the Rox are on the 2nd tier of rebuilding teams only eclipsed by OKC. They have the most future draft assets in any team in the league, again after OKC. He also got 2 good foundation levels guys in CWood and KPJ...again in only 1 year. Sacramento has spent decades in the lotto the only foundation guy they got right now are Haliburton and Fox. Compare Sac now nd Rox, Houston is actually in a better spot in only 1 year lmao. in this draft which is regarded as one of the more loaded ones, we got 3 picks in the first round no 2, 23 and 24. That ain't bad for a team who had 0 picks the last 5 years and just gave away 5 future picks. Next year in what is projected to be an even more loaded draft we got 3 picks again. I mean, anybody who is complaining at this point at Stone just don't understand what is going on. Could Stone have done better? Of course, but if you look at where we were at the start of the season when he got hired and where we are now the Rox are obv much improved. It is one of the best 1 yr turnarounds I've seen since I followed the NBA, excluding some franchise lucking into a superstar talent into the draft like Nuggets with Melo or Lebron with the Cavs.
One could argue having harden as an asset to get rid of will accelerates any type of rebuilding. I would let him draft/handle wall contract before making any real judgement.
The Rox havent received any compensation yet from the Harden trade, thats what makes the job Stone has done so far amazing as the benefits from that trade is still untouched unless you count getting a look at former all star Dipo. I guess thats a benefit as well even if they ended up passing on him. NO for example the benefit they got from AD is top 4 pick, Lonzo, Ingram and Hart. Meanwhile the Rox got Wood, KPJ, Kmart Jr and Tate. Its very comparable except the Rox still hasnt used the assets they got from Harden trade. NO needed to trade AD to get their haul the Rox got their guys without touching the goods they got from Harden yet. Harden getting low return is by design I mean the dude sprang his request last min and did everything he can to destroy his trade value by showing up at of shape, throwing balls to cause fight in locker room, trying to appear fat via gorging on water and then publicly throwing his entire team under the bus. I feel like you cant blame Stone for getting less than market for a former mvp when the other guy has malicious intent. Im just happy KPJ threw food after Harden got traded cuz if Harden saw that he might have done the same just to trash his value even more. Stone already drafted/traded for KPJ, CWood and KMart Jr, Tate. Regardless what happens with Wall and the draft those moves he made so far stand alone and should be evaluated on their own merit.
Let's wait until after the draft and free agency before we make a snap judgement. So far the best moves have been 1. Getting KPJ 2. Signing Wood 3. Finding Tate 4. Buying a 2nd rounder to draft KMjr Add all the picks accumulated, and the bones are there. It has been successfully blown up, but how successful will the rebuild be?
Stone has done well apart from going after Oladipo. He didn't have any choice apart from Wall because of Westbrook's contract. I'm giving him a B minus. There is no doubt that this draft will either solidify his position or drop his value. I hope he will be successful. TF and PF shouldn't have any say in choosing players or trading for them. PS: Will the Rockets cross into the LT territory if they retain all the 3 picks? @BimaThug
Attaching the 23rd, and the 24th picks plus another player on a short contract will be necessary to move Wall. I wouldn't do that. We need to acquire depth from this draft class and to develop it.
I think he's done as good as anyone could do given the situation. I think we're set up really well to compete for a championship sooner rather than later. by tanking from 2021-2023 we should have 3 top 5 picks in what is supposed to be loaded drafts. start with a young core of should-be max salary players, then by 2024 when we owe our own picks to okc, wall comes off the books and we can overpay some vets to support our young core to make a playoff push. the picks we convey should be late lotto or mid first round. not devastating. in fact by 2024 the nets picks start to get good from '24-'27 those picks will be cost controlled when its time to max out our '21-'23 guys so we should have some loaded and talented teams from '25-'30. that's not counting the fact that while tanking through '23 we can still trade guys for even more picks along the way. now although stone has set us up well, it will be up to him to carry out this plan by drafting correctly and developing his young talent into something special. so his grade on the first exam looks good, but the mid-term and the final exams are years away. as for Tilly, he was cheap as hell, took 3 years to completely clean out a championship organization from the front office to the coach to the stars. what a dummy. will he change? probably not. can we count on him to spend on a top notch scouting department so we get these drafts right? can we count on him for a top notch player development staff to ensure our picks reach their potential? probably not. he's not spending on building robust departments consisting of top talent in their fields. he'd rather save money and work with a skeleton crew of bottom barrel cheapest hires possible. so I do have my concerns about us being able to make the right choices on draft night and develop these kids into something special year after year. that's one of the reasons I lean green. his reported work ethic means less responsibility on the rockets development department. green takes ownership of his own development at a young age, I'm sure he'd get his own trainers and coaches in the offseason if Tilly won't provide it.
Well said...couldn't agree more. I trust Stone and look forward to him killing the draft. I'm not worried about the infrasctructure. What concerns me in this whole deal is the possibility of Tilman getting impatient, making the wrong move/ too early. On the other hand, he knows well, the benefits of letting it grow.
Of the assets in this draft , the Harden trade accounts for NONE of them - those were accumulated in the Covington-Ariza-Wood swap with Portland & Detroit - a pick from Portland this year and a lotto protected pick from Detroit sometime between now & 2027 and then the PJ Tucker deal to Milwaukee ... They also own Milwaukee's 2023 #1 pick. The only "asset" from the Harden trade this year was a pick swap that they wont be swapping & Olynyk. They have 3 first round picks in this draft , in each of the next 3 drafts .... nucking futz after going 6 years without a #1 pick.Houston Rockets - Future Draft Picks | Fanspo As for what they do with Wall , I think its a safe bet that he is a Rocket for at least the coming season as it'll be asset prohibitive to move him before , at minimum the start of the 22/23 season and more realistically that years trade deadline. It really makes no sense to use assets to move him from what is likely to be a lottery team.
I'm 50/50 on management I was worried Kenyon Martin jr was going to be another Kenny "Sky" Walker at best; which is a liability if you can't shoot 3's and are not a PF or Center. Vincent Edwards bust probability. Now that KMjr has shown a glimpse of 3-pt shooting ability, he may be a good find...in spades. Averaged 17 points a game in last 12 games at around 39% from 3 and someone posted around 87% NBA percentile as Roll-Man in PnR. Tate was a good find. Weaver did a good job of convincing management to give him a chance.....helped that he was cheap and the Rockets couldn't afford much. At 6'4" will be limited to slightly better than he is now. KMjr has a slightly greater ceiling. Khyri Thomas was a nice get. For those who put down the G-league, Thomas played some minutes there this past season. Shows solid potential on both offense and defense. Oladipo was a bad deal in my opinion. Word had it Stone was fond of Oladipo in the past. Jumped at chance to nab Dipo when the opportunity came about. _________________________________ Now we hear Stone is enamored with Evan Mobley. If Evan Mobley is the pick at #2 it can/will be a defining moment for this current managements future. If Evan Mobley does not gain weight and has trouble transferring his skills to the NBA level and passes up on what some consider the next Kobe/MJ in this NBA-lite era. I have Evan Mobley best year (year one) getting 19 points per game; but teams get a scouting report that sticks with him for years and limits him to a career average of 16 points per game. That would be an Epic Fail..... especially if Jalen Green is going for 25 to 30 points a night and is electrifying crowds and generating tremendous revenue for the team that drafts Green. If Green is not the pick and he doesn't have a stellar career and averages less than 18 pts a game......then Stone and company will look brilliant. Why 18 points, because Mobley 16 points per game also brings intangibles such as rebounds, blocks that make Mobley the better asset. But if Jalen Green gets 19 points or more per game plus steals; Green will be the greater asset. How many points above 19 points per game will distinguish or separate between the two players. Of course there are those who think Mobley will average around 25 points per game...... Good luck with that AD/Durant dream. Hopefully if Evan is the pick he does turn out great, then I have no choice but to say Stone and company are brilliant.
I don't see a real need for Hornacek as a assistant. He can only teach off ball shooting. Replace him with a multidimensional coach who can train bigs. I still have Green ahead of Mobley, but if he is selected instead of JG, we will need a coach who can develop him. Are there any names that you can suggest?
I just saw Stone saying on YouTube the Rockets needed to move Oladipo. He implied it didn't work out . That gives me some hope that he won't go after another injured star again. RW forced Stone's hand to go after JW. They were trying to retain Harden. This is no longer the case.
B- indeed, Oladipo trade could have been avoided. Stone shows promise but it's too early to tell, plus you never know when Tilfart is going to introduce himself into the process and screw everything up for years again. Thanks for the Westbrook trade Fertits!
