My take on the coaching situation is this. Larry Brown would have been a nice quick fix to get us 'there' but would not likely have stayed long enough to see it through. He's done some great things and is well respected but if he goes elsewhere thats his call. If he came here there is no doubt the team would get better. We may have even won it all in just a few seasons. This would be the most talented team he'd ever have taken over and if we realized the same level of improvement as other teams then would have had a shot right away. Given the other available coaches these are the three I would consider at this point. JVG, Dunleavy, Carlisle. Les has said he wants an offensive coach: drop JVG He wants a proven winner: Dunleavy and Carlisle have both won to a degree. Dunleavy did well his first year with the Lakers before the Magic mess and in Portland with a team that had all the talent and all the head cases to prevent them from getting it done. He has a better playoff % than Brown too. Carlisle has done wonders with Detroit and they have definately over achieved but does he have enough history for Les to make the call? If he comes and brings his defensive assistant with him we'd definately improve on both ends of the floor. So at this moment I would expect Dunleavy to be the next coach. After Carlisle has interviewed this may change.
Quittan, Excellent summary. I completely agree. I would tend to favor Dunleavy over JVG (not by much though). Carlisle is interesting. Rumor has it that he rubbed alot of people the wrong way. Les and CD certainly haven't had any one like that work for them that is like this. Would he rub them the wrong way? That is really my main concern with him.
I just can't see interviewing Carlisle if it is known that he is a headcase. He may be a talented coach but won't succeed if he alienates people.
It's known that some people in Detroit believe him to be a headache. An interview might help to clear that up. Also looking at Detroit, I think their mgt. is a problem. Look at how they treat successful employees. I don't know what went on behind the scenes, and maybe Carlisle is more of a problem than he's worth, but it wouldn't hurt to interview him.
Yeah. And a bad one too. I am so used to seeing people say "Scottie Quittan" than it has stuck in my head.
Do we know he is a headcase? I asked the question if he was because of Billup's comments. Since no one in Detroit or around the league has come out to say anything against this then I may be true. Then again his supporters may not feel like justifying the comment. If you've got good information please present it so we can get a better handle on this guy.
Someone will take a chance on him though. Not sure if it would be us. Rudy and Carlisle seem to be on opposite ends of the personality spectrum. Les and CD might not tolerate that much of a change in coaching personalities.
All I'm saying is that the consensus suggests that the guy is more headache than he's worth. Reminds me of a Dennis Rodman like coach. He has the ability but his mouth gets in the way.
MacBeth, et all, Please excuse me for being a little late in the line here, but I am curious about a few things you and others bring up. I mostly agree with your assessment of Dunlevy. I have no idea whether he's a "nice guy" or not. I know I act like an awfully nice guy at my job interviews and he's definitely got a hankering for this job. Regardless, I don't feel he brings anything exceptional to the table. Regarding Brown and JVG, I have a few more questions. I do not question Brown's ability to squeeze every ounce of talent out of his players. He's just wonderful. He's also a lousy GM and that just makes his coaching abilities all the more impressive. He kept turning over the talent, getting new underachievers/malcontents (Coleman, Ty. Hill) or guys that just hadn't done much of anything with their fair, but unexceptional levels of talent (Snow, Lynch, McKie, myriad others) and made them work with a great, but unorthodox and obstinate talent (Iverson) to achieve success, falling just short of a championship. They were one of the least talented teams that I can ever remember going to the finals. BUT, the only, but inevitable BUT with Brown, how long would he stick around. 6 (measly) years isn't even his common cycle, it isn't a given, it's the LONGEST he's ever coached anyone. During baseball season I do my New Yorker thing as a diehard Mets fan and I can tell you over these years, getting through a chaotic baseball season of Mets insanity to find sanctuary in the stability of the Rockets has always been a wonderful relief, even in the lean years. Brown is a wonderful coach, but he's 62 and not to be counted on for more than three years. A five year contract with Detroit (UNSIGNED as yet) is meaningless. He'll come and go as he likes. All that said, yes, he's still so good that it's worth the risk of being left high and dry to pick him up at whatever the cost. However, questioning JVG's commitment and championing Brown in the same sentence seems a bit vacant to me. Speaking of JVG, I don't understand some of the comments about him. Macbeth, you said you had serious questions about him; what are they? I've heard of him referred to as a "defensive coach" by some folks here, perhaps implying that he doesn't run an effective/impressive offense. Addressing that, I don't think there's any evidence to suggest this. Almost all very good coaches (perhaps excepting D. Nelson) are good defensive coaches. One cannot have a top notch successful team that doesn't play (at least) good defense. Not only that, but most of defense is effort. There is certainly talent, physical and BBall IQ, related to quality defense, but a good coach can take mediocre talent and get them to play good defense with selfless hustle and well crafted schemes, and get some wins that way. My college bball team was short and slow, so we played like Fratello's Cavs of a few years back, slow and deliberate and with tough (well, an aproximation of tough) defense. We shouldn't have won a single game, but we managed to eak out a few (just a few) with that puke ugly style. Sorry, a bit long and drawn out, but the point is JVG took under talented, incondite teams much father they should have gone by talent alone. A good coach takes the talent he has and makes the most of it. Did anyone say Pat Riley was a grind it out defensive coach with the Lakers? Of course not, he had three hall of fame offensive talents who ran so much they make today's Mavericks look like they're jogging. Then he came to the Knicks and had a less talented team. He became the half court, grind it out, brutal punishing defensive coach that we know today. JVG too lacked an offensively talented team in NYC and made the most of it, dealing with (and being fiercely loyal to) a declining Ewing, infusing an overrated head case in Sprewell who played out of position against bigger players because the team already had Houston, a guy who has never been able to create his own shot. He had them handed to him on a silver platter in Detroit with Grant Hill running point and yet JVG still got him good looks (enough to get 20 per) from the likes of Charlie Ward. The point is I don't know if JVG is an offensive mastermind on the leval of a Flip Saunders or Nelson, or maybe Adelman. He's coached only one team that lacked anything resembling the offensive talent present in Houston. I know he ran an offense in NYC with a lineup consisting of two shooting guards, a lousy point guard (Ward) and two undersized power fowards (well he rotated about 20 different 6'6" - to 6'7" 250lbs guys). Personally, I'd like to see what he can do with the Rockets' exceptional, but clueless talent. One final note on JVG, regarding comments about him quitting on his team. Like I said before, if this is your concern then Brown should be no consolation, but letting that go for a minute, yeah, he did bail on the Knicks and in the middle of the season. At least Brown waits till the end of EACH season to play coy about his future. However, the one thing I would offer in JVG's defense is that I feel more than his players he quit a failing organization that he just couldn't handle anymore. The Knicks have the worst salary cap situation in the league (90+ million) with less talent than almost any team in the league. JVG had no power over personnel; he just worked with what he was given. Consider the AMPLE evidence that Scott Laden's run with the Knicks makes Bernie Bickerstaff look like a genius. All the NYC media mentioned when Laden came to town was the success of his Jazz teams, but never mentioned that it was Laden's FATHER who drafted Stockton and Malone. Scott took his Ostratag know-how to NYC and drafted Fredrick Veis ahead of Ron Artest, gave Houston $100 million, gave a declining Sprewell what, about $10m per? He signed Clarence Weatherspoon long-term for big bucks, Shandon "Savior" Anderson for long-term big bucks, "The Next Stockton" Eisley to long-term big bucks. The guy is HORRIBLE. I wish JVG would have done the deed in the off-season, to be sure, but all I can say for him is that he left something so ugly that with smart, thoughtful, pragmatic leadership (yet to be seen in NYC), it would (will) still take years and years to emerge from the mire. I don't know what constituted the so-called "bad" interview he had with the Rockets (I wish Doc Rocket would show up and tell us the inside dope), but I pray they give him another one, because considering Riley and Jackson are busy, I think he's the guy to make it happen for Houston. Sorry to go on for so long; don't write often, might as well make the most of it.
Glendelicious- Great post! I agree. I've been hearing about JVG's bad interview. But didn't Clutch post something in the past that stated his sources are saying that its most likely going to be JVG or Brown? I can't remember, but I'm sure that this post was after the JVG interview right? If the interview was so bad, then how come some sources within the organization said that the coach was going to be JVG.
Great post! I agree... But Jeff Van Gundy won't be that much better either. Larry Brown was the best available.
I'm back in the corner with getting a "hot assistant" Cleamons,Jordan or even Carisle would do it for me. Since JVG isn't a upgrade of Rudy T, why not go with potential?
are teams Brown coached in NBA such as Clippers, Nuggets comparable to NY Yankees in MLB? If he coached LAL for 21 years and made the final only once, then I'd agree with you.
Yet, coaches have taken teams other than the Lakers to the finals. So why is that the deciding factor? You seem to imply that not being able to get to the finals in 20 out of 21 coaching seasons is accetable as long as you are not coaching LA those 21 seasons. This again is highly flawed logic as Rudy T, Scott and others (can't think of anyone but will do research) have multiple finals appearances in less seasons than Brown. Yet, no one (including me) is saying that Rudy T and Scott are better than Brown. (I would recommend that you read the thread in its entirety before picking out a very small section of a post and critiquing it; you would realize then that the statement I made was not meant for someone to agree or disagree with, but merely used as an example of flawed logic ).
