As I said, that's the main reason why I am arguing this point. I am building up my line of defense for later .
Originally posted by johnheath I am in no way defending Strom's past, but I wouldn't expect you to comprehend my posts anyway. Sure you are, that's exactly what you're doing. That's why you bring up Malcolm X. We have to get some black people who said bad things in here to make you feel better about defending ole Strom. It speaks to your inability to see the difference between an elected official of a majority race implementing hateful government policy and perpetuating 200 years of racism to maintain the subjugation of minorities and a member of a minority race fighting back with the same vitriol to encourage his people to rise up and take their freedoms. The difference is quite obviously in what they were fighting for. It should be plain to see that Malcolm X isn't honored nor does he have widespread acceptance like MLK because of the manner in which he went about the fight. Again it's a poor yet typical attempt to frame the argument as simply two racists when the most significant aspect of the argument is why the two men were racists. One to gain freedom denied him and the other to prevent it. I think we should look at Strom honestly, that is all. He was a typical white, Southern politician who reflected his environment. He grew personally, to the point where he actually saved the Martin Luther King Jr. Commision. Strom started out as a strict segregationist, but later hired blacks for his staff. I ask again- does that sound like the actions of a "racist scumbag", or the actions of a man who was attempting to change with the times for the better? This logic is akin to I'm not a racist, I know lots of black people. Trent Lott noted on BET how many blacks he's had in his office and we all know he's a swell upstanding concerned member of society now don't we. Once again Timing, people like you, who misrepresent the truth while spitting on the grave of the recently deceased, only make yourselves look petty. Strom left his party because he would not leave behind his racist notions. Strom ran on a segregationist platform. Strom holds the Senate record for the longest filibuster in history. What did he filibuster? The 1957 Civil Rights Act. Obviously he's been horribly misrepresented because he had blacks on his staff 40 years after he tried to have their parents denied their humanity.
Originally posted by giddyup So, <b>timing</b>, <b>pgabriel</b> et al, the world would have been a different place if you had been born 100 years ago into Thurmond's family? Yeah, sure. I'm pretty sure that if a black or latino child would have been born into Thurmond's family 100 years ago that the **** would have hit the fan. It's pathetic to enjoy a sad old man's death. He was not evil; maybe he was dumb or maybe he was just like most people-- a product of his time and circumstance. He was an evil doer. Oh I love Bushisms.
I was really trying to stay out of this thread as some people suddenly seem so sensitive about the death of a man who truly embodied the very bottom of our American history (not by chance but by strong, active behavior) that they are appalled at people celebrating the end of such dark times. Contrary to popular belief, I'm actually not that interested in making enemies so I've tried to stay out. Over the last few nights in various bars, I have heartily participated in joyful toasts to the death of Strom Thurmond. To me, and to many very reasonable people I know, nothing better could have happened than that he'd been kicked hard in the head before he died. He was not like our grandfathers, a product or victim of his time, he was one of the key activists who helped to make our grandfathers such incredibly hateful assholes. (It was not a matter of nature that our ancestors participated in hate towards other races -- it happened because certain people fostered it. No one did it more effectively than Strom.) And now he's dead. GOOD. I'm sorry for his family that someone they loved died but I am FAR sorrier that they felt compelled when he was alive to love such a hateful, evil b*stard. That said, there are more reasons I felt compelled to comment. Manny: Whatever your argument is, with regard to age difference, where you are wrong (and you ARE WRONG) is that you criticize the old man not at all (in fact you prop him up) while you scorn the woman. You may not be a mysoginist, but you're playing one convincingly in this thread. You have no idea what went on between those two people (maybe the woman just had a racist fetish and picked the most evil racist alive to satisfy her jones), but even if you feel compelled to judge people you don't know you do it in an incredibly woman-hating fashion. Strom's the guy who just wants a little action and the woman's a gold digging b****. If what you say is true, Strom's a john and johns are more contemptible than hookers (if you find reason for contempt in that sort of transaction - I don't). Your contempt for the woman coupled with your half admiration of the man exposes you as a woman hater. It's no great wonder you're single. But back to the important stuff. Strom Thurmond was an embarassment to this country and a man who, whether or not he was personally evil, perpetuated evil with great passion. He was the boss of it. He was a hero to racists everywhere, right up to his death. He was representative of this country's blackest moments. He was not an accidental racist due to his time -- he was a driving force. He was an activist in his hateful racism. To characterize him as a product of his time is to be an apologist of the most sickly sweet variety. And if, on the occasion of his death, any of you believe the most appropriate response is to respect him, there is no person (Hitler, Bin Lader, whomever) who should get a different treatment from you. And if they do, if you condemn other evil people (murderers, whatever) on the occasion of their deaths while respecting a king among racists, then you are a racist too. Some of you are Christians. And while Christians are taught not to judge, their God condemns people like Strom Thurmond to eternal pain and suffering. I wish I believed in Hell. It would warm my heart that a man who caused so incredibly much suffering would spend eternity suffering the same. I drank to that tonight and, having posted this just now, I think I'll drink to it again. Ding, dong, the b**** is dead. Best thing that happened this month.
LMAO. You babble about all kinds of things and make a point to single me out because I am this big bad mysoginist (sp?) and I just despise women, yet the venom and hatred you spew in the rest of your post hardly paints you as an angel there, Batman. Just a little ironic that someone this angry is trying to give me advice or whatever on my life. Sorry, but I think I will pass. Also, I am glad to know that you have been able to deduce the reason why I am single. You must have used your Bat computer to get the answer to that one. But it is too bad that your Bat computer failed to notice that (a) I live in a town that has less than 7,500 people and that most people here marry straight out of high school (b) I am a very shy person. Remember when I met you in person, Batman? I didn't say probably more than a couple of words like "Good to meet you." But after reading what had to be one of the worst hatred filled posts ever, I am GLAD that I didn't talk to you more because it would really really REALLY bother me that there is someone I know who has that much hatred inside of them. And for the record, tell me where I have propped Strom Thurmond in this thread? All I have said about the man is that whether you liked him or not, you can't deny his influence on politics in the South. Maybe I didn't say anything else about him because there was nothing nice to say about him. But I felt like the less that was said the better. I didn't see what doing what you did accomplishing anything. But whatever floats your boat, I guess. But you need to do a better job of reading my posts before you make a wild conclusion that I "admired" him. Recognizing his influence hardly makes me think that I admired him. Maybe if you weren't drunk you could have distinguished the difference there. And I pointed out about Nancy because no one was talking about her. Let me ask you a question, caped crusader: do you think someone marrying someone 44 years younger than them is normal? Do you think they are marrying for "love"? As I told Jackie, I can't prove otherwise but he can't prove that it was for love. However, you and him might be the only people out of 100 that would "believe" that it is possible. I truly feel sorry for you, man. To have all that rage inside of you is not a healthy thing. Maybe you really do need to stop posting here if all it is going to do is get you this upset again. Seriously.
I left out the rest of your post because there was not much content in it other than a surprisingly aggressive (for someone who calls himself shy) personal attack against Batman Jones, so I am only addressing this quote... I have not met either of you in person, but I don't think you two would want to talk to each other like that if you were actually face to face, so maybe you might want to reconsider the tone of your post, but of course that is completely between you two guys. Certainly it is not "normal" to marry someone 44 years older/younger if you define "normal" as "it is not the norm, statistically it does not happen much, and there are good reasons that this does not happen much". However, the part I respectfully disagree with is how you judge other people (and yes, you focused on her, not on both) by YOUR standards of "normal" or "not normal" and flat out say that because YOU don't think it is "normal", they, or one of them, HAS TO have ulterior motives. You might be completely right about her and she might be a racist, gold-digging biatch, but as long as I really don't know anything about certain people, I think it's usually better not to judge and condemn them just because they are in a situation which might look very unusual from the outside. Who did they hurt? Should people not be free to decide who they want to be with, and if that someone is many years older or younger, so be it? Whether there is love or not between two people is generally something that these people will have to decide and I would not condemn one of them without knowing a bit more just because according to MY view of the world their relationship is not "normal". Isn't there some similarity to the kind of thinking that condemned interracial or gay relationships because they were not "normal"? Think about it. It's between the two people and not for someone from the outside to condemn them because of it. Since you brought me being a lawyer into play and said that because I can't prove they are in love and you cannot prove they are not, it is even, I have to correct you on this point. Since you are the one publicly condemning someone just for having a relationship, the burden of proof should be on you here, my friend...
Dude called me a mysoginist and then said that I "admired" Strom Thurmond, when in reality all I did was pointed out his influence. So, yeah, Jackie, when people mischaracterize me because they are too lazy or DRUNK to fully read my posts, then I can get aggressive or testy. And for the record, I am the last person to get into it with someone, but I am not going to sit there and see myself get slandered like that. Do you understand what I am saying? Uh, they "separated" in 1991 (don't know for sure if it was really a divorce or not) and that speaks volumes for my "burden of proof". Twelve years is a pretty damn long time for a separation, eh Jackie?? Oh, what happened to love each other til death do us part, Jackie? I guess she got tired of waiting on him to expire.
Well, I have seen you get REALLY angry on this board before and then later apologize for it. I am not one to judge your argument with Batman Jones, I just noticed that your tone was similar to something I have seen before from you...when you feel attacked, you seem to get very aggressive and personal. I have a friend, really nice guy normally, who is just like that. Again, you might have your reasons, I am just observing, not judging. I don't think you will understand my point. Many people separate, for many different reasons. Does that mean they cannot have loved each other when they got married? By the way, they had four children together, so if she was just in it for the money, she did quite a lot of "work" for the money, I guess. I hope posting this picture does not offend anybody. I am not a fan of the guy's politics at all and I don't want to get into that discussion. Just posting it to show Manny the face of the woman he is talking about like he knows her so well.
