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stop trying to force feed yao in the fourth

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by thacabbage, Feb 26, 2009.

  1. redao

    redao Member

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    it is funny.
    A side is saying don't force feeding Yao in 4th.
    B side is saying pass the ball more to Yao in the 4th.

    what's the reason for 4th quarter collapses?

    Yao's shooting percentage or Yao's ineffective presence?
     
  2. swyyyguy

    swyyyguy Member

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    i concur. yao is so unreliable late in the 4th quarter. he either misses shots badly or gets stripped/loses the ball.
     
  3. thacabbage

    thacabbage Contributing Member

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    embarrass me? seriously? you're only embarrassing yourself with your pitiful argument.

    pathetic that you can't offer a logical counter to the points i have raised so your natural response is that i must be wrong because i don't have the knowledge of our "coaching staffs." ummm, ok.

    for future reference, next time you arrogantly resort to ad hominem attacks, make sure your english is atleast up to par. it's embarrassing really, and i don't have the time to get into a pissing match with a two year old.
     
  4. thacabbage

    thacabbage Contributing Member

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    this has been a problem ever since yao entered the league. rick adelman might be the most brilliant offensive mind in the NBA, and if even he can't solve it, i tend to think there's really no solution. yao is just not quick enough to effectively re-post after the ball has been swung back around.
     
  5. thacabbage

    thacabbage Contributing Member

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    this is simply way too idealistic. the elaborate offensive schemes look great through three quarters, but i can't think of a single great team in modern NBA history that didn't heavily depend on the talents of one guy in crunch time. the jazz ran one of the most motion oriented offenses ever and even they relied exclusively on stockton/malone pick and roll in crunch time.

    almost all great teams attack off the dribble at the end of games, for whatever reason.
     
  6. tracymingreedy

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    Leave cabbage alone. he is a Yao Hater
     
  7. kshppatel

    kshppatel Member

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    Instead of Yao creating in the 4th it should be Aaron creating FOR Yao and others. Not give the ball to Yao and go from there.
     
  8. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    Which is why Yao's only averaging five points a game this year.

    If any team fronts Yao the Rockets as a whole can make them pay. That's why it's not used consistently against the Rockets but situationally.

    I noticed Shane cutting to the basket a lot more in the last few game, so maybe Adelman does have a problem with it.

    So move the ball around until you find the guy with the open shot. If the other team is going to collapse into the paint it's pretty trivial to get the ball in to Yao to force the defense to commit and have him kick it back out.

    Duncan's aging and the main guys on the Spurs team have been Parker and Manu for years now. The biggest difference between the two teams of course is that Pop coaches the Spurs and Adelman coaches the Rockets. That means the Rockets follow Adelman's game plan and run his offense.
     
  9. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    Right, have you actually been watching any of the games? Yao's doing a much, much better job of re-posting this year.

    And again, if the fronting defense can neutralize Yao how is that you've figured that out and the guys who do this for a living haven't? How is it that they just don't throw that at him every minute he's out there? Maybe if they did Yao would average around 5 points a game instead of 20?
     
  10. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    So what changes in the fourth quarter? Does the magical basketball fairy come down and decree that "elaborate" offenses don't work for the last 12 minutes?

    The Rockets' offense looks great through three quarters and they they stop running it in crunch time and have problems. Here's an idea: keep running it in the fourth.
     
  11. Herb

    Herb Member

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    I agree with these 2 statements. It doesn't just apply to basketball but to most things. A game is usually won by the side that can counter last. This is where Yao is horrible at IMO. He is too stubborn to change and thinks he can just will his way to victory. Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. Either way, he is just as predictable. There's not much variation in his game. Every time he sets a screen, you know he's going to roll to the basket right away no matter the situation.
     
  12. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    Typically those adjustments I talked about come from the coaches. Yao rolls to the basket after a screen because that's just an excellent play.

    Where he does need to improve is keeping the ball moving in the fourth. The Rockets need to commit to running the offense and that means that if Yao can't make a quick move he needs to pass the ball out to keep it moving.
     
  13. rocket3forlife2

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    I agree with this.
     
  14. Legend Killer

    Legend Killer Member

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    Excellent Thread... I agree 100%
     
  15. mooseatwork

    mooseatwork Member

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    The first option should be getting yao the ball. If he is getting fronted or doubled, Try a very High Pick and roll with AB that would draw Yao and his defender away from the paint and will allow Ab and whoever else cuts to the basket room in the paint for a good oppurtunity with Yao trailing the play for any rebound oppurtunity.

    The key to this play working is one the pick needs to be very high (like 10ft behind the 3 point line) and tell Yao to take his sweet time cutting to the hole allowing time for the offense to create an oppurtunity.
     
  16. thacabbage

    thacabbage Contributing Member

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    I'm talking about after being fronted.

    You don't need to take my word for it. JVG himself during a broadcast wondered himself why teams don't front Yao.

    If we're going to use this merit hierarchy, I think JVG would know a little bit better than anyone else in the league.
     
  17. Herb

    Herb Member

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    Yes, this is a good play, but some variations would be nice IMO.

    I agree.
     
  18. DavidRocket

    DavidRocket Member

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    You've made your point regarding the ineffectiveness of full-game fronting on Yao. However, although teams use the fronting scheme as a situational adjustment, it DOES work to neutralize Yao during the stretch where it matters most (i.e. the latter half of the 4th quarter).

    So my concern is what can Yao do knowing that in all probability, he will face this towards the end of every playoff game? It's easy to say "run your offense in the 4th" but in reality, they need to find a way to get it to Yao late in the game atleast for a few touches to keep the offense running efficiently.

    When a big like Aldridge is just fronting (abeit holding...but who cares..it's not being called) for instance, what can YAO do? I'm wondering if there really is an adjustment that he is capable of making. He is just very slow and seems to get stripped quite easily when they force it to him.

    This is IMO the biggest factor in determining the Rockets success in the postseason.
     
  19. t_mac1

    t_mac1 Member

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    if we want yao to shoot more, yao needs to develop some kind of mid-range game where he can float out sometimes. or the other way is to run the pick and roll with him. other than that, it's going to be tough.

    brooks, artest, scola, and wafer can all take turns.
     
  20. t_mac1

    t_mac1 Member

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    force-feeding yao doesn't mean yao will get the ball. it also means we're trying to look for him despite the fronting and waste time off the shot clock and it really messes up our offense. i think the poster doesn't get that fact. force-feeding yao is not having yao shoot every time.
     

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