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STOP THE TURNOVERS

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by s3ts, Jan 2, 2010.

  1. vpyingyang

    vpyingyang Member

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    Err...what? :confused:
     
  2. lpbman

    lpbman Member

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    I insist they stop missing shots as well.

    OH, and they should get all the rebounds.
     
  3. cjtaylorpt

    cjtaylorpt Member

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    I think that to blame one player (Ariza) for our losses is too simple minded. We can hardly say one player has won us our games, and likewise for our losses. Ariza is not the player everyone on this forum would like for him to be right now. He is no doubt a work in progress. He is a 2-4 year project. Hopefully not the latter. He has about 2-4 areas he really needs to work on, so I gave him a summer and a season each area to dedicate a lot of time on each.

    I think he has things you can not teach (length, passing lane anticipation, desire to win and get better) and plenty of things you can (shooting %, decision making in a flowing offense, ball handling).

    Looking ahead, he is our longest contract. Morey is a smart man and sees potential in young players that not even professions who get paid to scout potential have seen (see Landry, Brooks, Budinger,...). If you look at star players, their contract is almost always above 12 mil. Ariza's never gets above 8. So, Morey's long term plan for Ariza is not to be a go-to guy or leading scorer. Let's say our future 'star' gets injured in a critical game.Ariza, the role-player, will have the ability to step up and score, defend, and so on; but, in order for him to have the confidence to do that he will need to be put in that position. That's just one example of why it's important that he gets a true opportunity to make himself.

    I don't think that knocking on him is going to really help him either. Have some faith in the guy and know that we did not sign him to a 5-year contract so he could become an instant impact player, instant being now. We were/are hopeful; but, not counting on it.
     
  4. JLOBABYDADDY

    JLOBABYDADDY Member

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    Then he has about 5 more per game when he tries to drive, flails at the rim, and gives up the rebound as he falls to the ground. even happens on NBA Live!
     
  5. desi tmac91

    desi tmac91 Member

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    Did this in spite of the Ariza hate.

    Trevor Ariza

    Vs Thunder - 6 assists / 1 turnover
    Vs Clippers - 6 assists / 1 turnover
    @ Magic - 1 assist / 1 turnover
    @ Mets - 8 assists / 1 turnover
    @ Cavaliers - 3 assists / 2 turnovers
    Vs Hornets - 5 assists / 3 turnovers
    Vs Mavericks - 7 assists / 5 turnovers
    @ Hornets - 3 assists / 7 turnovers (yikes!)
    @ Lakers - 8 assists / 2 turnovers
    @ Suns - 1 assist / 0 turnovers

    Totals: 48 assists / 23 turnovers
    Assist to turnover ratio: 2.09

    Totals minus Hornets game: 45 assists / 16 turnovers
    Assist to turnover ratio: 2.81

    Season

    Aaron Brooks assist to turnover ratio: 1.66
    Kyle Lowry assist to turnover ratio: 2.70
    Shane Battier assist to turnover ratio: 2.36
    Chase Budinger assist to turnover ratio: 1.68
    Andre Iguodala assist to turnover ratio: 2.00
    Steve Nash assist to turnover ratio (for fun): 2.89

    Rocket statistics during same stretch as Trevor Ariza

    Aaron Brooks: 33 assists / 24 turnovers (1.37 ratio)
    Kyle Lowry: 51 assists / 16 turnovers (3.19 ratio)
    Shane Battier: 30 assists / 16 turnovers (1.87 ratio)
    Chase Budinger was injured during most of the stretch.

    I know there are more factors at play here...Brooks/Lowry are primary ball handler, Chase is a catch and shoot guy, etc. Still its not fair to blame all the Rockets turnover woes on Ariza, and I'm not trying to pick on Aaron here.
     
  6. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!
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    Ariza looks like a low BBall IQ player to me.

    Can we get a STOP THE BAD SHOTS thread?

    or a STOP THE MISSING thread?

    I mean when Ariza shoots it is about a 65% chance that it is also a turnover.

    DD
     
  7. REEKO_HTOWN

    REEKO_HTOWN I'm Rich Biiiiaaatch!

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    NBA Live? you lose all credibility now buddy.
     
  8. desi tmac91

    desi tmac91 Member

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    I'm not happy with his quick trigger either but he's not a bad player.
     
  9. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!
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    He is this year.

    DD
     
  10. mattrbowers

    mattrbowers Member

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    He lacks vision. I like that he is long and fast (did I just say "long and fast"?) because it helps him drive to the bucket. But, just like AB sometimes, he's never prepared for what to do when he gets there. To me that's the big thing here because as we would all agree, Ariza lacks the crucial quality of confidence - all other rockets have that. I think his lack of confidence has brought down his shooting percentage by at least 15%.

    If he can begin to understand the importance of having a plan BEFORE he gets to the rim, he can most likely begin to get higher percentage shots rather than 'flailing at the rim' as a turnover occurs. That would in turn boost his confidence, which would raise his shooting average substantially.

    Just like Clyde would say, "When you are in a shooting slump, drive to the basket." If Ariza can somehow gain the vision to make his drives worthwhile, well then we'd have a weapon on our hands. But right now, we have a mistake. It might do some good to him out of the starting 5 (like so many of you want). Some players just need to watch for a while ...
     
  11. s3ts

    s3ts Member

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    Ariza is a high-IQ player.

    Look at the plays that are run on the offensive end. Ariza gets at least one steal a game (from all the games that I've watched), showing his ability to read the offense. Ariza can swing the ball around the court to balance the offense. As a matter of fact, look back into the LA-HOU WC semi series and look at the plays that Ariza have made AGAINST Houston. You can tell why we'd love to have Ariza over Artest.

    If you actually WATCH the game, you can tell Ariza has high basketball IQ.
     
  12. Big MAK

    Big MAK Member

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    hint hint, that's a video game.

    Sometimes I die multiple times in an afternoon, but manage to come back to life. Weird. Oh, wait, that is COD, not real life.
     
  13. s3ts

    s3ts Member

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    Sorry, should've added this to my last post.

    It's clearly not Ariza doing all the Turnovers. Admittedly, Ariza is missing alot of shots in many games, but there's nothing that can be done about that except for him to get loose on the court and to practice shooting a whole frigg'n lot, which is all on him.

    Turnovers? Those are *stupid* mistakes. Mistakes that should not have been made. Watch the games again and tell me you don't have those "OMG, another turnover?" moments.

    Rebounds? Shot selection? We lack size to get all those rebounds (and even still, we're doing pretty well with them). We lack so much knowledge to get a hold of what a bad shot selection is. Some players shoot better when the shots are contested. When our player takes a shot, most of the time, I'm pretty confident that it was the best shot we could have made at that time.

    But comparatively, turnovers are a very simple concept to grasp. If I was a coach and I saw my players making those turnovers, I'd flip. 15+ turnovers in one game is RIDICULOUS. I'd make them do basic drills again, the kind you did in Middle School.
     
  14. PeppermintCandy

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    Good post. Despite his poor shooting and shot selection, Ariza has been putting up good assist numbers and has kept his turnovers down for the most part.

    I thought yesterday's game vs. Phoenix was a real anomaly. He camped out at the three-point line and didn't seem really that involved, which is reflected in his low assist and turnover numbers. Eleven of his 14 shots were from the 3-point line.
     
  15. Chinahype

    Chinahype Member

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    Stopping turnovers is not easy...it's all about team chemistry and a single player can ruin a whole team's chemistry. Seems like everyone is blaming it on Ariza, but if every player on the rockets blame Ariza, nothing would be solved.
     
  16. LosPollosHermanos

    LosPollosHermanos Houston only fan
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    What? Are you kidding me? I would have said he was decent but camping around the 3 pt line, yelling at his teammates for not passing it to him, shooting 8-12 threes a game, and trying to be the hero....really?

    Not to mention everytime he drives in and tries to pivot he falls down or travels.I'm glad the reffs don't call it nearly as much as they should. I liked him at the beginning but his attitude it turning me towards the hate.

    He is VERY LOW IQ player, bringing up what he did in LA provides no groudns to your argument, he also shot at a high % over there too...not quite so the case here right? He was playing in a star cluttered system where nobody would defend him and he would benefit off of kobe/gasol. That, and him getting steals doesn't benefit you either, Ron Artest gets a lot of steals too, is he a high IQ player?

    Please, give me hard evidence to why he is a high IQ player, in houston.
     

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