Guys, I don't know if this has been posted anywhere, but I guess it's been alluded to on 610, but JVG's on the cover on the sports page on USA Today with the NBA Referee's Association spokesman Lamell McMorris said "the matter will truly be closed only when Van Gundy is fired." The implications of that are far more serious to me than any of Stern's comments or if JVG flipped or flopped when he supposedly stuck by his comments. The way Yao has been officiated the last three years has been horrendous, and now we have a coach the the referee's want gone? JVG's done a great job, but this whole thing has backfired badly on the team. There are a lot of sports writers in Texas that backed him up and promised to demand he be fired if his story was bs. I think most of us are pretty sure JVG originally told the truth, and think now he's lying, or at least whitewashing everyone into a state of confusion. Over the years we've had more than our share of run-ins with referees that have been bizarre going back forever. Moses and Dream, with their tempers created a lot of guff with their tempers and their aggression in their early years and ref's did fight back. That's what make's this situation so frustrating: Yao's a frikkin' choir boy and JVG is not a whiny sideline coach. And we're going to pay for this fiasco bigtime on the court. I know everyone loves to say the refs suck, but most of the time they just don't clearly see what happened - that is until the league sends them the tapes. But they do retaliate and some of them are vindictive period. I don't know why all of this isn't a big deal here. JVG's a great coach, and I loved the support Houston gave him after his comments, but regardless of the CYA BS, a lot of people feel betrayed and we now have new enemies.
From Sportscenter--Marc Stein-- "You can interpret some of the statements from the Referee Union Leader as Van Gundy is going to have to pay for this somewhere down the road and that's the kind of inferences David Stern is trying to avoid." That " paying for this down the road" really scares me especially playoff time.
Charley Rosen really hates JVG with a passion: http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/3605230 Blame Van Gundy for 'Deep Whistle' hoax What to make of Jeff Van Gundy's pitiful and unconvincing retraction? It sounds to me like the testimony of so many of those who were accused in the infamous Moscow Show Trials of the late 1930s — dutiful, and absurd confessions made in hopes of saving their skins. I mean, was "Deep Whistle" a game official or a paper pusher? The only reason why Van Gundy would obfuscate the issue was to make his tale of martyrdom more convincing. OK, coaches have been publicly airing their gripes about referees for some time. And, to some degree, these complaints have been successful in turning a few marginal calls the complainant's way. (As far as I could tell, Van Gundy's $100K only bought him one call — in Game 6 a foul called on Mike James should have been called on Yao.) Contrary to accepted wisdom, however, it was Pat Riley who initially institutionalized this unofficial grievance process, not Phil Jackson. But Van Gundy had another motive in mind — blaming someone else for his own inadequacies. I wonder what excuse he'd manufacture for his season-long game plan that required the slow-footed Yao Ming to be setting perpetual high screens and then rolling all the way to the hoop? Sure, the strategy worked well enough for the Rockets to win 51 games during the regular season, but what was the cost? A leg-weary, super-passive Yao come the playoffs. The high screens should have been a sometimes thing, and the 7-5, 330-pound Yao should have been stationed in the low post where he could have done maximum damage a la Shaquille O'Neal. (How many high screens is the Big Pivot Maven asked to set?) Perhaps Van Gundy could claim that his dog ate his playbook. Hey, it's not like this guy is a genius. Remember the first round playoff matchup between Miami and New York in the short season of 1998-99? What would have happened had Allan Houston missed that rim-bouncing, buzzer-beating shot in the fifth (and deciding) game? Van Gundy would have been canned, Phil Jackson might be coaching the Knicks, and the little fellow would probably be working his Xs and Os at Podunk U. Also, the Francis-Mobley-McGrady trade was strictly a desperation move for Houston. A move that was necessary to save Van Gundy's job. The fact is that Van Gundy gets much more respect from the media than he deserves. In truth, he's obnoxious in private, obsequious in public, and his reputation as a coach is very much overblown. Did I mention that he's always been a truth-bending conniver? I can't believe that David Stern let Van Gundy get away with insinuating that NBA games are rigged. For someone getting paid in the millions, a $100K fine is pocket change. How many times does the 2-for-1 strategy produce two bad shots? Kirk Hinrich reminds me of an economy-sized John Havlicek. Let's hear no more nonsense about Pete Carril's inventing the pass, cut, pick and move Princeton offense. The true originator was Bill van Breda Kolff, who was coaching at Lafayette College back in 1952 when Carril was a senior. VBK further refined the offense during his stint at Princeton (1962-1967). Carril was (and is) an excellent coach, but VBK is the guru's guru. I knew that Nazr Mohammad and Ervin Johnson have the worst hands of any big men in the league. But I was surprised by how thumby Yao's hands are. Who has the best hands? Shaq. I can understand the argument for continuing the current procedure of letting high schoolers be drafted into the NBA. Why deprive basketball lovers of the pleasure of seeing the likes of LeBron James and Carmelo Anthony? To say nothing of giving these young men the opportunity to rescue themselves and their families from dismal financial circumstances. However, NBA action would be much more sophisticated, precise, and even more enjoyable to watch if the 20-year-old limit was put into practice. A possible solution? Draft the kids, pay them significant bucks, and have them play in the NBDL until they come of age. Interesting watching Tyson Chandler shouting gutter epithets at large after a dramatic dunk in Game 6 of the series against Washington. Why was he moved to do this? To psych up himself and/or his teammates? If this was the case, why would any of them need this extra motivation with the Bulls down 3 games to 2? To intimidate the Wizards? To show his disdain for them? Chandler's outburst is another argument for the 20-year-old age limit. No-look passes. These happen when players make a pass and then make believe they haven't even been looking at the player to whom they've just passed the ball. Even Tim Duncan is occasionally guilty of this. What are the passers trying to accomplish? To fool the judges into thinking the pass had a higher degree of difficulty than it deserved? What nonsense. Which NBA big man has the worst touch on his jump shot? Jerome James. How about Paul Pierce appearing for his postgame interview after Game 6 of the Pacers series with a bandage around his jaw? As if his gratuitous elbow to Jamaal Tinsley's chops wasn't bad enough! PP's stunted emotional development indicates further that the NBA's superstar culture is blighted with terminal narcissism. And jeers to Pierce, Kendrick Perkins and Delonte West for instituting a band new Celtic mystique — faux macho buffoonery. Here are my postseason awards: The Roy Rubin Trophy for Worst Coach goes to ... Rudy Tomjanovich. The Elgin Baylor Trophy for Worst Executive goes to ... John Weisbrod. The Jack Haley Trophy for Worst 12th Man goes to ... Jared Reiner. The Sidney Wicks Trophy for Least Improved Player goes to ... fat Zach Randolph, who took the money and ran — to the nearest Burger King. The Bob McAdoo Trophy for Least Valuable Player goes to ... Stephon Marbury, because he's improved every team he's ever played for, by leaving it. Charley Rosen, former CBA coach, author of 12 books about hoops, the current one being A pivotal season — How the 1971-72 L.A. Lakers changed the NBA, is a frequent contributor to FOXSports.com.
Jeez, how the hell could he include that in a rant about JVG? I mean were Les and CD thinking "getting T-Mac is a steal, but it also may make that JVG guy more effective"? But the rest of it has a certain merit that makes me ill.
Sportscenter really had a comprehensive breakdown on this whole story. Stein said that Stern is trying to quiet this all down, and that the last thing he wants is the refs association calling for his head. Bucher said that the refs he talked to did not want JVG fired, and that he had been punished enough. The refs also said that whoever made that statement did not poll the refs. SAS said that he believes JVG's original story, but he thinks it really was a ref that he talked to. Kind of surprising to hear him say this after he blasted JVG after the story initially broke. He said that JVG was squeezed into changing his story. The refs association is using the story change, or clarification, to say that JVG lied and that he should be fired. Justice made the point that JVG has admitted that he made a mistake, and has apologized profusely, which helped to quiet the matter. Overall, I was surprised by how good the coverage was. I guess the blowouts have made this story the one with the highest drama. I'm still confused why people think this is such an attack on the league's credibility. Is it because JVG revealed that he received 'insider' info, or is just the accusation that the refs change the way they make calls based on certain things being brought to their attention? Was it the fact that he said that Yao was targeted? I still don't believe that either of these things is a huge attack on the league. I find it totally believable that the refs are told what changes to make in how they ref the game, and that incessant complaining and tapes can influence what the directives are. Maybe I have been watching basketball for too long, but I still believe that what JVG said has taken place. I just don't think it is that much of a big deal. Everyone is saying JVG attacked the credibility of the league, but when you look back at what he said, I'm just not seeing how.
Somewhat off topic, but this guy really comes off as a jackass with this article. Not just for his opinion about this topic, but for his opinions on just about everything else... Did he happen to notice how ineffective Yao was when we tried to force him to operate in the low post "a la Shaq"? At lease Van Gundy tried to find new ways to get him involved. That creativity is exactly what got me to think better of Jeff after the ugly start. This is just too stupid to comment on. Why do all his players and ex-players love him so much then, especially given his reputation as a sour taskmaster? Didn't he also take an 8th seeded team to the Finals? Yeah, any coach could have done that. Huh? Ever try to throw a no-look pass yourself? What nonsense indeed! Based on what, exactly? Jeez dude, did you just find out your wife is leaving you for a woman and you want to take it out on the world at large? Is this guy always so hateful?
Au contraire KeepKenny.Man,I'm just speculating here,but it would appear that this is the tip of the iceberg.Do you believe games are manipulated by the referees in accordance with the league office's directives? This goes to the heart of the NBA's credibility.
That fokker Rosen sounds incredibly bias about JVG, reading this article gives the reader the impression that Rosen has a personal vendetta against JVG. BTW, the refs, if ANYTHING, will treat JVG even better than before. I am sure they, along with everyone else, probably think that JVG definitely meant an NBA "ref" when he made his comments about an insider source. I think if anything they will be very appreciative of the fact that JVG won't throw his source under the bus by giving up his name. I don't see why/how this whole thing would backfire against the Rockets with bias refs, I think that is an overblown concern and won't ever materialize. Ric Bucher himself said that he talked to multiple sources from the ref union and they all told him that they don't want JVG fired, and that this guy who went on Mike & Mike who wanted JVG fired was not speaking for their sentiment. Again, you guys are really overblowing this issue, and I guarantee you the Rockets won't suffer from the refs because of it.
Not just not funny or wrong, it is classless and immaturish to say the least. The guy got sick and wanted to take care of his health. Besides, the Lakers were ACTUALLY in the playoff run when Rudy T left the team. So this is a cheap shot to say the least. This alone tells you about the character of this guy. No argument here, although Isiah Thomas and the Hornets' GM are strong candidates You gotta admit, those are funny
Yah, it sort of reminds me of Paul Vetti (Robert DeNiro) in Analyze That, where everyone seems to be going after him to nail him, yet he ends up being the one who wins out at the end
I don't know about league office. But someone is in charge of the refs, and someone tells them what to focus on. I'm guessing it's Ronnie Nunn. Too many times I've seen a guy like Phil Jackson, or even Ray Allen tonight, complain and then blatantly get more calls the next night. Bruce Bowen got called for some downright phantom fouls tonight, one day after Allen complained. Someone (supposedly) put the video of Yao's moving screens on the ref's website. Someone fields the complaints, and makes 'recommendations' of how certain officiating problems can be fixed. It might not be Stern telling the ref's what to focus on, but someone definately has that job, and they sure seemed to respond to Cuban's complaints. That is what JVG was complaining about.
First off,I missed SC ,so I appreciate the update.Your absolutely right,in that individual players have been officiated differently,as long as I can remember.Night to night,game to game.There has to be a mechanism in place to field the complaints and implement what the League thinks is best for the game.It's the "what's best for the game part" that I find vague,and easy to manipulate to satisfy many different agendas,even tilting the court in a team's favor.I do think the combination of JVG"having the goods",some anonymous league official leaking the program,and JVG'aggressive stance has put Stern back on his heels in full damage control/spin mode.For the NBA,the status quo must be kept at all costs.But is there more here?The STRONG reaction by Stern,followed by the about face,along with JVG's comments lead me to wonder about the millions upon millions of dollars spent on advertising.Also,how about all that money bet every night on these same games?I apologize if this sounds as if it's out of the twilight zone,but JVG might have gotten a little too close to the Wizard behind the curtain. I love watching the best athletes in the world lace em up and go at it.May the best team win.But I worry for our great game.
