[Stein] Carmelo Anthony set to sign with Rockets

I think the more accurate question would be the opposite. How would one argue Melo was better than Ariza last year?

But to answer your question:
- Eye test
- Stats
- Impact to team

Eye test: I mean, this one isn't that complicate. If you just watched the two play. Ariza was a guy who played his role to a "t", even if not always exceptionally well, whereas from the near start Melo looked like he was struggling to fit, and as such his game just looked "off" a bit. This is the hope of Rockets fans and potential good news... as it means its possible it can change.

Stats: Basically, normalized for pace, Melo was a better scorer and rebounder than Ariza, but otherwise worse across the board. He (Melo) had like a 40% higher usage, and was worse or neutral on most advanced stats. Similar PER, worse TS%, required like 40% more usage, was a negative OBPM player, a negative DBPM (so of course negative overall), negative VORP, had a 104 Ortg vs a 109 Drgt (Ariza was 114 offensive, 107 defense). Ariza was an is the better defender.

They were both bad to horrible in the playoffs... but even then, Melo was unquestionably worse.

Impact to team: Another year of high expectations for the Thunder that they underperformed, though last year surely the most underperforming year in their city/team history, relative to preseason expectations. Resulting in Melo getting shipped off principally for payroll savings purposes, only to then get waived by his new team. Ariza also left, but for a "HUGE" payday relative to what anyone expected, and his team had their best season in 20 years.

What am I missing?

 

Most of that is to get away from the team.

 

He could have got his 28 mil and stayed on the Hawks a loser lottery team and got paid just like Ariza did by taking the money and going to the Suns. Make no mistake no contender or even playoff team is playing 15 mil per for Ariza hence why he is on the Suns.

 

Never dared to put Melo in my user name.

 

From the Rockets perspective they believe Melo and Ennis are 2 rotation players. Ennis is rotation worthy. He is younger but clearly doesn't have the "vet savvy" that Ariza or Luc had.

And then they are hoping one of MCW or Melton can sneak in there as well.

I do agree that adding one more rotation worthy swingman that is a plus defender is important. That might not happen right away though, even though we are all impatient for completing the roster.

 

God no. Batum is trash with an even worse contract. Batum is offensively inefficient. The only thing good on the offensive side ball that he does is pass which really isn't something we expect from a wing standing at the corner.

 

Then Ariza should be in the hall of fame, but he won't be. I'm not going to base my every opinion on Melo by number crunching analytics on NBA.com. My eyes tell me otherwise, as do his long list of career accolades including a scoring title and multiple NBA first teams. I'm also forecasting a huge uptick from last year now playing with 2 future HOFers in Harden and Paul setting him up for success.

 

Pretty much.

 

Anybody read tge Jamaal hill article on on melo. I like what i read. He was humble by tge suggestion of being bought out. I like that. So he gonna be hungry to win now. Im pleased. He gonna be locked in this year with a chip. Win at all cost mentality. Thats what im feeling man. I love we have so mantly guys that need a ring to cement thier legacies

 

From the Rockets? No. There might be some team out there that would take a chance.

 

We went 16-9 without Chris Paul.
We went 13-8 without Luc Mbah a Moute.

By this logic, Luc was slightly more important than Chris Paul and much more important than Ariza for us.

 

Why do you keep saying this? Totally irrelevant to what we are discussing.

Melo will be in the hall of fame because of his whole career. If his whole career played like last season, you think he would be in the HOF?

The discussion is about whether last season was ONLY due to misfit or was it mainly due to a sharp decline, or did it also have something to do with Melo's attitude. Whether Ariza was a more valuable player than Melo last season is debatable. No matter what one believes, it has nothing to do with Melo's HOF career.

Dwight Howard will be a HOFer. Would you want him over Ariza last season.

 

I took it the opposite seems like he was humbled by being bought out.

 

I mean surely people on this board, especially long-timers, understand how to read with context and analyze players with context?

There's plenty of players that have been more efficient but lower volume scorers than Melo over their careers. There's plenty more players that have been better defenders than Melo in their careers.

Doesn't mean those players are better overall career players than Melo. It's truly not a complicated concept. At one point you could at least throw the ball to Melo as a #1 option and have him create his own shot, and put up points at volume, even if not at today's standards of efficiency. He's always rebounded very well for his position. Never a "great' assist man but at points wasn't a black hole (is that a compliment or a dis, lol?).

But on the whole, I'd certainly be part of whatever group there is that rates Melo further down the list of all-time greats than probably other folks would. He is not well liked by advanced stats, and you can poo poo those if you want, but the fact is the EYE TEST confirms 100% what those advanced stats say (or vice versa). He's never been a superb defender by the eye test. He's never been an efficient scorer by the eye test even though he has been a volume, go to #1 guy. He's never been the most willing passer or creator by the eye test. He's never taken the most obviously best mix of shot selection by the eye test. It's barely even an opinion... just is what it is.

Melo has played with Chauncey Billups, Jason Kidd, AI, Amare, Porzingis, Westbrook, Paul George. He's not had clearly dominant teams, but he's also not been devoid of talent.

 

Your thinking is very binary. Unwanted? Or is he unwanted at 27 million?

Could Trevor Ariza ever sniff a max contract? Ever?

BTW, nobody but the Suns would have paid Ariza that much.

 

Fair enough, however Melo has been honest and candid about not wanting to come off the bench, not giving up touches etc. When will he finally start to come out and say: I need to adapt, I'll do whatever it takes to win. He won't because his ego is too big and he's just not a winner.

 

The point of 14-1 without Ariza is to show we will be OK if he goes. He is more or less another cog. Maybe a slightly bigger cog.

You kinda proved my point though.
Not have Paul had a bigger impact.
Not having Luc had a bigger impact (could have sworn Luc missed more games then that though).
I think Luc and Ariza are close to the same level defensively.

 

i laughed

 

A lot of that 13-8 stretch without Luc is when we were ALSO missing Capela or Harden.

And to be fair the Rockets 14-1 record without Ariza....we had Luc to lean on.

Rockets were 42-3 with CP/Harden/Capela in the lineup. That is most important. And PJ Tucker seems to get really underrated by many on what he does as the middle linebacker of the defense.

 

Trevor besides his poor shooting was hardly bad. His defense on Jimmy Butler and Wiggins followed by his super defensive effort on Durant were impressive.