1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

States should not be allowed to vote on gay marriage

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by FranchiseBlade, Feb 17, 2012.

  1. juicystream

    juicystream Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2001
    Messages:
    29,880
    Likes Received:
    6,159
    And it won't. In 20 years, gay marriage will be common in the country. In 50 years every state will have gay marriage.

    Out of curiosity, does anybody know the international stance on gay marriage? I don't know if we are the norm or lagging behind.
     
  2. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2002
    Messages:
    36,073
    Likes Received:
    8,543
    I've never understood why people are against it, frankly. To protect the "sanctity of marriage?" I've always said that straight people getting divorced does more to harm the sanctity of marriage than gays getting married.
     
  3. CCorn

    CCorn Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2010
    Messages:
    22,044
    Likes Received:
    22,615
    Legal recognition

    Same-sex marriage is legally recognized nationwide in Argentina, Belgium, Canada, Iceland, the Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, South Africa, Spain, and Sweden

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same-sex_marriage#Legal_recognition
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 1999
    Messages:
    15,937
    Likes Received:
    5,488
    LOL. Repped.
     
  5. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 1999
    Messages:
    15,937
    Likes Received:
    5,488
    This is what we call "separate but equal." That's not a compliment.
     
  6. Hightop

    Hightop Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2011
    Messages:
    1,257
    Likes Received:
    69
    Marriage licensing began with Jim Crow Laws and a means to use the state to enforce their idea morality and prohibit interracial marriage. Now liberals want to use the the state to enforce their idea of morality. The third option would be to get the government out of marriage to allow freedom and liberty for all but not too many people really want that.
     
  7. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2006
    Messages:
    27,039
    Likes Received:
    3,706
    Get the government out of the marriage business. If people want to get married, they can go to a church. Civil unions for everyone.

    It will be interesting to see in the future how to recognize common law marriages if same sex is allowed.
     
  8. Northside Storm

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    11,262
    Likes Received:
    450
    Yeah, because freedom and liberty for all in most places would be "let's not let gays marry because, well, we have the freedom and liberty to do so."
     
  9. Northside Storm

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    11,262
    Likes Received:
    450
    FIFY.
     
  10. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 1999
    Messages:
    15,937
    Likes Received:
    5,488
    I'd say 5 years for it to be common, but we're both just guessing. We agree however that it will happen. And when it is commonly accepted, which it will be very soon according to polling, I've no doubt that federal protections will be put in place. BTW, I'm not sure if it's been mentioned here but Dick Cheney, whose daughter is gay, has recently begun actively lobbying for marriage equality in Maryland.

    As has been said above, when the time comes that Americans recognize past bad or discriminatory behavior, it can't be left to states. Civil rights are a federal issue. Ron Paul disagrees and opposes the Civil Rights Act in principle as a violation of the liberty to be a racist and reflect that in hiring practices, but I digress.

    There are two things in the polling that demonstrate kind of shockingly rapid conversion on this issue as a nation. First, the nation is about evenly divided on this for the first time this year. And for the first time this year at least one reputable national poll showed a majority in favor. Second, and far more importantly, is the age differential. Old people are opposed; young people are overwhelmingly in favor. In five years, enough of the old will be dead (sorry to be morbid) and enough of the young will have reached voting age that this won't even be a question anymore.

    When progress sets in on an issue like this, an issue of equality, things always move forward and they never move back. This is one of the most encouraging characteristics of the human race.
     
  11. Hightop

    Hightop Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2011
    Messages:
    1,257
    Likes Received:
    69
    The state shouldn't have to power to approve or prohibit marriages.
     
  12. bnb

    bnb Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2002
    Messages:
    6,992
    Likes Received:
    316
    when you leave it to the individual states, it means you can't readily extend the same federal benefits: option to file joint fed tax returns, social security spousal benefits -- those sorts of things.

    And if they did extend those benefits -- it would be odd for them to be forfeited if the couple moves to a non gay marriage state. It's just bizarre.

    I suppose there might be some theoretical country where marriage is not intermingled with laws. But the US isn't that country, and not about to go that route. So that's why it absolutely should be a federal issue -- with possibly details left up to the States....
     
  13. Northside Storm

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    11,262
    Likes Received:
    450
    Religion shouldn't have the power to make people deny other people what for some will be the happiest moment of their lives, but it does. So, in between, we're stuck with state intervention if you want fairness, for now, until the inevitable day most people's attitude about this will change (which is probably as soon as the next generation.)

    [​IMG]
     
  14. juicystream

    juicystream Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2001
    Messages:
    29,880
    Likes Received:
    6,159
    I was being very conservative with my estimation (I'd bet the farm it happens by the time frames I listed, but wouldn't be shocked at all to see it happen in half that time). The fact that California has struggled with the issue, is what worries me about more conservative states making the change sooner rather than later.
     
  15. bnb

    bnb Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2002
    Messages:
    6,992
    Likes Received:
    316
    Holy crap! Good for him. That makes once I've been impressed by him!

    I'd heard him defend the right of a State to allow gay marriage -- but had never heard him actually advocate (or campaign) on its behalf.
     
  16. CCorn

    CCorn Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2010
    Messages:
    22,044
    Likes Received:
    22,615
    If more republicans could do what Dick is doing, I'd be willing to call myself a republican again.
     
  17. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 1999
    Messages:
    15,937
    Likes Received:
    5,488
    I admire that this issue is important enough to you to determine your party affiliation. The problem is you'd be joining a losing party. The Republican party can't right now win without its sizable bloc of anti-gay voters.
     
  18. CCorn

    CCorn Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2010
    Messages:
    22,044
    Likes Received:
    22,615
    Well I can't consider myself a Republican because I'm a social liberal, and I cannot consider myself a Democrat because I'm a fiscal conservative. It's a balancing act on how I determine my vote.
     
  19. Joe Joe

    Joe Joe Go Stros!
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 1999
    Messages:
    24,752
    Likes Received:
    14,908
    Definitely agree. Government has no place in marriage. I don't see any reason for married people to get any benefits that two single people can't get. I believe marriage is between man and a woman, but really don't care what other people do.

    I don't agree with liberals. They don't agree with me. That's fine. You do your thing. I do my thing. The government should not decide a purely morality decision. The government being involved in marriages just allows for single people to be discriminated against.
     
  20. Hightop

    Hightop Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2011
    Messages:
    1,257
    Likes Received:
    69
    We are stuck with it only because people won't find to end it - they would rather use the state to validate their idea of marriage. Stop feeding the monster now.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now