Starting point guards for other Western Conf contenders

how about shaq and kobe? even td is more like a c than a pf, and manu is just as important as parker for their title runs.

 

A point guard that puts offensive pressure on the other teams point guard is the best defender for any team in the west today. None of the elite point guards of the west are defensive stoppers of each other, they all are just threats on the other end of the court. None of them are as good as the Glove(Gary Payton) was in his prime.

That being said, Steve Francis is CLEARLY the best defender at point guard for our team because of his threat of penetration/dishing/scoring.

 

Comparing Tracy and Yao to Shaq and Kobe is r****ded. Tracy might be able to emulate Kobe, but Yao simply can't match the dominance Shaq brought in his prime. Regardless they had an extremely clutch pg who was also very efficient at 3 point shooting. Not to mention they had the clutchest player ever in Horry. Battier and Alston are not Horry and Fisher.

 

Devin Harris and Derek Fisher are better than Rafer, but they're closer to him than they are to the other five. They're certainly not "near all-star" talent.

 

Devin Harris can get to the rim pretty much at will, and Fisher is a much better shooter. But you're right, they're not "all-star" talent. They are servicable and most of all; they can be depended on in tight situations.

Like I said earlier, I don't think we need an "all-star" pg, but we do need someone servicable. That will be Francis.

 

for the last time:
nobody compared Tracy and Yao to Shaq and Kobe. The point is C and SF are just as important as PF and PG.

 

Battier, Head, and Rafer for Hinrich and Sefolosha

Hinrich is having an off year and has a good chance to bounce back, and he is one of the best defensive PGs in the league. Sefolosha gives us some insurance at the other positions.

Any chance Chicago does this deal? Battier has a mini-post game, which could help out their offense. They can platoon Rafer with Duhon. Head is a throw-in.

I think Hinrich could defend most of the western conference PGs, if not outscore them.

 

we need to seriously look into trading for one of Toronto's point guards, either Calderon or Ford would be great.

 

If the Mavs and Spurs can get to the Finals with the likes of Diop, Dampier, Oberto and Elson at Center, the Rockets can succeed with Rafer Alston starting at the 1.

It does mean, however, that the rest of the team, particularly the bench and more particularly the backup PGs need to step up and fill the efficient shooting/scoring role that Alston struggles with. Spurs have Manu Ginobili... Rockets have guys who may be able to fill that role, but has only done so only occassionally at best (Bonzi, James, Francis).

 

I think he meant to say that even Hakkeem won't be able to carry Rafer

 

As much as I hate Stockton,I feel Hakeem would have had a much easier time getting baskets with him, and that would have prolonged his career.
Karla and he didn't win for the exact reasons mentioned above.

 

Wait...who said anything about comparing? Statement was made that a PG and PF will take you places where a SG and C won't. I just said Kobe and Shaq would beg to differ. Nothing to read into there.

 

Chris Jackson - Denver
Gary Payton - Seattle
Kevin Johnson - Phoenix
Avery Johnson - San Antonio
Nick Van Exel - Los Angeles
Rod Strickland - Portland
Jason Kidd - Dallas
Tim Hardaway - Golden State

Cassell/Kenny Smith - Houston

Not much has changed since we were winning back to back chips, y'all need to calm down.

We haven't had an all star pg since Murph, and he lost in the finals to the Celtics

 

You put Steve Francis in place of Rafer Alston and suddenly it is a lot more even.

DD

 

i think his logic is fine. it's true yao doesn't need to become hakeem because his competition is weaker nowadays. but the point is yao still needs to match hakeem's production for this logic to fail, weaker opposition or not. so far yao hasn't managed to do that. if he did, he would've taken the rafers of the world to the championship. since he couldn't give us what hakeem did, therefore we need to get more out of our starting pg. therefore this thread.

 

Well Hakeem also didn't win a title til his 10th year. On the flip side he did get past the first round multiple times before then. Defensive rules have changed significantly since Dream was dominating for us. The mostly illegal zone defense that the Sonics used against us back then that gave us so much trouble would be legal now. Back then you couldn't double someone until they had the ball. Now teams can double at any time as long as they don't stay in the paint for more than 3 seconds. Also back then hand checking on the perimeter was legal.

 

derek fisher does not belong on the same list as the others

 

The truth

 

The point is O-fer is much worse than Fisher.

Anyway, O-fer is a well qualified ten minutes bench player.

 

IMO, the problem isnt that we have rafer starting, but rafer AND chuck hayes starting. that is two guys who are just not good enough to be starters in the NBA.

what i mean is, if we had a better PF, then it might not be so bad that rafer starts, and vice versa if we had a better PG, then chuck hayes starting would not be such a bad thing. but with the two of them i just dont see us getting out of the first round this year. who are we going to beat out of the top 4 ? because we certainly wont be getting a top 4 seed this year. i do not think we can beat any of them with this current lineup. yea we were a couple possessions away from beating utah, but yao is so ineffective on both ends against them i can't see us beating them 4 out of 7 when we wont even have home court. we NEED francis to take that starting job IMO. hes intense, athletic, clutch, fearless, and a great rebounding guard.

i'd like an upgrade over shane as well, but PG is the biggest hole