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[star wars] How Much Better Movies Look WITHOUT CGI and Green Screen!

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by what, Aug 15, 2010.

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  1. JunkyardDwg

    JunkyardDwg Member

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    I think it all depends on how much money, how much emphasis and how much talent you got behind the camera when using cgi and green screens.

    The Gungan/Droid battle in Phantom menace was impressive but soulless ...and it was all completely cgi. At the same time, the Pod Racer seem was pretty damn awesome (could you imagine them trying to do that with the speeder they used in A New Hope?!). And I think the Anakin/Obi Wan fight in Ep III was epic.

    Look at any one of the battle scenes in LOTR which had so much depth to them and used a mixture of techniques. Golum's animation in Two Towers: unbelievable.

    Transformers....no way you could achieve what they did using just models.

    And then there's Avatar...I pretty much never once thought I was looking at a CGI character when watching it. The level of detail they achieved on the Na'vi characters was incredible. And the environments were absolutely breathtaking.


    There's just so many things you can do today with current technology that would be virtually impossible in the past.... Gary Sinise's amputated legs in Forrest Gump, "bullet time" in the first Matrix, a free-swinging Spidey....the list can go on and on.
     
    #21 JunkyardDwg, Aug 15, 2010
  2. what

    what Member

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    Old techniques just look plain better. Period. It doesn't even compare. You could name one, I could name 10. And you could make transformers better with stop motion and authentic modeling. Compare Short Circuit to Wall*e, compare original terminator, compare Back to the Future. You can't get authentic lighting or detail with a computer generated scene. It will never look as authentic as the same thing done with TRUE lighting and real models and stuff.
     
    #22 what, Aug 15, 2010
  3. worzel gummidge

    worzel gummidge Member

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    I'm not sure if this is blue/greenscreen but the backgrounds are paintings.
    <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/i6iiJk-LHOE?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US&amp;rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/i6iiJk-LHOE?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US&amp;rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
     
    #23 worzel gummidge, Aug 15, 2010
  4. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Avatar was fricken amazing using a green screen.

    Movies are better because of it...not worse.

    If you want to watch the original star trek with hand held models zipping across the screen then you better have a full bong for believability.

    DD
     
    #24 DaDakota, Aug 15, 2010
  5. Brando2101

    Brando2101 Member

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    Dude, weren't you going to admit defeat when given an example of green screen work in the original series? Read your own thread.
     
    #25 Brando2101, Aug 15, 2010
  6. BetterThanI

    BetterThanI Member

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    Opinion =/= fact. Many people who didn't grow up with the "better" effects you laud look back at them and find them old-fashioned and cheesy.

    Wow, you mean the live-action movie was more realistic than the cartoon movie?!? Say it ain't so! ;)

    Short Circuit was a terrible movie. Just awful. Wall*e was a fantastic bit of film-making. If I have to sacrifice even a hint of "realism" to avoid Steve Guttenberg, it's well worth it.

    To what? Terminator II? Because that was a MUCH better movie, and used a heckuva lot more CGI.

    Again, to what? The Matrix? LOTR? Make no mistake: Back to the Future used plenty of blue screen effects. Just look at the trails of fire that "appear" under Marty's feet when the DeLorean first disappears. It looks very, very fake:

    <object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/3BdtpUVTdxk?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/3BdtpUVTdxk?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

    CGI is just like any other tool: the quality of the product produced using it will largely depend on who is producing it. There are plenty of examples of terrible, unrealistic, and even cheesy usage of miniatures and models throughout the history of Hollywood. There are also some real gems. The same can be said with CGI.
     
    #26 BetterThanI, Aug 15, 2010
  7. Jontro

    Jontro Member

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    Transformers is the downside of CGI. and Shia Lebuffy didn't help either (but that's for another discussion, another day)
     
    #27 Jontro, Aug 16, 2010
  8. Hayden_SFC

    Hayden_SFC Member

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    Hey!!!!!!!!!!
    Say what you will about Transformers....but you don't say shat about Shia Labeouf. :grin:
     
    #28 Hayden_SFC, Aug 16, 2010
  9. RedRedemption

    RedRedemption Member

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    I don't like full CGI movies. Until CGI gets to the point where it is photo-realistic... No movie should be full CGI (except the family flicks).
     
    #29 RedRedemption, Aug 16, 2010
  10. Coach AI

    Coach AI Member

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    The Transformers movies aren't very good, but I can't knock the CGI. Those 'bots are impressive.
     
    #30 Coach AI, Aug 16, 2010
  11. what

    what Member

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    The most inauthentic looking part of Star Wars was the land speeder effects. Even as a kid I thought it looked stupid. The rest of the movie though (with the old techniques) look amazingly better than anything cgi has ever done including transformers. And, maybe you should read the title of the thread again, cause that was my point, so why would I accept defeat as you call it.
     
    #31 what, Aug 16, 2010
  12. what

    what Member

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    cgi is never going to come close to the old techniques. Hollywood knows it and most everybody here and elsewhere knows it too. The tool sucks. And the only reason anybody even uses it is because they are looking for cheap way out. Why spend millions to make it look right when you can spend a fraction of the cost with less time and effort.
     
    #32 what, Aug 16, 2010
  13. what

    what Member

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    Also, we are not looking at the instances were cgi was simply used as an effect: i.e. making the DeLorean disappear. We are looking at the moments just before the effect was done. Maybe you don't understand the thread. What makes the DeLorean scene believable is everything that surrounded THAT effect. The actors, the actual car (not a computer modeled car but an actual one), the mall in the background, the real fire on the ground as the tires heat up, and the true lightning showing a realistic nighttime scene.

    If the same scene would have been done with full cgi and actors in front of a green screen, it would have looked terrible and not even close to the original finished product.
     
    #33 what, Aug 16, 2010
  14. Jontro

    Jontro Member

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    IMO the movies weren't very good because Bay basically focused on the CGI and nothing else. What good are they when you barely know what's happening more than half the time. All I saw was a bunch of metallic objects bumping each other.

    Shia is teh suxs :p
     
    #34 Jontro, Aug 16, 2010
  15. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    worst name ever. seriously. may be a great guy but it sounds like like a line of cosmetics.
     
    #35 MadMax, Aug 16, 2010
  16. v3.0

    v3.0 Member

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    IMO the movies weren't any good because Michael Bay directed them.
     
    #36 v3.0, Aug 16, 2010
  17. professorjay

    professorjay Member

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    You only say CGI/green screen is bad because they are the noticeable cases.

    When it's well done you can barely tell, if at all.
     
    #37 professorjay, Aug 16, 2010
  18. Steve_Francis_rules

    Steve_Francis_rules Member

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    Take that back, you b*stard! I love Short Circuit.
     
    #38 Steve_Francis_rules, Aug 16, 2010
  19. BetterThanI

    BetterThanI Member

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    Sorry, man. Can't do it. It was so very, very bad. Plus...Steve Guttenberg. *shudder*
     
    #39 BetterThanI, Aug 16, 2010
  20. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    Sounds like you just have a bias my friend

    Rocket River
     
    #40 Rocket River, Aug 16, 2010
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