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Sources: Phillies discuss Howard for Pujols deal

Discussion in 'Other Sports' started by TheGreat, Mar 14, 2010.

  1. TheGreat

    TheGreat Member

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  2. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    Astros discuss Matsui for Pujols deal.
     
  3. LonghornFan

    LonghornFan Contributing Member

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    Title misleading. The owner said it was false. I SERIOUSLY doubt St. Louis would ever trade Pujols anyways, but Lidge would finally be able to talk it out and stuff.

    Rumors...
     
  4. Mr. Brightside

    Mr. Brightside Contributing Member

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    *Mind Explosion*
     
  5. Steve_Francis_rules

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    Of course the Phillies are interested in offering Howard for Pujols. They play the same position and Pujols is much better.
     
  6. Ramu3

    Ramu3 Member

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    Howard is on track to have a hall of fame career , but Pujols is the best player in baseball right now .
     
  7. Xerobull

    Xerobull You son of a b!tch! I'm in!

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    Pujols is insanely, all-time great good. He's at a different level than Howard, and that's saying a lot.
     
  8. juicystream

    juicystream Contributing Member

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    [rquoter]The logic for a Howard for Pujols swap, as discussed within the Phillies' organization, could fall along these lines: Pujols, 30 years old, is eligible for free agency after the 2011 season, and early conversations about a contract extension have not led to any long-term deal. The expectation within baseball is that Pujols may ask for a deal that would rival, in annual value, the record-setting 10-year, $275 million deal that Alex Rodriguez negotiated with the Yankees in fall 2007.

    Howard is under contract for each of the next two seasons as well -- for $19 million in 2010 and $20 million in 2011 -- as part of a three-year deal he signed last year. He would be more expensive than Pujols in each of the next two seasons, but on the other hand, he probably will not be as expensive to sign as Pujols in his next contract.[/rquoter]

    How would that be logical for St Louis? Pay more now, plus have Howard hit FA the same year as Pujols. They could just keep Pujols, and go after Howard in 2011, if Pujols doesn't want to sign for what they can offer.
     
  9. Bojangles

    Bojangles Contributing Member

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  10. djohn2o12

    djohn2o12 Member

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    Pujols wants A-Rod type of money, and Buster Olney reported this on Sportscenter
     
  11. Depressio

    Depressio Contributing Member

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    And why shouldn't he get it? The guy's a monster.
     
  12. baller4life315

    baller4life315 Contributing Member

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    This is baseball -- either you spend the big bucks and have a shot at being something special or you're just another fat chick at the dance. Given the fact that we're talking about the best player in baseball here the decision should be relatively easy for the Cardinals. Pujols + Holliday + three 15-20 win pitchers = a team that has a shot if you can keep that nucleus together. Plus, as juicystream pointed out the logic behind this deal seems rather flawed if both Pujols and Howard hit FA at the same time. I don't know, maybe I'm reading this incorrectly.

    P.S. Imagine the emotional roller coaster a Phillies fan would be going through. I'm sure going into this offseason they probably figured the two most untouchable players on their roster were Howard and Lee. Granted, they were able to net Roy Halladay it was still quite the shock to see that trade go down. This deal would definitely 'one up' that.
     
  13. Major

    Major Member

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    The problem is that if you give Pujols $25MM/yr, you might not be able to afford Holliday and three 15+ win pitchers (as the Rangers learned). The real mistake St. Louis made was giving Matt Holliday $17MM/yr before they locked up Pujols. If they think Holliday is worth that much, it's hard to argue that Pujols isn't worth $25MM or so.
     
  14. Beck

    Beck Contributing Member

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    Totally agree. Its like the Cardinals forgot they had Pujols nearing free agency when they signed that contract with Holliday. They are looking at $40-$50MM in payroll locked up in those 2 guys.
     
  15. SwoLy-D

    SwoLy-D Contributing Member

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    That's what SHE said. :eek:
     
  16. baller4life315

    baller4life315 Contributing Member

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    I agree the order is a bit puzzling and that signing Holliday first definitely seems to skew the market for a player like Pujols. All the same, I think you have to pony up and give the man what he wants. I know that's easy to say whenever we're playing with somebody else's money, but backing off or looking to deal Pujols now that you've locked up Holliday would be like the Lakers looking to deal Kobe after acquiring Gasol. You spend all that time and effort assembling a championship contender then you're going to let $10M extra (to keep Pujols) get in the way? It seems unlikely to me, if the Cards plan on spending the bucks and having a shot. Of course, here I am again making $10M sound like it's not a big deal. :)
     
  17. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

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    The Cards don't have that sort of money. They would like to... and they may very well give him the deal he deserves (which is more like $30 million/year, if you account for inflation since the A-rod deal)... but they won't be able to afford much else to "have a shot" as you said.

    Comparing any baseball $$$ situation to another sport is ridiculous....
     
  18. baller4life315

    baller4life315 Contributing Member

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    They'll have a chance this year if they bring everybody back. They had a shot last year too, but obviously they flopped big time in the postseason. Nothing wrong with going "all in" for a championship run. Hell, it's not like they really lost anybody (well, that wasn't replaced) plus odds are the Cards realize what's at stake here with Pujols. I have a hard time believing an agreement won't be made. You might be singing a different tune next year if/when they have another 90-100 win type season. At that point the onus is on them to deliver when it counts the most -- something I was surprised to see them not to do last year.
     
  19. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

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    I said nothing about this year. Pujols is under contract for it, and they shoud be pretty good.

    Its when they try to field a team / re-sign players, with Pujols and Holliday literally comprising half of their intended payroll that I forsee them having trouble remaining competetive long-term.
     
  20. Major

    Major Member

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    They are fine this year and probably next year. I think the real issues come up when Pujols, Carpenter and Wainwright are up for free agency (no idea when that is). Not sure what Carp is paid not, but Wainwright will be due a huge raise if he stays this good. They will need an awesome farm system, because they could be looking at $70+MM locked up in just 4 players if they keep them all.

    This is the same problem the Astros had with Oswalt, Berkman, Lee, Valverde, and Tejada taking up $70MM between them.
     

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