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So, What can we get for Bagwell?

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by AMS, Apr 29, 2005.

  1. msn

    msn Member

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    Says a lot of people. It's not as bad as some others, though--like CERA.
     
  2. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    This is a moot point. He's not going anywhere. No one is taking on that contract. Let's hope we get more out of him. He's on pace for about 95 RBI's right now. Put Berkman behind him, and my guess is he'll start seeing better pitches. Right now he has zero protection in that lineup.

    But he's not going anywhere.
     
  3. Plowman

    Plowman Member

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    ...and he provides zero protection for the two hole where Everett should reside.The trickle down effect is HUGE.
     
  4. rrj_gamz

    rrj_gamz Member

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    He's not going anywhere...His skills have diminished, but unless someone wants this huge contract, he's staying...
     
  5. SamCassell

    SamCassell Member

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    Everett doesn't need to be in the 2 hole. And Bags doesn't need to hit 3rd. I admire the hell out of Bags, btw, for going out there every day and playing through the pain. Yes he's a shell of his former self, yes he's over paid, but dude still swings hard every AB, still gives it his all in the field, still plays full out with whatever he's got. He could have Frank Thomas'd or Jason Giambi'd his career a long time ago, sat on the DL and still collected a check.
     
  6. Plowman

    Plowman Member

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    Pre wrist injury Everett,
    handles the bat well
    can handle the fastball
    had protection
    has speed on the bases and knows how to use it
    IS a good bunter
    Let him come all the way back.
    ..and I take nothing away from Bags as a player or person.I just hope he retires after this year exceptin the buyout,because it's painful to watch him out there now,plus it's hurting the team.
     
  7. Buck Turgidson

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    10-5 rights as well, Max. Much of this thread is just b****ing for the sake of b****ing, totally divorced from reality.

    The timing of this thread is awesome, considering he's hitting about .450 over the past week, and has been getting on base at a ~.380 clip.

    Xenon, you're not reinventing the wheel here, the 3-hole is, and has been for a loooooong time, reserved for the best hitter on the team - the guy with the best combination of average, power and on base ability. Nothing new here.

    The 4-5 spots are the most important RBI spots in the lineup, spots where power is a necessity, and for the most part, they've been well below average for the Stros this season. Berkman will help this immensely, and in the meantime the increased p.t. for Lamb has been huge. Ensberg is just about useless in rbi situations, his approach at the plate is baffling. 6 hole is a big rbi spot as well, has to "pick up" the other 2 if they fail to drive in men on base, especially when they get pitched around & walk a ton ahead of them, like Bagwell & Berkman.

    p.s. Berkman had only 54 ab's hitting 3rd last year, he's said repeatedly that he doesn't feel comfortable there, and prefers hitting 4th.

    Personally, my lineup in a couple of weeks would be:

    Willy
    AE (much better plate patience this year, gives Willy a chance to run, opposed to Bigg)
    Bags
    Berk
    Lane
    Biggio
    Lamb
    Brad
     
  8. msn

    msn Member

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    Exactly.
     
  9. Xenon

    Xenon Member

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    When will you guys get it through your heads that Everett is NOT a top of the order hitter? This guy will never get on base enough to justify hitting him there. What you need is a guy that isn't going to struggle to hit .270 and can easily keep an obp above .340. These are things that Everett cannot do. He is the prototypical 8 slot hitter. When has he ever shown that he deserves a top of the order slot? Is it because he can sacrifice bunt? Please.

    Taveras
    Biggio
    Berkman
    Lane
    Bagwell
    Lamb
    Everett
    Ausmus

    or

    Taveras
    Ensberg
    Berkman
    Lane
    Biggio
    Bagwell
    Everett
    Ausmus
     
  10. msn

    msn Member

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    When will you get it through your head that the 2-hole is about more than OBP? (and no, I'm not talking about bunting)

    Just because the voices in your head didn't tell you about it doesn't mean it's not true.
     
  11. Xenon

    Xenon Member

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    If youre talking about patience at the plate then Ensberg fits the bill much better than Everett. This has the added benefit of someone that can actually get on base at a better than .317 clip.
     
  12. msn

    msn Member

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    No I wasn't, but nice example in Ensberg, there. Dude is whiffing like Jose Hernandez this year.

    There you go making it all about OBP again.
     
  13. Xenon

    Xenon Member

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    Ensberg has 22 so's to Everett's 18 so's. That isn't as dramatic a difference as you make it out to be.

    Then what it is that makes Everett such a great 2 slot hitter? It's not obp. 320ish for his career. Compared to .360ish for Ensberg. It's not his patience at the plate. Is it his speed? 2 sb's in 4 attempts? Blistering...
     
  14. Buck Turgidson

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    1. handles the bat well - ability to hit behind the runner, foul off tough pitches, good bunter (he hits a lot of grounders to the left side, if guys start cheating up to defense the bunt, it's easier for those to get by);
    2. plate discipline - good eye & patience, has gotten much better since the middle of last year;
    3. baserunning - good speed, makes good turns at the bases, fast enough to beat out d.p. grounders, pretty good SB threat;
    4. hitting him 2nd makes the lineup deeper and gets one of their better XB hitters (Biggio) into a better RBI spot.
     
  15. msn

    msn Member

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    I wasn't comparing and Ensberg and Everett--you're the only one who seems to be interested in that.

    See Turgidson's post. I've already tried to explain it here too many times, I'm bored with the redundancy.

    Good Lord, man, how many times do I have to say it's not about OBP? Tell ya what, for good measure, why don't post five or six *more* times about AE's OBP?

    You do realize that speed accomplishes more than stolen bases, don't you? But no, it wasn't speed. Check Buck's post.
     
  16. NJRocket

    NJRocket Member

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    Of all the points, #3 is the only one that i think truly applies to Everett.

    I don't think he handles the bat that well. To say he can hit behind the runner when he wants and pull one down the line when somoene charges in for a bunt is like saying he is Tony gwynn-like...which obviously isnt the case.

    I guess you could make a case for #2.

    I think hitting him 2nd might mkae the lineup deeper, but also puts a guy who is a lifetime 1 for 4 hitter in a crucial spot in the lineup.
     
  17. msn

    msn Member

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    Well, you're wrong. :)

    No, it's not hyperbole at all. If one can be a good jump shooter without being Larry Byrd, then one can hit well behind the runner without being Tony Gwynn.
     
  18. Plowman

    Plowman Member

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    When healthy,with protection Everett is the perfect 2 hitter.The guy is recovering from the wrist,has been hit leadoff:rolleyes: ,and has Bags hitting .207 behind him.And he is still very young.Even so,when he went down last year,Adam was proving it on the MLB level.Give him some time.He'll be an all star for many years.
     
    #98 Plowman, May 2, 2005
    Last edited: May 2, 2005
  19. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Member

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    Huff can play 3rd, he was originally a 3rd baseman when he got to the majors.
     
  20. NJRocket

    NJRocket Member

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    saying he can put the ball where he needs to when he needs to, is not an accurate description of Adam Everett
     

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