Smashing Pumpkins vs Nirvana

I think Billy Corgain has b****ed multiple times to fans on his blog that he only wants to play their new material during concerts instead of old songs. The last time I read his blog was around the time he was getting ready to debut his most recent album. Maybe he's changed since then but I kind of doubt it.

I choose SP by the way. Both are incredible but I listen to SP more. I'd vote for Alice in Chains if they were apart of the poll though.

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Same here. I love AiC.

 

I always felt like Pixies and some older bands before them created the sound, we all get that.

Nirvana made it mainstream without trying somehow, it just fell into their laps. They brought it to the forefront. Okay we all agree on this.

What Smashing Pumpkins did though was take this new sound and turn it into a masterpiece with meticulous and painstaking attention to detail. Everyone hated Corgan because he was a control freak, he wanted things perfect, but look at the result - super polished albums that don't sound super polished, they sound natural. *Nevermind was overly polished for example, comes off frail IMO*

SP crafted beautiful music, Cobain was just talented. We don't know where Nirvana was headed, No Your Right or whatever sounded pretty good, one of their best songs, In Utero had a more interesting sound IMO and Nirvana was headed more in that direction. But they were never going to get complex like SP.

 

It's funny that people call SP complex, but if you break down their songs, they're really quite simple harmonically and rhythmically. There's a lot more "icing" to a Smashing Pumpkins song - more overdubs, more textures - but it's all basic major/minor chords with diatonic melodies over the top.

Nirvana was much more interesting in their mix of dissonance with the poppy melodies. Listen to "In Bloom" - it's a ridiculously catchy melody tacked onto an odd chord progression. And the solo - probably any decent guitarist can play it, true, but how many guitarists would choose the same notes/sounds AND make it work. It's like listening to a free jazz solo, only it doesn't meander like jazz. On In Utero, you could hear him working more on this dissonance/poppy melody mixture, and I think with the right producer (someone of George Martin's caliber), you might have seen Nirvana make an album with arrangements equal to those of SP, but with a great complexity in its light and shade.

Another thing that Nirvana had that SP would always lack was authenticity. No matter how weird a Nirvana song or video was, you never doubted that it was an accurate reflection of Kurt's personality. Watching the video that FFB posted, the edits made by Kurt were the right ones - the teacher in a dunce cap shots were stupid and didn't work. The original video will probably remain one of the top 2-3 videos of all time - the combination of the band's energy, Kurt's voice and the rioting pep rally turned a potentially silly concept (rock pep rally) into a quasi-Dionysian outburst. It's just perfect.

Look, let's face it - this is pop music and even the most talented pop artists are rarely musical innovators. Pop music is mostly about an artist's ability to project a unique personality, and Kurt was able to do that much better than the Pixies or SP.

 

This is really tough for me, but I had to vote the Pumpkins because for a several year stretch they were my favorite band. Adore is still one of my favorite albums of all time and I like it far and away more than any of the Nirvana albums. Still, I was and still am a huge Nirvana fan. In Utero is a fantastic album and it really sucks that we didn't get to hear more from them.

For anyone that is a Nirvana fan, I highly recommend the biography of Kurt Cobain called Heaver Than Heaven . It was authorized by Courtney so the writer had far more access than anyone else writing about Kurt. It's a great read.

 

this is why nirvana wins...

billy corgan is a tai-chi vampire!

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Man, I remember the very first time I heard the Pumpkins I thought to myself...wow, that is the worst voice I've ever heard how can anybody like that band!! Little did I know they would end up becoming one of my favorite bands of all time. My vote goes to the Pumpkins.

 

How the hell do you even compare these two bands??

You would of been better of doing Pearl Jam and Nirvana, both Seattle bands.

This is what you should compare Smashing Pumpkins to:


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Nirvana easily. I use to like them both and I still do like some of the SP songs, but when I heard Corgan live I was like WTF! The guy sounds absolutely horrible...it was the first time I truly realized how much the studios can clean up someone's voice, even if it sounds like a rabid cat and a violin fighting in a cage match.

 

Nirvana for me. I was never a huge SP fan. As far as whiny vocals go, I always thought BC took the cake.

I agree Nirvana's music was simple, but who really cares with a raw in your face rock band? Make no mistake "smells like teen spirit" almost single handedly killed co*k rock by punching it in the face! There was a ton of great music at the time to help that along though.

I liked the pure raw emotion that Nirvana delivered. Sp's probably touched on different emotions, but I had bands like NIN, Pearl Jam and Alice in Chains that delivered far more for me.

The album that I wish we all got to experience is the album that was written before "In Utero". Supposedly Cobain says this was the album that he felt truly defined Nirvana. I believe the record company didn't dig it and made them write another record. If these recordings are still around, I hope they find their way to the masses.

Anyway, in short, it's Nirvana for me. I just couldn't relate to the Pumpkins as a whole for some reason although I admit the music was good. Pretty sure it was BC that I never really liked.

 

I must've caught them on an "experimental" night where the set worked. They played 1 or 2 then unreleased songs, and were improvising a lot. Some of the mellon collie songs were arranged a little differently, but sounded better than the album.

Well they had the same producer (Butch Vig) for Nevermind and Siamese Dreams.

 

I loved both of these bands when they were in their primes and still like them, but their sound hasn't withstood the test of time. I don't listen to them very often any more and when I do it's the early stuff - Gish, Bleach, etc.

 

can we all at least agree that r. kelly is a musical genius?

 

Going by who I think is the more influential band? Nirvana and it isn't even close.

Going by who I like to listen more to? Smashing Pumpkins.

For the record, I voted for Nirvana but mainly because I was going by influence and not personal preference. Plus I can't really hold it against Nirvana that their discography is a lot smaller than the SP due to Cobain dying too young. Smashing Pumpkins were great but they lost me after the Adore album and really they will be looked more or less, IMO, as a band that followed Nirvana and not really an innovator like Nirvana is considered.

 

so apparently maybe if billy would have killed himself too he would be greatly appreciated. i only wish kurt would have still been alive so that people could see how ****ed up he really is

 

Thanks Courtney.

 

so does Sonic Youth qualify as grunge? I listened to

Experimental Jet Set, Trash and no Star




and my mind was blown. Holy ****, move over Mellon Collie and Nevermind. Sonic Youth is the best band ever:grin:. The question is where do i go from here?

Kewl Stury

 

What made you search for a Nirvana thread with your first post and pull up a 10 month old thread?

 

That's pretty messed up, man.