ONe of my math teachers told me that the only reason we learn math in high school is to weed out engineers and doctors. The annoying part is, I don't want to be an engineer or a doctor or a computer programmer or really anything with math. I want to major in International Affairs and maybe work for the Govt or an NGO. We have a system where if you want to be a plumber or an electrican you can opt to go to vocational school instead of high school. I think we should have it where you can opt of classess like Trig and Calculus if it's not part of your intended college/career path. I'm not saying all math is useless. Hell, if you can't add, subtract, multiply, divide, or do basic algebra you're done for. But I don't see why I have to take Trig and calculus and know how to graph a parabola!
To those who think abstract math is not worth the time, do you realize that the math we use today in our everyday lives were once abstract? The fact that you know 2+3 = 3+2 was an abstract idea. So abstract materials lead to applications. I'm sure you've heard of E=mc (squared)...Einstein's famous equation. It was an abstract theory. But that is the fundamental ingredient to the atomic bomb!
You work for a college? So you definitely have first hand experience with those struggling students huh? :grin: So how do you handle them?
Same here, but I'll admit that doing proofs was like eating spinach or broccoli for some people: they're good to stimulate your brain like B-Bob said. I attended various international schools around the world because of my father's work, but by the time I came to high school in the US, the way I'd been taught maths allowed me to excel versus my HS peers even though I preferred the liberal arts. I stopped my maths at differential equations and multivariate statistics in college, and I've found that I can understand certain principles that use abstract math better than my friends without a stronger background in numbers (i.e. quantum mechanics or behavioral studies that use math models in urban studies).
Not paying attention... that's a paddlin'. Speaking out of turn... that's a paddlin'. Paddling the school canoe... you better believe that's a paddlin'.
in so much words, i think you hit on the problem. with no disrespect to current teachers, and speaking in generalities - i believe it's the overall quality of today's teachers. teaching, as a profession, hasn't been able to keep up with the massive salary competition brought on by information sciences, management, law school, med school, para-professions, etc. it's been sustained by people who genuinely care about education. in my experience, the folks that by-and-large really "understood" the content went on to more monetarily prestigious jobs. again, in my experience only, the folks i know who went on to teach (excluding Teach for America) are the people who didn't understand the content, but did well enough to memorize their teachers' presentations (at a B or C level).
Don't teachers encourage students to succeed? If success to them means money, then it's sad, but teaching is not the way to go.
ab = an undersized shooting guard who dribbles too much and is really struggling with his shot of late.
I can appreciate this opinion simply because it's one I used to hold, too. :grin: As time goes on, I really am on the fence about this. There are so many more things more important to kids in their adult like (like taking care of finances, savings, maintaining a car/home, etc) that are far more practical and useful than something like calculus and linear algebra. Can the mind be exercised in no other way than by abstract math? Are there no mental giants in other fields? I'm with you on the learning-for-learning's-sake. I'm the same way. I like reading about anything I can get my hands on. I find reading articles about so many different things more fascinating than watching probably 90% of what's on tv. I'd rather learn than get drunk. I'd rather read than yap on the phone. But that's not everybody, nor is it "right". As a matter of fact, I'm probably in the minority in that regard. Just as people who get anything out of advanced math/science are probably in the minority. Why subject the majority to this? I guess the opposing view is also that "if they don't take it, how can they find out if they're interested in it?" To which I really have no answer. lol.
Well, of course. But the obvious answer is "the majority of people aren't engineers" or have no interest in becoming one.
At least calculus and linear algebra have some use in the world. What is the point of having write a 10 page paper on the symbolism in the scarlet letter. I mean I can summarize it in a few slides with bullet points instead we have to write fluff so that the AP graders/teachers give you a good score.
I have a degree in mathematics. By abstract math, do you mean proofs? Because Abstract algebra has no place in high schools. That was a tough class. (but I made an A) Proofs are helpful but I don't see where they would have time to teach it. Maybe if they eliminated some of this junk-- Social Studies/History -- Useless knowledge. Science -- I don't need to know what a frog's guts look like or how oxygen reacts with hydrogen to make water. I get my water from the faucet. Literature -- Wherefore art thou Romeo? I would be so much better off not having to read that junk...I mean the sparknotes to that joke. Advanced Math -- There's a point where they stop teaching practical math and get into matrices and logs and things. I think that's algebra II. It's not useful for most people. Now if you're getting a degree in math or science or english or history you would need some of this stuff, but there should be a path to take where you can avoid some of the bad stuff.
