solid point. battier is clearly better than some of our other players on the bench, there's no doubt about that. we should end this battier bashing already. did we get too little in return for gay? absolutely. but the past is the past, so stop whinning about it. Plus, battier will bring us more win under a defensive system than gay. definitely more than gay could've done.
i agree with everything weslinder said. battier has great lateral quickness, and gets written off as 'completely nonathletic' when it is really just a case of not having an explosive leap. i always forget how large and strong he is, something i was reminded of wednesday night. weslinder said it well, if you want to see his value, go get a good seat and watch him all night. being quick and strong coupled with a never quit attitude results in a high impact on the game. you can't judge him by rudy gay. you can judge the trade by the balance of talent going in and out. it's completely valid for most the posters to feel like the trade didn't get enough in return, considering we gave up two players who were top 10 picks. it is completely invalid to impose what you wish we had gotten physically out of rudy (speed, flight) onto shane and draw the conclusion that since shane isn't as athletic, then rudy is the better player. this completely neglects comparing what shane brings (hustle, heads-up, perimeter shot) onto rudy. rudy is explosive and his sheer agility allows him to impact the game. if rudy played with half the head and heart shane does, he would be a max contract type player.
I'm a Battier supporter but I also think that Bonzi is simply too good to not play 25-30 minutes a night. Establishing Bonzi (or at least somebody) as our clear cut third option is paramount for the success of this team in the long run. Whether this means cutting into Battier's minutes or using Bonzi as a four in some matchups it has to happen, IMO. I think it's entirely possible for the two of them to coexist.
Right on! I respected Shane's defense before he became a Rocket but I had court side seats at one of the home games in the first round of last year's playoffs. Shane is, IMO, the BEST team defender in the league not named Kevin Garnett and his close out on jump shooters was indescribable. He literally has his hand in the shooter's face like he is going to break their nose. Actually, like you said, you need to see it up close to understand it.
I think this would be a warranted place to talk about the Battier/Swift for Gay trade. In my opinion if we still had Rudy Gay the team would have so much more to offer in terms of a third scorer. Some might say yes, he is the first scorer for a way sub-par team, but he is still their FIRST scorer. It's only his second year and he's already average about 19 points, and 6 rebound competing, and this is with a Pau Gasol, and Damon Stoudamire on the team. He just pounded 20 on a exceptionally defensively talented Detriot Piston team. As for the tangibles that everyone talks about, I'm not going to lie if it weren't for him the team would not have as much fire but the only SPARK I see from him is not when he is playing but more-so when he is fighting for the loose-ball. Guys have been pounding on him night in, night out, but what separates him from the pack is his ability to lead and work his butt off on the loose-ball. So at the end of the day, the outcome of the trade goes to the debate between being a third option, or being a leader. What this team needs is a leader, and given Battier's Duke background, he plays a large role when it comes to leadership.
for one thing, we have too many low post workers for Shane to earn his living there,bonzi/scola/yao(maybe that's why Coach A is using Yao as premeter 7'6 shooter )
LAWL @ Kobe being a "great defender". God, that guy's "clutchness" and defense are quite possibly the two most overrated aspects of any player's game in the entire NBA. Kobe is NOT a good defender. Average at best.
Oh, and we were not "showcasing" Luther. He earned that PT the game before against the Sixers. ... If anything, we've been showcasing Alston all season, including by tanking those two games in the east.
Shane is a good defender but he's no lock down stopper. Artest or Bruce Bowen he is not. I've seen jumpers made on him countless times when he's got the hand in the face. He's not as athletic as Artest when it comes to defending or as crafty as Bowen to bother the offensive player. And could you please hit the friggin open shots, your part of the reason we stink right now, cause you're not hitting your open shots therefore the offense struggles when its designed to get open shots for you.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that all of the GMs and coaches in the league were off that night watching the Rockets in their favorite sports bar...
Except that Battier's personality definitely doesn't lend to him being a leader in any way. He is the perfect role player, right down to his personality. There's nothing wrong about that, every team needs a guy like him. Another thing about Battier. Yes, he does get a hand in a shooter's face most of the time. I myself have gotten burnt countless times face-guarding great scorers playing league ball. The good shooters in the league aren't gonna be bothered much by that. You think just by covering up Kobe's face, he isn't gonna drain a fadeaway on you? Come on, the reason these guys are such great shooters and scorers in the toughest pro league in the world is because they've practised their shots hundreds of thousands of times, if not millions. They don't need to fully see the basket to make a shot, it's already ingrained into their muscle memory. Having a hand in their face bothers them, but not much.
1. I've seen jumpers made in Bowen and Artest's face countless times, too. This is the NBA, guys get paid millions because they can do things like making defended jumpers. Having jumpers made in your face is a good thing. Shows you are staying close to the shooter and putting a hand up. The problem with some of the poor defenders is that their faces are too far away when jumpers get made. 2. Battier is making 37% of his threes. Given how the Rockets are shooting, his range shooting is one of the better ones on the team. His shooting isn't part of the problem. He's taking 0.2 less threes per game and making 0.3 less.
1. I really think Shane has slipped as a defender this year, but that goes along with the rest of the Rockets. Or that the opposing players are used to Shane's defensive tendencies, but the fact is a player can still have a big night on him these days. You guys are actually overrating him a bit when I hear comments like he's the best defender this side of whatever good defender you compare him to. I just think he's a good defender, not a stopper. 2. Stats mean nothing to me, I go by what I see and what I've seen this year is that Shane missing a bunch of open 3s up until recent games. But I'll accept those stats for the sake of argument, my rebuttal is how many of shots of those were open 3's. When you have 2 stars like TMac and Yao, you're going to get alot of open looks. Shane needs to be money on the those corner 3's I see him be wide open when Yao or TMac finds him. Otherwise, Yao or Tmac might as well fight the doubleteam and ignore the open man.
