I agree, but i also think that's what makes guys like bob over here start to purely hate the player, even when he does actually play well. If he plays badly, point it out, if he plays well, point it out...but don't reach back into the past to bring up a bad time/game just to bring down a good day the player had. In this case though, i think any rocket who got a +36 would have got his own thread though, that is pretty high ...
Did you read larsv8's post? Looks like you intentionally avoided that one too lol. His +/- early this season wasn't good because he wasn't playing well. It's pretty clear that his effectiveness wears off when he tries to do too much especially on offense. In the 2nd half, he wasn't forcing anything, or attempting anything outside his capabilities. The increased offensive workload for Shane experiment is already over, thankfully. I see that you're taking +/- seriously as you're throwing it back at me, meaning you think he was incredible today against the Jazz. My job is finished.
Some people just love Battier. If they are being unreasonable, then why argue with them using reason? Seems like a recipe for unhappiness to me. Myself, I do really love Battier, and also Hayes. I find them easy to congratulate in victories and hard to blame in defeat. TMac, on the other hand, is much easier to blame. You expect TMac to win the game for you, even if the rest of the team is playing poorly. Chuck and Shane not so much. But you have to admit its amazing, and down right inspirational, to see the Rockets w/o TMac and Yao lead by Battier and Hayes dominate the j*zz on their home floor.
and he hit that semi-turn around jumper on the baseline too, it seemed like he just sort of threw it up there, like a team heat-check, but i think he should get more of those, he seems to make a high percentage when he takes them.
Um, I'm assuming you mean this post. Which I responded to with this post: Which larsv8 responded to by basically saying "Weeeeeeeeell, Artest sucks anyway." Looks like you intentionally avoided that one too lol.
are we talking about last year's playoffs or we talking about this year's team? lol, so much anger towards Rockets players working harder than ever and getting the job done.
Shane had a slow start, but he actually put on a good show tonight. I'm impressed by that behind the back pass. With that being said, I still don't think he is worth more than 4m per year and definitely not worth a lotto pick. He had one good game, that's it. How often do we get to see that? I'll take Ariza/Gay/Brewer over Battier any day of the week.
You have any evidence at all to support this? Besides, Artest got burned to a crisp every time he was put on Kobe (which wasn't often).
Most people don't. Shane had a great game,and I'm happy for him but pointing anyone's mistakes doesn't necessarily mean you hate them. I love Luis but when he does poorly,mostly on defense,I point it out.
I'm just trying to figure out if +/- actually means something or not. In last season's playoffs and the first couple games of this season, +/- was meaningless according to Battier-lovers. Now all of a sudden it's the greatest stat ever conceived.
Are there any players you do like? I can't remember you ever making a post that was not Battier-related.
When shane cuts and plays well, I say it, but when he doesn't, I say it. It doesn't mean I want him to fail, i'm just not blinded by his intangibles when there are a lot of tangible stuff out there. BTW, I don't think shane is into the sistas, so he couldn't banged my gal
Well what would be the point of me sitting here and saying "Aaron Brooks is really good, Luis Scola is really good, Trevor Ariza is really good, etc". I mean, everybody around here pretty much agrees with that. I'd rather debate issues that everybody doesn't agree on.
Because its a "fan" board, where you celebrate your team with others who have similar feelings. If you want to try and make a case that another player would be superior on this team or a potential trade, more power to you. But to be down on a guy even when he has a good game is....annoying.
I had wanted Battier on Deron Willaims two years ago.... http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=146887&highlight=battier+deron+williams I still think we would have won that series if Shane was on Deron for the entire series. That match up plays to our strength in two ways... 1) It allows Shane to do what he does best...hound someone specific. 2) That someone specific is the player that makes Utah go. Stop him and you stop the Jazz.
If you're looking for players who score, or light up a boxscore, then yes. I kow it sounds cliche, that he's no stats- all star, mr intangibles, etc...but any player, not just shane, is capable of having a low scoring game, even an off shooting night, and still have an overall good game. It's easier for someone like Battier to have a game like that because a bad shooting night for him isn't high volume. A player could play great D, great hustle, draw charges, etc. but if he goes 5 for 20 it's hard to say "good game". However, if he went 1 of 3, then it's possible. You and others may not like that he only took 3 shots, or only score a few points, but i don't see why that should be classified as bad game just because he didn't meet the goal you had for him. If the team wins and his actions helped in the win a lot more than they did not, and were significant, why cant that be a good game? That's pretty much the way Chuck rolls too. Sure Chuck only earns 2 mill, but he's a bargain at the price, he's probably worth 4. Since Shane plays a lot more though, i'd say he deserves 5-6. He is out there actually playing the game, as in a lot of minutes, how can you not pay a guy that plays such a high number of minutes a significant amount. It's great to get a bargain, but there's nothing wrong with paying for the work they're putting in. That being said Shane is making about 1-2 mill more than I value him at. However, when you consider some guys get overpaid 6 or 7 million, or more, nowadays, it doesn't seem like an insane amount. Add to that the fact that we have a lot of bargains on this team and it makes it that more less insane. I do know there's a chance that 2 mill may affect us when it comes to signing someone, but i trust Morey takes all that into consideration with all players and he'll ship anyone out or let them walk when they are no longer worth it to the team in his eyes, and well, in Morey i trust. He's shown he's done a whole lot more good than bad, so i can live with his decision making for now.
