kissadeath, So, Rogers is shooting a sizzling 70% for the season...so what? That doesn't mean he can shoot! That means the playmakers get him the ball. Also, it is well-documented that Stacey Augmon can't shoot. But guess what...Augmon is a 48% career shooter....sure Shandon's is a 47% shooter, but skewed by one 53% year with Malone/Stockton giving easy shots, plus two sub 45%. Augmon was sub-45% once in 10 yrs. Shandon's 44.8% is pitiful for someone who gets ignored by the defense vs Mobley's 43.4%. If you don't see that, you are a homey, and I've got to love ya for that. Sure, Mobley can pick his moments better and increase his FG%, but that has nothing to do with the fact that Shandon is shooting only 44.8% on open shots. The difference is Shandon is taking easy shots that aren't there without the skill of Francis and Mobley demanding double teams. If he could actually shoot the ball, Mobley and Francis could not be double teamed as much. That is what makes Moochie so effective as the point guard ISO-ing from the key. He has Francis on one side and Mobley on the other, one pass away. The D cannot leave Mobley/Francis. Can you just imagine what Shandon could do with Mobley on his right, and Steve on his left, if the man could just dribble, pass and shoot. You cannot compare fg% of a playmaker to a role player, sorry. [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited March 23, 2001).]
There is something about Langhi...he does not know where to be on the court. I think as a sharpshooter all his life he has never had to learn spacing and weakside roles. He looks very confused. imo, he is not ready.
first, my condolences on your loss. now, onto your post.... i don't believe in extrapolating numbers. to do so ignores the reasons why he gets pulled in the first place - offensive ineptitude. there have been many players (othella harrington, shandon anderson, etc.) who shoot a decent percentage but are basically a cancer on offense. shandon passes up on entirely too many shots that are designated to be taken within the flow of the offense. shandon builds far too many condominiums when he does shoot that shot. shandon is stacey augmon. next time, tell me about what you see in the game...not what you see in the paper. seriously, it makes all the difference.
damnit jim! i'm a barbecuer, not a repairman! (that's one for the star trek fans) i can find one good thing to say about shandon. he's leaving soon. no, really. i don't think - as a starter - that shandon anderson brings anything OF SIGNIFICANCE to the floor. when i say "OF SIGNIFICANCE" i mean anything which might outweigh the plethora of negatives he also brings. i've already listed those. now can you list the positive(s?)? and i don't mean hypothetical crap. not - "IF we posted him up more". the same could have been said about pervis ellison. but guess what? he wasn't good enough to garner those touches. in other words, the positives he "might" bring did not - and in shandon's case, do not - outweigh the positives we enjoy currently. in other words, rudy (or no coach in his right mind) is going to change the offense for shandon one iota. HE will have to adjust to the offense. is that so tough? just hit the open shot. ------------------ Lt. Roastabotch reporting for duty!
THAT'S IT, NOW YOU HAVE GONE TOO FAR ! Don't ever let me catch you dogging Pervis 'Never Nervous' Ellison again =) ------------------ word to your mother
hey pee -- I'm glad you brought up Carlos and his 70% from the field -- i'd like to see more of him in the line-up as well. I could easily make an argument that the higher fg percentages of Rogers and Anderson backup the assertion that they are more defensive-minded role players that play within themselves on the offensive end. i'm not going to get into a Mobley arg. with you -- I love his play-making ability on offense -- he's got the quickest first step in the league and can break down anyone to the basket. I'll go even further and say that I even like the Mobley iso's during crunch time...... his aggressive offensive mindset is a rarer commodity in the league than defensive role players like Rogers and Anderson. However, we need role players like Shandon and Rogers -- just like Elie on the championship squads. A team full of Mobleys isn't going to win games or championships. Verse's assertion that Anderson is garbage is garbage. verse -- thanks for the condolensces don't get me wrong here, I think that Shandon has struggled this year and see his liabilities on the offensive end -- he doesn't deserve to start over Mobley but certainly deserves to start over Williams and Bullard. Shandon is a role player and in my opinion, does a lot of things that don't show up in the paper. I think he is a much better defender than you give him credit. It's Rudy's job to give him role player minutes and it will be Caroll's job to pay him accordingly -- or let him move on. He's far from a cancer on this team -- and I'd rather see him on the floor than Bullard or Williams. Certain situations call for Bullard and Williams, but for the most part, Anderson, Mobley, and Francis should garner most of the minutes at 3,2 and the point. ------------------ [This message has been edited by kissofdeath (edited March 23, 2001).]
I agree that Shandon is best at guarding big 2's, but he is also probably the best at guarding strong 3's. So, going back to my original question...if both are in the game should Mobes be guarding a 3? LA is a bad example because Fox is one of those 3's who does not need to be guarded. It started as a legitimate question, but then I found your response to be insulting and got mad. Basically, we agree about Shandon being really good at guarding big 2's the rest was just... ------------------ Whitey will pay.
jamcracker: who guarded vince carter? and roasted his ass on the other end, as well? and i would not bring up kobe bryant. kobe, against houston, in houston, had what HE called "the greatest game of his career." still, i get what you're saying about needing a defender for long guards. you know what? i think dan langhi brings more NET positives to the floor than shandon does. AND, MAN, THAT IS SAYING A LOT.
You ARE joking right? ------------------ If I had my life to live over,I would have liked to have ended up as a sportswriter - Richard M. Nixon,1969
HeyP Let's look to see if the Double Teamer rotates off Shan mostly for the rest of the year Rocket River ------------------
kissofdeath: sorry, i forgot to address you. can you honestly tell me that shandon brings more positives to the court than negatives? there's no way in hades i can ever say yes to that. as a bench player, i could tolerate shandon. i have said so in numerous threads that for 10 minutes for game, i could live with the HUDman. but, as a starter, he is garbage. as a player who some have suggested giving mobley-esque #s, he is garbage. for a player who has not worked on his game any after getting a starting opportunity for two years with the rockets, he is garbage. ****************** if you guys don't like that terminology ("garbage"), here's a suggestion: stop worrying about what type of charcoal i'm using, and stop worrying about the lamb i'm barbecuing. also, have you guys never played ball with someone who everytime you shot a terrible shot said "that's garbage!" ?? regardless, shandon can't shoot or dribble. and i can't condone changing the offense for a guy who can't hit an open shot - something even centers can do. he has shown no improvement in his game in 2 years, and you guys staunchly defend him. some of you even defended him starting! not because of the "wink, wink" but because of his abilities. well, i didn't light my grill then, but damnit now it's on! ------------------ Lt. Roastabotch reporting for duty!
guys, i'm done. unless one of you can show me why he should be in the starting lineup, or can show me any kind of improvement he has made, or can show me what the heck he has done on the court to warrant a raise & extension, i rest my pit. i understand many of you may not have liked the type of lighter fluid i chose, but i don't think anyone can disagree with me roasting this turkey. up next on the pit: kelvin "someone cut off my manhood" cato. ------------------ Lt. Roastabotch reporting for duty!
Here's one reason he starts : Walt Williams I would rather take the lesser of 2 evils. ------------------ I hate role players
This team operated at a high level with a much less than 100% Dream w/diminished minutes...reeled off victories..that's the bottom line,not statlines.It stands to reason,that with an upgraded frontline ,SA and the rest of the Rockets will win.What about that chemistry we had when we had an inside game.Shandon blended in well and did his job.I don't see why, when we have that inside presence again(and a deeper bench),that we shouldn't rack up W's,thus, dousing this fire. ------------------ If I had my life to live over,I would have liked to have ended up as a sportswriter - Richard M. Nixon,1969 [This message has been edited by hardwood (edited March 23, 2001).]
I totally agree with you verse. I'm tired of ppl pointing out his shooting percentage. THAT STATISTIC DOESN'T TELL THE WHOLE STORY!! The shots he makes are layups from passes from the stars on our team. He bricks almost every shot he attempts. The only thing he offers is defense and like I said in a different post, his defense isn't worth his horrible offense. He's a bench player at best and if some other team is dumb enough to sign him for big money and promise him a starting spot then they can take him. The problem with this season is the Rockets have no other options for the 3 so we're stuck with him there. This offseason is huge for the future of our team, we could either set ourselves up for many years of dying in the playoffs or thriving in them. You know what I would like to see just for maybe half a quarter in a game (if we're out of the playoff run)? I'd like to see Mo play the 3 just to see how he handles it. I know he'll probably get torched but I still think it would be interesting to see. Maybe a Francis, Cat, Mo, Rogers, and Cato line? I know that sounds really stupid, but it's friday and i feel creative. Anyway back to the topic. Thank you verse for saying everything I was thinking. (I was just too lazy to find the numbers to support my argument) ------------------ Forget LHutz, Bob Rainey is by far the coolest poster in cc.net history!
HeyPee, there have been several posts since you replied to mine, and I sort of hate to go off on a tangent, but my point was that if Rudy had been giving Langhi quality pt all season, I think he would have been ready before now. I too, think he looks confused alot. How is he going to get over that except by playing. The other part of the equation is that who would he be taking time from by playing. Basically, the most non productive position on the team. I could understand it if he were a guard or power forward or even a center. I don't care how unready he is at this moment, he needs experience at this level to get comfortable. In the meantime, I have been very satisfied with his hustle and his defense. Doesn't that count for anything? ------------------
I have thought that it is time for Shandon to move on since about halfway through the season. The one reservation I had was that he took a lower amount of money to be here, so I felt the Rockets owed him something. A sentiment that several others still have. However, this was a much different team when Shandon signed. If I'm not mistaken, Pippen was still here, and the Francis trade had not gone down. So this is a much different team than the one Shan envisioned playing for. I think that with the emergence of Francis and Mobley(who looks down-right Jordan-esque on offense at times), Shandon realizes that the team is not right for him and will move on. We don't owe him anything in the future. He will continue to start for the rest of the year, then go somewhere else. No hard feelings or grudges. I have a lot of respect for Shandon for going about his business and not causing waves(unlike my hero, Dream) even though he has not worked out here. So, no need to call him GAR-BAGE, or give him names like "Shan-dumb Ander-stink." He is just a man going about his business as a professional. P.S. I know many of you think it is blasphemous to compare Mobley to Jordan, so don't pad your posts by commenting on that. ------------------ Kenny Thomas had a foul called on him in the Western Conference Finals.
I just find it extremely lame to pick on Shandon. The guy turned down a Mobley-style contract to play here. He starts because he's one of our best players, not because the Rockets feel like they have to start him. If the Rockets felt like verse did about him, he wouldn't be starting. The bottom line is they appreciate what he does for the team. Who should be starting, verse? If not Shandon, who? Surely you can humor me with an answer to that one. Mo Taylor doesn't rebound or post up. Cuttino Mobley's shooting percentage isn't that great for a shooting guard. Steve Francis doesn't get a lot of assists. Kelvin Cato doesn't do anything. Why the hell would you single out Shandon? He's the only guy on the team that ****ing doesn't play for the ESPN highlight the next morning. This team is performing beyond anybody who knows the game's expectations. Doesn't their freaking record tell you all you need to know? Lame. Freaking lame. And the freaking most unbelievable thing that has come out of this piece of crap of a thread is that now "Shandon doesn't practice". I thought "speculation was the devil", heypartner? Then what the **** is this "Shandon doesn't work on his game" ****? You totally pulled that one out of your ass. I guess Mo doesn't practice since he doesn't know how to rebound? Mobley and Francis must not practice since their assist numbers are low? And of course verse takes that little heypartner quote and runs with it. He's dying for any shred of legitimacy he can get, and anything that hp says is gospel on this board. That's even lamer than starting this thread. If you think the Rockets' biggest problem right now is Shandon Anderson, you're GARBAGE. This thread is GARBAGE. At least you got the responses you were looking for though, verse. Guess calling a stand-up guy 'garbage' really worked out for ya.
So.....how would I pronounce this topic? GAAAAAR-BAAAAGE? or GARBAGE? ------------------ Note: It was my cowhead. I started the cowhead craze, and my cowhead inspired Mooch to step up and bring us a victory. Thank you for your time.
The Rockets ought to try posting Shandon up for around 10 shots a game. When he gets repeated post up opportunities, he is usually pretty good at capitalizing on them. The problem is, he's had about 5 touches down low all season. If he could just develop that shot a little more, he could be a great player for this team. I still feel good when he is in the game, because he is the best defender on the team (even though that isn't saying much). I say if the Rockets get mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, they ought to try giving Shandon 10 touches down low per game. It couldn't hurt. *By the way Freak, that was an excellent post. The best of this thread. ------------------ Hakeem "The Dream" Olajuwon is the greatest player in the history of basketball. If you disagree, you are not a Rocket fan. [This message has been edited by ZRB (edited March 23, 2001).]
