Scrambling for Votes, Democrats Face Uphill Climb to Pass Healthcare Reform

Doubt it includes macro. Would be nice though.

 

but what are the consequences to the health care system if you decide to go ahead and just eat both? in super-size nation, who subsidizes your unhealthy habits? why, the tax payers of course. why should i be forced to pay for someone else's diabetes, or sclerotic liver, or lung cancer treatment, all of which are largely preventable, merely by changing eating, drinking, or smoking habits?

 

you're already forced.

 

This. High insurance costs are due to the same exact things.

 

until today i was not forced to carry insurance.

 

Do you have health insurance?

 

sure, but that's not the point. i can opt out if i choose, indeed, i get some money from my company of i take that route. under OC, there is no such option, and i pay a penalty, enforced by the IRS, if i don't carry insurance. i am legally bound to subsidize Batman's cigarette habit (as an example). this is a massive change.

 

why would you opt out? you can't afford it?

 

but if you don't have insurance with your high morals and clean living if something happens to you god forbid people are forced to subsidize you.

 

and alcohol use

 

people showing up at the emergency room with no insurance is a major part of the cost structure

 

that's another debate. i'm talking about the mandate to purchase insurance.

 

no its not another debate. people without health insurance get healthcare when they get sick. you can't argue that people can choose to opt out without taking into account that some of those people are bound to show up in an emergancy room.

if we can read people's future's then we can argue it separately.

 

welcome to a better America!

BTW, I believe Bats quit smoking

 

But you wouldn't, would you? Why? Because you need health insurance for emergencies. Just like every single other American. Unless, of course, you can miraculously predict if/when you'll get appendicitis, cancer, or other illness.

I suppose you could be one of those swanky risk takers who are too cool for the establishment.

 

P.S. - There really isn't another option if you have a clause preventing companies from accepting customers with pre-existing conditions. I used to question why we needed to require everyone to have insurance, but it's really just a pre-requisite for making insurance companies accept those who have pre-existing conditions.

Unless you're against that, too?

 

Why don't you opt out, come back and show us the check from your company and then talk?

I don't know about others but with my insurance at work, the smokers pay a higher premium.

You can choose to stay with the insurance you have.

 

sure you can. you're arguing there's a fundamental right to healthcare, and an obligation for all to contribute. i'm saying there's no such right.

 

actually, when i was self-employed, i chose to opt out for a while, and pay for my own care on an as needed basis. it was cheaper than insurance.

but again, this is a separate argument. under OC, i no longer have that option.

 

emergancy rooms are already obligated not to turn away people. do you want to change that?

do you think some guy who isn't wealthy who has opted out and has a heart attack is going to refuse treatment?