Rumors: JG4 refusing to be sixth man and believing him not being properly used

The 3 point era didn't really reach full form till after these guys were either past their prime or retired for 20 years in Jordans case - not really a good comparison

 

Incredible
Didn't know it was that bad
Anal only fans ... i mean analytics only fans would say just plug in a net rating + SG instead of JG and we have an amazing lineup

 

It's not a new concept that we are terrible at shooting thats the main problem. Even taking Alpi out of the equation in todays nba you need to be able to shoot and defend 3's. So you have someone like Jalen who cant do either one of those things. Its a major problem.

 

Jalen doesn’t need to be a good 3pt shooter - he doesn’t need to mimic Curry.. long as we have some decent to above avg shooters around him - then we need him to be above avg from midrange / around rim ( if he can’t do that then he needs to be moved to bench )

2-4 3pt attempts a game max for him

 

A shooting guard who can neither shoot nor guard is not a winning proposition.

 

The guy just doesn't have game
He doesn't actually have any moves aside from a stepback three and trying to drive around people in a straight line to the basket and hoping the help defender isn't there. Am i wrong? That's the main problem, no amount of game planning or personnel around him is going to fix that.

Incredible loss if he doesn't pan out but I don't see any progress in him developing moves??

 

What good is a C who can't protect the rim? What good is a PF who can't rebound? How is the DPOY a poor rebounder? How was a dynasty led by a 3pt shooter?

These are antiquated ideas. I don't know if you're being sarcastic though.

 

Pretty common for an Udoka offense thus far in his career. He was worse than Stevens and Mazzulla there despite having an elite offensive roster. I've said often his handicap is similar to Thibs, Rivers and Lue right now - he can coach/yell an elite defense into existence but on offense he needs 2 players who will tell him to shut up and learn from them (Lebron, CP3, Harden types). If that offense is not humming, the players will tune him out on defense eventually. Celtics' penetration from the wings suffered a lot and Kerr took advantage of that in the Finals, beating Udoka with a less talented team. Jaylen Brown's style is more comparable to Green than Tatum (non-elite handle, not a great passer, jack of all trades type) and his game suffered under Udoka especially early in the season.

You can see clearly all the people who are supposed to be driving into the paint on their own plays are below expectations for this season. FVV is worse than ever, Cam and Amen are getting their points everywhere else which they happen to be good at. Udoka is objectively not good at this and has never demonstrated he's good at this. It's not a coincidence all their handles are looking below expectations in the same season (Amen, Jabari, Cam, Jalen). What sucks for Jalen is that it's his primary shot the same way the 3pter is Cam's primary shot.

Also on Jalen, right at the start of the season when I heard Udoka had told him to slow down and stop attacking the paint. WHY?? lol I still don't understand why he decided to try to turn Jalen Green into James Harden or CP3 suddenly. What we desperately needed this season was to make scoring easy for Sengun and Green - spacing spacing spacing spacing, pace, transition, outlet passes, etc. We should have played like the Pacers but we don't have Carlisle or MDA or Kerr unfortunately. We decided to build everything around Sengun and FVV which worked for a short while but the wheels have fallen off since.

Playing slow and in a crowded halfcourt requires STRENGTH, elite handle and excellent passing. IMO what happened is he was put in a position of failure when he thought someone is showing up who will finally develop him properly. Imagine you were waiting 2 years for the owner and GM to decide to start winning basketball games, and on day 1 of season 3 they're like: the only shots that are available for you are the ones you're worst at making, now work on them. WTF? That's a tanking strategy, that's not a winning strategy if we're trying to make the playins/playoffs. I understand that it's still in Jalen's control to not take stupid shots, but for a person who had to absorb tanking for 2 years to then have a coach who has no idea how to coach him is really really infuriating I'm sure. It kicks the competitiveness out of a player. Three years is a long time to not be put in a position to win. Udoka wanted him to be Manu Ginobili and these two couldn't be more different. I don't think Udoka knows how to develop offensive players except to tell them to share the ball more often. I don't think he quite understood that Jalen needed to work on his strengths right now (because he's not great at those yet) rather than work on his weaknesses. However given the way things played out - Sengun starting hot and Jalen not - can you really blame Udoka? He went with what he knows how to coach and what's working.

At the moment I'm fed up because we are just showcasing Jalen and Udoka's weaknesses. No development or winning is taking place. Someone has to change something and I feel like I'm watching a bunch of stubborn lazy people deciding to just watch things crash and burn - meanwhile, Cam is being taught one of the worst things that there is no meritocracy on Udoka's team. Something we hoped we had seen the last of under Silas. Right now we're losing asset value, games and not developing anyone.

Very polarizing. I still rate him one of the best young coaches in the NBA of course because of the defense and unselfishness he's brought to the team, but this level of offensive coaching will not do when it's time to contend for the title - unless we have a transcendent genius offensive player he can piggy back off of (remember, even Tatum/Brown wasn't enough).

 

Maybe you should go on twitter and say mean things about Udoka so he’ll hop in your DMs. Then you can offer to talk on the phone and give him all this advice you have for him.

 

I would gladly pay couple cents to see that.

 

Why does anyone care what Jalen thinks? We have a championship Calliber coach. The team is freakin paying him to be that kind of coach too. If he can't fit Ime's system or if he refuses to do what Ime needs him to do to be productive or contribute to winning, then just ship him out. We have a potential starting SG, Sf, and a kid who plays 1-3 in Amen itching to prove themselves. If he pouts send him home.
Just get picks for him and call it a day. If eason cam and amen turn out to be what we want, then all we are looking for are back ups anyways.

 

That is a silly question for a rockets fan. Remember James? Dude was pretty great here.

 

I'm so mean for saying he's one of the top young coaches in the league who has not mastered some things yet at an elite level.

The horror!

Edit: I may have misunderstood the tone of your post.

 

I don't hate Jalen. I'll say that much if it means anything to any Jalen Only Fans if there are any still around...

I think he plays hard, I don't think he's lazy, I think he wants to be great blah blah blah...but unfortunately I don't think its working here. I think not only will it be better for the Rockets if we move on but also...better for him. I think he could play better in an offense situated around him driving, constant picks and using his speed, that's clearly not what this team will be though.

My biggest issue thus with Jalen is I feel like he's holding back other prospects on this team that I feel can develop into more. If we're going to have someone out there that can't shoot the three, I'd rather it be Amen. At least Amen doesn't take bad shots. At least Amen is a great defender and rebounder and Amen is simply a better playmaker.

If we want someone out there to spread the floor I'd rather it be Cam.

Also, I'd rather up the usage of Jabari because I do feel like he could very well be a 20/10 guy if not for others on the team taking ill advised shots. Mainly Jalen and Brooks...I'm fine with FVV moments. The Brooks, whatever, Brooks is just a journeyman wing here to provide some veteran leadership...Jalen on the other hand is going to play selfishly and put up his shots because he still feels like he has to prove to the league he belongs.

I do think Jalen has improved defensively and playmaking wise but that his shotmaking has not improved at all...

 

How much would a 'one and done' season playing under Penny Hardaway at Memphis have helped Jalen? I think that team also had Emoni Bates and Jalen Duren on the roster.

 

In the NBA, it doesn't matter how great of a dribbler you are or how fast you are, if the defender knows you aren't an outside threat he will leverage that space to the paint. Its not a coincidence that on nights that his shot is falling, he suddenly looks like he can blow by anyone. In order for Jalen to leverage his speed, he's going to have to work on that shot and put on some weight.

The reason Amen can do this, a player that isn't an outside threat, is simply because his much bigger and stronger. He's amazing at absorbing contact, whereas Jalen is easily thrown off his trajectory with a mild bump. That's why its a lot easier to defend him.

 

Yeah, I'm not going to be as PC...While I appreciate your diplomacy and also that you very well could be right, I will just come out and say I don't believe in Jalen as a top level NBA player no matter what situation he goes to.

He can't shoot, he struggles to finish consistently...His effort on defense has improved, but his ability on that end has not. He still gets targeted in switches by offensive players, he still gets obliterated by screens and physical players just destroy him.

He's still got shaky handles, has not learned to play with pace and his bag is limited. All he knows is step back threes and running full speed to the rim.

I'm not sure where his ceiling is but I'm pretty sure he's no star. I don't even think he's a top three player on a contender type player.

And because of that I completely agree with you that the time and effort they are pouring into him would be better served elsewhere at this point.

 

I’m not really seeing anything alarming with those numbers. 34 of 80 were given up on or not signed to regular NBA deals? 20 of the 34 are second round players not guaranteed that deal. You have to play really well to earn it and it has never happened that often. The remaining 14 could account mostly for later first-rounders who don’t pan out (essentially picks 23-30 over that two year period). These are the Tyty and Josh Christophers of the draft. Obviously, there are exceptions sprinkled in throughout, but if you were to say “picks 23-40 don’t usually make it in the NBA long term” I would simply accept that as an expected truth.

 

I do see better effort from Jalen in defense and rebounding, but that’s also been streaky. I remember his draft profile saying a great ability to finish at the hoop because of his athleticism, and a good shot as well, although streaky. What I see in his 3rd year now is a player who has trouble finishing at the rim, and sure he’s a streaky shooter (there are many in the nba, obviously), but the streak is like 4-5 bad, 1 good. We need at least 50/50, and that’s worst case scenario. It seems as though his reads are still failing him as well.. just not a high basketball iq. Typically doesn’t make the right play at the right time.

I don’t know what these next 25 games have in store for us, but might be worth seeing if he runs a little better with the 2nd unit. Take him out of the lineup, and let him run free. The 2nd unit doesn’t have alpi to work through, so it’s a little more free form. Maybe he can get to a place where he’s a shot of energy and scoring off the bench. Not consistently, but better to have that streaky play coming off the bench than counting on in it the starting lineup.

it’s definitely disappointing to see where he’s at, especially when we spent our #2 pick on him. But hey, at least he’s not Sam Bowie!