Then what is your argument against the trade? Would the Rockets have been better off drafting and keeping Thebo or Gay instead?
Love all the people saying that Gay isn't worth 10 mil, did anyone see what Andrea Bargnani got? Come on now, it's not about how much you personally think he's worth, it's about what GMs around the league think he's worth. Rudy Gay at 10 mil is a steal for any GM, you sign up for that deal even if you don't like his game at all, you can trade him for something you do like.
we will see what happens,the griz are going to make a move this year led by rudy's breakout season, i wouldnt be suprised if they make a move for the 8th spot in the west. we'll see if if andre continues to grow i doubt he will, i would'nt be suprised to see his numbers idle, or drop a little, where as gay, who already averages more ppg than iggy, is primed to push his numbers to superstar status.
yo you serious? you probably didn't watch the finals did you? Shane is a smart player that play within the system, did you see how he up his O game when Yao went out?
Whatever you're taking must be illegal. Rudy Gay goes from 11/4.5/1 to 20/6/2 to 19/6/2. His 2pt/3pt shooting percentage goes from 42/36 to 46/35 to 45/35. This really seems like a guy who is ready to bust out into "superstardom". NOT! Without solely relying on stats and using observation, I just don't see it. He disappears far too often, has never had a consistent "take charge" attitude since joining the NBA and isn't an all-around player because there are too many holes in his game. Even not being well-rounded could be overcome if he was dominant in some phase of the game, like being a deadeye shooter, great creator or great defender. But Rudy Gay is none of these. It's OK to have rose-colored glasses when you like a player. Yours are of the extreme variety. Hope you aren't bothered by the skepticism. Here are stats of a couple of guys more representative of the superstar developmental curve. I won't name them. Neither had a rookie season that blew anyone away, but note the development. Player #1 first 3 seasons: 16/4/4.5 on 46.5%, 24/5/7 on 48% and 27/6/7 on 49.5%. By his 2nd season this guy clearly made things easier for his teammates because he commanded so much attention. Does Rudy Gay? No. Player #2 first 2 seasons: 20/4/2 on 43%/29% and 25/6.5/3 on 48%/42% This player is clearly on the upswing, no question about it. In his rookie season, he was good enough that teams solely focused on denying him in order to beat his team late in (their few) close games. The last 2 months of his rookie season he made giant strides. I know you will disagree, but Rudy Gay's highest upside is Antawn Jamison. I doubt very much his career will be as productive, but if I had to guess a ceiling, that's it right there.
I wouldn't really say 'ceiling', obviously Jamison has a much better offensive game than Gay, Jamison was a great college player, so great that he overshadowed Vince Carter. Jamison's offensive skillset is very polished and Rudy Gay might never get there. The thing about Jamison is that he's a tweener defensively, he's can't guard a good 4 or a good 3 on defense. If you play Jamison at 4 you're going to have problems defensively unless you've got Dwight Howard covering for him on the weak side and on the boards. Playing him at 3 is a bigger problem because there are many quick 3's in the league he can't cover. Rudy Gay doesn't have those problems defensively, forget about all this bulking up, he is a small forward. He's got the length and the quickness to check small forwards. He hasn't shown the willingness to do so, but it's hard to show commitment to defense playing for the Griz. I'm not going to judge Rudy Gay until I see him on a good team, a team committed to winning with a steady coach and a commitment to defense. Gay has the potential to be good in such a setting, we'll see if he ever gets there.
Wonder why he decide to pump up. His post up game almost always ended with a fade-away jumper. He can't really get to the rim due to his handles. He do not defend with his body. I really can't see the reasoning of him bulking up.
When I said ceiling, I meant best case theoretical scenario. Offensively, I know Rudy Gay won't become Antawn Jamison. Defensively, Rudy Gay hasn't shown me any more than Jamison ever did. If Gay ever plays on a good team, his role will diminish. The fact he doesn't shine as a star on the Grizzlies' roster pretty much sums it up for me that he's probably a 3rd fiddle player on a very good team, at best. Alvin Choo, bulking up to 240 lbs is a mistake IMO that he will regret. I don't get it. He needs more skills instead of more strength.
Jamison actually tries hard on defense, he just can't do it, or he's never been on a team that's been able to mask him. I want to see what Gay can do on defense if he really tries, I think he could be a great one on one guy. I don't think he'll be Shane Battier, someone who can quarterback the whole D and instruct other players, but I think he can be better one on one, like as good as Trevor Ariza. A 3rd fiddle on a very good team is Lamar Odom, Ray Allen, Vince Carter/Rashard Lewis, Manu/Jefferson, that's worth more than 10 million a year.
He probably just looked at LBJ and Carmelo and wanted to be strong like them. Most young guys do bulk up, only to go back down when they figure out it's not working, Kobe and Pierce did that too.
There is a difference. Bargnani is a bigman in a league in which bigs are scarce. Bogut got a similar deal while no NBA team would pony up more than $2M for Von Wafer. Rudy is one in a million. Okay not million but there are alot of players capable of putting up 20 ppg while providing nothing else for a ****ty team.
I'm not debating what Rudy Gay should be paid. My point is nothing in his career points to a future superstar status. This is what I was responding to. I never said a 3rd fiddle on a good team was a bad player. None of the guys on your list is a superstar, which proves my point.
more ppg than Iggy. So what? Not like the Grizzlies are going anywhere. And obviously you have not seen the videos of Iguodala passing: <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/aRakW7-uVAo&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/aRakW7-uVAo&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object> <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/SO0kWWm1MhI&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/SO0kWWm1MhI&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object> <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/NM2rwFhrTk0&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/NM2rwFhrTk0&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object> <object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Oh6rRwMbEdo&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Oh6rRwMbEdo&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object>
Sorry about tht. I know the joke is old but damn it I found it funny. Back to Iggy. He is a far superior basketball player to Rudy. He plays tough D, good passer, good ballhandler to complement his offensive game. He is a key (maybe best) player on a good team while Rudy is the second best Grizzly. Yet everybody here seems to be convinced Gay is a superstar while Iggy has peaked. It makes zero sense to me. Von Wafer is capable of putting up 22 PPG on the Grizzlies while bringing nearly nothing else to the table. So what? They are not going anywhere. We got the better end of the Shane/Rudy deal. WE WERE EVEN ABLE TO UNLOAD STROMILE SWIFT'S CONTRACT. Paying Gay $10M would be a huge mistake (which is why he is probably not going to get paid that much)
He's never getting to the first level of wings (Wade, Lebron, Kobe). But he's got a small chance of cracking the 2nd level (Pierce, Melo, VC). Also, I think that VC and Manu are superstars, maybe not for a whole season, but for a series, maybe even the whole playoffs.
All the guys you mentioned can play D, good ballhandlers, good passers, capable of taking over games in crunch time and are winners. Good allaround basketball players.
I don't think Gay will ever be a superstar type, but i think he can be a guy who plays in a couple of all star games. The misconception on this board is that its easy to put up points on a bad team which is false. He will be a guy that will always get 16-20ppg and be around mid 40's which is a good player. I think 240 is a bit much, but as long as its core power and retain his explosion, its cool. His body , much like odom's looks like it can hold it anyway. I'm not going to get into the whole trade thing again.
