Riet, you obviously have no idea what politically correct means. Does it not mean to do or say whatever the majority want you to? If that was the case I would be praising Yao for all he has done in a failed season. I choose not to and give an opinion that is not politically correct on this message board and get flamed and the best you can come up with is that I am a racist, even though neither of the guys in this argument are my race. You say I bash Yao, but not his play. Have I ever said I do not like Yao the man? NO, don't know him. Have I ever said I do not like his game and don't think it fits our needs? Yes. Have I ever said I like Amare the man? NO, don't know him either. Have I ever said I like his game and it fits our teams needs more than Yao? Yes. Have I ever said Yao or LBJ was a better fit for our team or a better prospect overall? YES. And do you think I really care what you or anyone else on this board thinks about me or my opinion? If I was so bad in my other post, why would I not be the same here? Who am I supposed to be scared of in this thread? Why would it be suicide for me to give the same opinion I always gave and still am giving here? So I guess by your way of thinking, if you are something other than asian and you do not think Yao should have started over Shaq in the allstar game and Amare and LBJ have more potential than Yao, you are a racist in your book? I am sorry brother if that is the way you see the world. I think you can have an opinion and not be a racist at the same time. I know this just sounds crazy and is a scary concept, But dang, just think about the possibilities.
There was this Nigerian center who turned out pretty good, after all. T-man, they're -all- taken for potential. The ones that don't improve, they have names like Elton Brand. As far as there being "no doubt", well hindsight is 100% after all. My point was simple, and of course you missed it. *IF* Yao makes the kinds of improvements that are typical of a #1 player (i.e. a 7-10 ppg improvement, with minor improvements in ancillary stats), then he'll do just fine. You've done nothing to disprove this suggestion. Instead, you flat out ignore it. Dave.
T-man has never answered the "impact" and "efficiency" arguments, because he can't. You have similar quantitative numbers. If you do it more efficiently (look at their fg and ft % and their asst/to ratio) and against tougher opposition (double and triple team WITHOUT the ball), you are obviously better. Case closed.
Sometimes Yao make me mad when he is not agressive. Or when he "lets" defenders beat him up. I get angry for Yao not fighting back. I've bashed him a few times this year after those type of games. It's good to know that I wasn't the only one that saw him being passive (Rice and Mobley said a few things). But, as a rookie, I try to give him slack. As time goes on, this wont be the case. He'll be expected to improve.
I agree and Ive bashed him too. However, out of your 2,425 posts, how many have you dedicated just to bash 1 player. That's what Im talking about.
Easy, I did address the efficiency thing about 7 post before yours. I don't know how to do the quote thing, so I will do it again. The differrence between .498 and .472 is about 1 shot out of 50, which means if they both took 50 shots, Yao would make 25 and Amare would make 24. Next, you talk about ast/to ratio. Yao's is 1.67/2.11 and Amare's is .95/2.30. Again, not that big a differrence, roughly an extra 3/4 of an assist per TO. And yes right now Yao is a much better free throw shooter, but Amare was right out of highschool and had respectable numbers from the line. Next, the double/ triple team thing. This is the age of the zone deffense and all post players are ganged up on. So your whole more efficient argument comes down to 1 shot out of 50, 3/4 of an assist and a better freethrow shooter. This is supposed to be "case closed", even though Amare helped get his team over the hump and into the playoff's while we watch? Dw, You know what I meant when I was talking about taken for potential. Obviously, they all have the potential to get better. Olowakandi, and Brown were taken for potential for example. Duncan, Brand were impact players for example. And if Yao was putting up Brand's numbers, regardless of how much they have improved, we would not be having this conversation. And this "Nigerian center" was not taken for potential. He was an impact player. And I am seeing your point that *IF* Yao makes the improvements others have made, he will be fine. But, I just in my opinion don't see him making them for the reason's I pointed out. He has not shown the drive, passion, or desire to be the best and dominate. He is passive, not aggressive. All superstars go through their struggles early and are arrogant, cocky, whatever you want to say about them, but they still demand the ball. Kobe in his rookie season throwing up airballs in crunch time during the playoff's, yet stepping right back up and throwing another airball the next time down, instead of backing away from the shot or the pressure for example
Anyways...yeah AMARE LIKE PLAYS IN GARBAGE TIME. He never is doubleteamed. He has never been the focus of other team's defenses. Other people have been motivated to stop Yao and dunk on him. Man...Sean Deveney. He said at first...he thought it was Yao...but the last month..he decided that it should be Amare. Amare finished better. WTF. That's cuz we are letting Cato play while Amare is still playing like 35 minutes. Yao is resting. If we gave Yao the ball...then he would be scoring much more. It should be Yao.
T-man, you're a suns fan right? I mean, you try to find any reason to defend Amare but you provide no reasons to defend Yao under similar circumstances, why is that? Cmon, "Yao is a better FT shooter than Amare but, but Amare is straight out of High school.." How does that rational thought work? Should we just say..."Oh he's straight out of HS, lets cut him some slack and forget about the FT shooting this time." Why don't you say that "Yao's straight out of China whose competition is much lower than the US, so you can understand if he's not as strong or aggressive as those who have lived here." Also, I believe the 2 allstars and former MVP candidate that comes off of their bench had MUCH more to do with the suns making the playoffs than their rookie who shoots 47% on dunks and only had good games when the team lost...don't you?
I can tell that many of you never actually watched Amare. Saying things like "he doesnt get double teamed", "he only plays in garbage minutes", and so on is so far off base. Amare has been just as vital to the Suns as Yao was to the Rockets...if not more. If there was ever a time to have a co-ROY, this would be it. And regarding Vlade's quote is the only time I have heard any player or a coach outside of Houston take Yao over Amare. On Amare, "He's the rookie of the year and truthfully, I don't think it's close" - Kobe Bryant . On facing Amare in the playoffs, "If he was going to be awed, he would have been awed already. He’s the Rookie of the Year and he adds a lot to the franchise." - Greg Popavich . On Amare, Auburn Hills, Mich.- Unofficial most-valuable-player and rookie-of-the-year polls were held among the Cavaliers prior to last night's game. And if these awards were up to the Cavs, Phoenix forward Amare Stoudemire would be rookie of the year in a landslide... Miami's Caron Butler received two votes for rookie of the year and Houston's Yao Ming was shut out. Stoudemire was the easy winner among the Cavs. Stoudemire leads all rookies in rebounding at 8.9 and he is averaging 13 points a game. He also has been vital in the Suns' making the playoffs. "He's had a heck of a year," said Cavs rookie Carlos Boozer. "Amare's been so dominant. Caron and Yao will give him a run for rookie of the year, but Stoudemire's had the best season among rookies." . On the future, “I’ve seen the future of the NBA and his name is Amare Stoudemire." - Shaq . On Amare, “Stoudemire is my pick for rookie of the year. Not only has he surprised us all, he’s turned around the entire spirit of that team. He gives Phoenix their swagger and toughness. Coming from someone so young, that’s rare.” - Doc Rivers
Originally posted by Charles V I can tell that many of you never actually watched Amare. Saying things like "he doesnt get double teamed", "he only plays in garbage minutes", and so on is so far off base. Amare has been just as vital to the Suns as Yao was to the Rockets...if not more. If there was ever a time to have a co-ROY, this would be it. And regarding Vlade's quote is the only time I have heard any player or a coach outside of Houston take Yao over Amare. On Amare, "He's the rookie of the year and truthfully, I don't think it's close" - Kobe Bryant Hmm, Yao had much better games against the Lakers(and shaq) than Amare did, yet Kobe chooses the rookie who happens to come straight out of HS much like himself...biased? perhaps. . On facing Amare in the playoffs, "If he was going to be awed, he would have been awed already. He’s the Rookie of the Year and he adds a lot to the franchise." - Greg Popavich adds a lot to the franchise? I'm thinking their 2 all-stars and former MVP candidate add a lot more than amare. . On Amare, Auburn Hills, Mich.- Unofficial most-valuable-player and rookie-of-the-year polls were held among the Cavaliers prior to last night's game. And if these awards were up to the Cavs, Phoenix forward Amare Stoudemire would be rookie of the year in a landslide... Miami's Caron Butler received two votes for rookie of the year and Houston's Yao Ming was shut out. Stoudemire was the easy winner among the Cavs. Stoudemire leads all rookies in rebounding at 8.9 and he is averaging 13 points a game. He also has been vital in the Suns' making the playoffs. "He's had a heck of a year," said Cavs rookie Carlos Boozer. "Amare's been so dominant. Caron and Yao will give him a run for rookie of the year, but Stoudemire's had the best season among rookies." no votes for Yao as rookie of the year in this poll? Yeah, its legit... . On the future, “I’ve seen the future of the NBA and his name is Amare Stoudemire." - Shaq Wow, I guess he didn't want to praise the guy that blocked him 5 times in one game... . On Amare, “Stoudemire is my pick for rookie of the year. Not only has he surprised us all, he’s turned around the entire spirit of that team. He gives Phoenix their swagger and toughness. Coming from someone so young, that’s rare.” - Doc Rivers Why don't you find the quote about Doc Rivers talking about Yao? In fact, why don't you find ANY quotes about anyone talking about Yao? I guess you figured they don't exist leaving Amare as the Default ROY or something right.
Trust me, there was no doubt in my mind that you wouldnt agree with me. Last year Marion and Marbury were healthy all season long, and where did the Suns end up? Counting ping pong balls. And most people thought they would be doing it again this season. Amare added an element that hasnt been seen in Phoenix since Barkley. Nobody, I mean nobody picked the Suns to do well this season. Had they known that Amare would be such a factor, they may have given the Suns a better shot. I'm not going to bash Yao. He is solid. He just isnt my pick for ROY.
trust me, suns only has F O U R more wins this season. and everyone knows suns entered the playoff because of penny hardaway's performance at the end 6 games. but after all, your right, it's YOUR pick. you can pick anyone without any reason, if you know what I mean.
I don't understand your reasoning. Yao is obviously more efficient than Amare and then you try to downplay the point by saying the difference is not that big. yet you repeated again and again that the Suns won only ONE game more than us while just about everybody agrees that Marbury, not Amare, is the main reason the suns are in the playoff. Amare did nothing special during suns' run for the playoff. it's Marbury, not Amare, who lifted his game and got his team over the hump. so your argument Amare deserves ROY more because the suns made the playoff is not valid.
take Yao over Amare for what? Vlade's comment is valid. Amare is not suns' key player while Yao is Rox's key player. Rox's half court offense runs through Yao. you cant deny that. i don't know how you can argue that Amare has been just as vital to the Suns as Yao was to the Rockets.
