I live in Columbus, OH also and have watched Ken Johnson progress so much the last few years. His defensive ability is very good. His offense does need some work but he would be a vast improvement over Cato (I know, I know.. EVERYONE is a vast improvement over Kelvin).He seems to be a hard worker and is always improving. He would be a great pickup for us. ------------------ "I may be mistaken, but I'm never wrong" -Barkley
thx 4chuckie Can you add to your analysis for me? Do you recall Johnson getting into foul trouble much? One of the things I always look for in a shotblocker is when he jumps in relation to the shooter. You say his timing is good. That is hard for me guage how well it translates to the NBA. Can you provide a further breakdown of the timing? When does he jump? Does he get many blocks jumping after the shooter, or does he always need to time his jump with the shooter. The former method is rarely seen in Cato. Too much of the later leaves the blocker vulnerable to headfakes (that is, when his timing was a little off, he was going for the sportscenter bleacher swat, or he was too far away so needed to jump earlier to meant the ball...oops, headfake,,,foul). Foul trouble is an statistical indication of timing being dependent on jumping early. Great blockers can jump after the shooter, and instinctively know how to cover ground with their feet so they remain within striking distance without have to jump into a headfake to get to the shooter. Any further breakdown you have in the context of analyzing Cato-esque vulnerability to headfakes is MUCH appreciated. [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited May 24, 2001).]
I don't think Cato is that bad of a player. I think its more of his desire rather than his ability. Because a year ago he blocked Shaq's shot 3 times and had 18pts in that game. ------------------ President of the Steve Francis, Jamal Crawford,Larry Hughes, and Charles Woodson fan club.
Johnson is also a winner. I recognize that "winner" is a very subjective term, but consider this: after Scoonie Penn graduated and Michael Redd left school early, Ohio State was expected to finish anywhere from 7th to 10th in the Big Ten. Instead, OSU went 20-11, finished third in the Big Ten, and beat co-champions Michigan State and Illinois once each. KJ was the major reason OSU was so competitive last year. I am not saying he's anything other than a 10-pt 5-rebound guy in the NBA, but it seems obvious that our focus is in the backcourt with Cat and Stevie. Throw in Webber and dang it, you don't need anything from your 5 other than defense and shot-blocking. And that's what KJ did for Ohio State. Note: I have been an Ohio State fan since I was old enough to say "Michigan sucks!", so I know a bit about Buckeye basketball. ------------------ "If you make someone think they are thinking, they will love you. If you really make them think, they will hate you."--Don Marquis [This message has been edited by BrianKagy (edited May 24, 2001).]
I don't think Cato is that bad of a player. I think its more of his desire rather than his ability. Because a year ago he blocked Shaq's shot 3 times and had 18pts in that game. Wow, he had a good game. Jason Collier helped team with Dream to hold Shaq to 14 points and 5 rebounds this year, and scored 10 points in 15 minutes. I sure don't see you praising him. It doesn't matter if a player has the physique and ability of Tim Duncan; if he has the heart of Kelvin Cato, I'll take Ken Johnson over him anyday, no matter what his ability may be. Does it really matter what someone's ability is when they don't have the desire to achieve it? ------------------ President of the Mo Taylor and Jason Collier fan club! Draftsource.net-- the premier source for draft info. Profiles, rankings, mock drafts, and more!
BrianKagy, Similar thoughts...... Previously in the string I mentioned the possibility of the Rocks looking at Bradley and K Johnson to see how they play together. In fact, isn't it interesting that the Rocks are looking at two big players at a time. Is this a hint on their draft strategy? Think about it.... They know that with one of their picks they will get a serviceable if not high quality SF (Johnson, Jefferson, Wallace, etc.) and with the other two (if they receive Orlando's pick) they will grab quality front line help: One for offense/rebounds, the other for defense/rebounds. This really makes sense if you think about it. It would be a stellar draft if we walked away with Bradley, Jefferson and K. Johnson. This would make some looser players that shall remain nameless expendable for future considerations or one hit wonders that would releive cap room in a year or so. Thoughts????? ROCKET!!! ------------------ [This message has been edited by ROCKET!!! (edited May 24, 2001).]
I'm also in Columbus and have seen extensive KJ play... a few random thoughts, some already posted. - Johnson does not get into foul trouble. He is under control on D - His O game has a long way to go. Yes, he has improved but that is not saying much. He has no proven shot. - Johnson needs to bulk up. - He is always active and in good shape. - His shotblocking is awsome, obviously. His timing, aggressiveness, quickness, and explosion are for real. Has a real nose for the ball - No problems with his rebounding, IMO. My .02 ------------------ "UNBEATABLE"
HP- Sure here is what I can tell you, Johnson doesn't fall for many headfakes. He seems to have the ability to wait for the shooter to jump and jumps quicker than them. Maybe it's more that he is taller than most other college centers but he doesn't bite on many fakes. He seemed to have periods where he would getinto foul trouble, but it wasn't a consistent problem. At one point the OSU coaches after a foul plagued game tried to change his approach and he had a couple bad games where he was trying to stay out of foul trouble and looked very bad. They took away his aggressiveness. So to answer that part he did have SOME foul problems but it wasn't a consistent problem. Other good news is even though he is a shot blocker he doesn't get beat on the boards as much as many shot blockers do. Some guys seem to forget everything, everytime to get blocks and leave their man uncovered leaving easy put backs. KJ doesn't try to block everything. He seemed to know when he had a good opportunity to help out with a block and when to stay at home. He will have a transition to the NBA playing against bigger guys, but his timing is good (if not great) and he is willing to learn, and hopefully will get bigger and stronger.
If what Clutch reports about not getting the #18 pick is true then I sincerely believe we should hold our pick and fill two desperate needs: Center and SF. Jefferson K. Johnson My thoughts are this: We need a great SF more than a GREAT Center. This is primarily due to the zone. A Center that has great defense is more important than a Center with great O! However, because the 3 is on the perimeter, we need a SF that can create their own shot, play off the dribble and slash to the hoop. In this case Jefferson is about as good as it gets in this draft or any other. Thoughts????? ROCKET!!! ------------------
If the Rockets do receive the 18th pick from Orlando the odds of that pick going to Vancouver via trade are very high. If the Rockets do hold on to the 22nd pick and Ken Johnson is still on the board then by all means the Rocks should take him! ------------------ take it one day at a time
aelliott, cato is taller, too, so I'd expect better numbers in college. If we want to compare stats, let's also compare them to two people we would love to have here who were scouted almost identically to Johnson, Bo Outlaw and Theo Ratliff. Bo's last college year ------------------- 16.2 ppg 10 rbg 3.8 bpg not drafted Theo's last college year ------------------- 14.4 ppg 7.5 rpg 5.1 bpg drafted 18th I'd take a slightly lessor Theo any day at that pick. And I'd take Bo's NBA contributions at a slightly lessor pick. [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited May 25, 2001).]
aelliott, cato is taller, too, so I'd expect better numbers in college Huh? Both are 6'11". If we want to compare stats, let's also compare them to two people we would love to have here who were scouted almost identically to Johnson, Bo Outlaw and Theo Ratliff. You're comparing apples to oranges here. Johnson is a center and Outlaw and Ratliff were not. Also, Johnson doesn't have the explosiveness of Outlaw or Ratliff. ------------------
nevermind me...I've always been wrong about Cato. I thought Cato was a 7'er, and Dream was 6'11". I'm confused, and hasn't Outlaw lost an inch since leaving UofH? I don't know about anyone else, but I'm just hoping aelliott is the one comparing apples to oranges...don't be so pessimmistic by comparing him to Cato. Hey, I'm just offering up historical stats and analysis of two nationally recognized, defensively dominating NCAA PF/Cs like Johnson who most of us hope Johnson strives towards rather than being like Cato. They are the first two who came to mind. I'm not trying to throw oranges into your apple orchid. seriously, I don't know anything about college players, but isn't Johnson marked as a PF mainly, until he bulks up, just like Ratliff? Plus, Not Chaney and 4Chuckie has me thinking he does have the quickness and explosion of Ratliff. oooohhhhhhmmmmmm oooohhhhhhmmmmmm think positive thoughts about Johnson oooohhhhhhmmmmmm oooohhhhhhmmmmmm [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited May 25, 2001).]
If we can't justify taking a big man at #13, Ken Johnson would be a very solid pick at 18 or 22 IMO. He's probably the 2nd best known shot blocking commodity in the draft outside of Eddie Griffin (unknowns=HSers), and has really worked on his offensive game. Johnson challenges a lot of shots, which contributes to his seemingly low rebounding numbers. He does a good job of making sure his man can't go backdoor for the offensive board. Why would he be better than Cato? Think about Cato this way-would you care so much if he was getting paid 1 mill per year? If Cato was getting paid 1 mill per year, don't you think he'd work a little harder (like old preseason)? Cato's not producing because he's simply content, or malcontent, depending on your perspective. I think Johnson also gets bonus Rudy points for being a 5 year college player. ------------------ "That's been a lifelong dream of mine." -Vince Carter, after laying it in on a breakaway, much to the Vancouver crowd's displeasure. [This message has been edited by NIKEstrad (edited May 25, 2001).]
Seems like Columbus Ohio is pretty well represented on this board! I think most of us Buckeyes agree KJ is a winner and genuinely like KJ and we all recognioze that he isn't going to be a super-star but can be a very solid, good defensive player. Muck Fichigan! Sorry couldn't resist too many Buckeyes around to not say it!
How close are these stats? Cato - Iowa State '96-'97 11.3ppg, 8.4reb, 4.2blk Johnson - OSU - '00-'01 12.5ppg, 7.3reb, 4.0 blk. Kind of interesting in that people want Johnson to replace Cato and provide more shot blocking and rebounding, when Cato's numbers in both those categories were actually better than Johnson's. ------------------
Teh differnce is attitude. Cato was happy to get into the NBA and sign a contract. I really don't think KJ is like that. He is a good kid who works hard and wants to improve. Possibly even more important is KJ was used to being the 3rd wheel offensively and to make his mark defensively when he played with Scoonie & M. Redd, which would be a similar situation to here in H-town. Also all of KJ's teammates like the guy so he won't be a distraction and won't complain about touches offensively.
Here is what you need to know if you draft Ken Johnson. 1) First class kid. He petitioned the NCAA for a fifth year because he lost his first year of eligibility due to grades related to a learning disorder (dyslexia). Could not ask for a better person. 2) Still very raw as a player. Only started playing basketball I think as a senior in High school. With a good big man coach and some challenges (get him to houston to run with the boys during the summer), I think his game has a lot of room to grow. 3) Defensively, he is the best shotblocker in the college game the last two years. His numbers were down a little last year because he completely changed several team's game plans. They looked more scared than Antonio Davis did going against Mutumbo in the playoffs. His shotblocking is instinctive and he doesn't have much trouble with head fakes. Rebounding is solid, but not outstanding. I think he could improve here. Could get away playing either C or PF, but might have to bulk up to play C longterm. 4) Foul trouble was not an issue early on, but was later in the year late in the big ten season. But I don't recall many of those fouls being on shot block attempts. So I don't think he will have foul problems in the pros. 5) Offensively, he has some room for improvement. But he did develop a baby hook that was very effective this year. And in the five or six buckeye games I watched, he always was very effective offensively. For whatever reason, Ohio State did not get him the ball effectively this year. I don't know why, because he seemed to do OK with it once he had it. Good hands, but not a very good passer. I think with some work, there is some potential here. 6) One knock on Ken is that he was not mean enough. I would compare him to the common view of David Robinson in that view. In fact, David Robinson with half the offense is probably the best comparison you will find for Ken Johnson. 7) I have never seen or heard anyone in five years say a bad thing about Ken Johnson other than he wasn't aggressive or mean enough. All in all, I think he would fit exceptionally well with this team (especially if they get Webber and have to get enough opportunities for him, Mobley and Francis), would be a guy the city of houston would be proud to root for, and would be top 20 in the NBA defensively the day he stepped on the court for the first time. Nice pick at 18 or 22. ------------------
thx, BuckeyeRocketFan...follow-up question. No one's said much about ambidextrous. Has he been blocking with both hands. Rebounding with both hands. Making offensive moves with both hands. Also, has anyone ever questioned the legitimacy of his 6'11 measurement? thx
